sly1

I saw this posted on a Porsche Board. Any comments?

It is a CRIME that such a potentially great car has two PLASTIC leaf springs as it's main suspension components when GM sells it to the public and coil springs over shocks when they race it.

There is a reason the price is only $65,800 while a Viper is $85,000 for example... it's called cutting corners where the public would never think to look... and the car magazines, fearing the loss of GM's ad revenue, never mention.

Plastic flipping leaf springs? Pure Schlock.

agentf1

For 85,000 the Viper sure does not handle any better?

Z28nbr1fan

Next, they will be making fun of pushrod engines......

rgregory

A spring is a spring regardless of what material. The fact that it is low on the frame and lightweight is a bonus. I have heard things in the past that a transverse spring can transmit some of the forces from one wheel to the other but I don't know. Either way you have a swaybar that transmits the force of one wheels movement to the other so I don't see it as an issue if it is true.

Just like I saw someone write (a great line in my opinion) in another post a while back "If GM made a car as fast as a Mclaren F1 for the price of a Cavalier people would find something to complain about it"

robvuk

The reason they use coilovers for racing is the adjustability for that extra edge at the track. 99% of all Corvette owners will never see a track. Why make them all pay for something they don't need or would ever use, or for that matter, know HOW to use. It will not affect their performance or enjoyment of the car in the least. Even with the "fixed" spring rates of the leafs, its funny that the Vette still outhandles most of the competition with coilovers.

PeterK

I think they do! I've seen some vipers doing quite well even on the AutoX. Roadracing - is where vipers live.

Fulton 1

The springs are composite and if you've ever weighed a set of 4 standard coilovers you know how heavy they can be. With the transverse composite leaf spring you get the lighter weight and a lower cg at the cost of some adjustability. Seems like a fair trade to me considering car's target usage and audience.

PeterK

That would be too simple.
BMWs have very intricate multi-link suspension setups to have that "sure-planted" feel for the road and provide better handling and comfort.

The springs that GM use are fairly unique - I think the last production car that used them was either Fort T or a car from some italian maker in 1950s. Since then, everybody moved to multilink setups.

I think the main reason GM uses them - is the same as Golf car makers - costs!

Also, coils in modern sports cars have special winding that makes their response non-linear - this way they can account for both comfort and speed.

PeterK

And leaf springs sure to transmit the force from one wheel to another - just like the sway bars!
http://web.telia.com/~u60113742/misc...ass_spring.gif

robvuk

The McPherson strut style coilover that you get on a M3 is a far cry from real coilovers. That "sure-planted" system does NOT work well for cars in hard cornering situations without huge compensations in swaybars and shock valving. Trade-offs. When an M3 leans into a corner, what happens to the camber? It leans with the car and any camber adjustments made are then lost. When the Corvette leans into a hard corner, the long arm short arm suspension maintains its camber. (within limits).

Also, leaf springs are also tunable to have non-linear response as well. People can criticize the suspension all they want but it works. Who cares how it's done? Sometimes the simplest things are done best by simple mechanisms. Too bad Rube Goldberg didn't design cars, he would have been a big hit in Europe. Just like the old normally aspirated pushrod engines too.

barondw

I do DEs at Watkins Glen each year. The Prosche CLub of America (PCA) is there the week-end before our Monday Event. Ask them why they don't want Z06s on the track with them?

If I paid $ 140,000 for a Porsche and a Z06 could be driven as quick or quicker, by an equally skilled driver, why would I want it or a Subuaru STI on the track at the same time?

It comes down to pride of make and internal justification for spending the money. Why get worried about what they say, some of us say the same type of thing about their cars.

SWCDuke

... The Corvette leaf springs are not used as suspension locating elements as they were on vintage Fords.

The Corvette has SLA suspension architecture on both ends - just like F1, IRL, and Champ Cars.

Sheesh! I just can't believe these ... posts about the Corvette's springs. They're light, package very effeciently leaving more room for the shocks, have grearter fatigue life, and don't corrode.

Maybe someday the rest of the auto industy will catch up; and maybe someday ... (those) who knock the Corvette's springs will get educated and understand, but I doubt it.

Duke

sly1

Personally I find it kind of funny. If someone paid a premium for a product and found out that he could get a superior product folr less money, how would he respond. More than likely he would become defensive and find fault with the lower priced product.

The only thing that really pisses me off is the superior attitude of some of the owners of German cars when they say that they will never buy an American car. The only wish I have for these Aholes is that they suffer the same fate that they are wishing on GM employees which is essentially the unemployment line.

silverarrow

hi, i am in complete agreement with you the virtues that the fiberglas fiber oriented springs posess are unknown to most, the long trouble free life is another virtue, the fiberglass springs in the car outlast all the steel coils over time and they most certainly weigh a lot less another virtue, the uneducated can talk but it is just that talk without bothering to investigate the real facts, thanks. ps i love my zo6 (02) bang for buck unbelievable period.

AU N EGL

I did a DE last Fall at VIR. Saturday afer the days events were finihsed, two guys who race Porsches RSRs. That is the Porsche GT3 cup car or I think it is the 997. came up to me and asked what I had in my vette that made it go so damn fast?? These guys had more experience then I did and could go somewhat faster in the corners, but not the straights nor brake any sooner.

They mentioned to me that Seeing a Yellow Corvette come up behind them was intimidating. I said Thank you very much.

Next they asked, " So what does it take to get a ZO6 ready for the track?" Four of all said, " Pick it up from the dealer."

petefias

The leaf spring can be made to be adjustable just as easy as coil-overs. People even sell longer bolts to extend the range of adjustability on the rear of a C4.

LTC Z06

A spring is a spring, no matter it's shape or material. Would you be more happy with a torsion bar spring, oh wait, most cars have this too; it's called an anti-roll bar.

The only thing coil overs offer compared to the vette suspension is some more adjust ability. The C5/6 suspension is plenty adjustable for most street and track day drivers.

LTC Z06

Other than coil-overs the C4/5/6 suspensions are like Ferrari and other "super" cars, unequal length A arms.


Ok, I should have read all the post before responding, but I'm tired of the push-rod/leaf-spring post. The style of spring and the mechanism for opening valves does not make a vehicle high or low tech. Reading is fundamental.

E55er

and there are balsa wood floors too! wood floors not seen since what?, model t??? lighter is better, thats it. if they are willing to warranty it im willing to buy it.

LTC Z06

So, how do you feel about the answers to your question?