I spoke with Andy the other night. A great guy, I would have to guess his customer service is very good. I have an LS3 A6 I am looking to put down around 625rwhp. He told me that he was not a big fan of meth. This has me feeling because everyone else likes it. So I would like to hear more feedback about that.

Would the A&A kit with the american racing headers and meth get me close two 625rwhp? Not wanting to change cam just yet.If this will not do the trick then what would, without having the engien afart.

For the ones that will say this has been beeten to death . No reply is nessary.

Many of you have alot of great opinions and experiance I would like very much to hear from you.

 

I think many forced induction people worry that if something goes wrong with the meth delivery the motor is at serious risk. The same could be said for a bad batch of gas.

San

 

Meth as a power adder is not a good idea. Meth as a safety won't hurt you. A&A knows their $hit. If you want a nice, streetable, scary fast car then listen to them. If not... go somewhere else.

 

ECS Paxton 615/595

 

IMO, meth is a necessity for safe, high horsepower on a boosted car. IAT's are in check and you will never see detonation. You won't make over 625 without meth. With meth, yes.

Jason

 

You surely can make 625 without meth but IMO you will be on the edge, literally.

There is little reason not to use meth as a safety measure and it can be tuned such that it is both a power adder and for safety.

 

Better not tell that to the thousands of people who've done it

 

Not everyone likes it. I finally gave in and installed it on my car, but I hated it before I did it and I hate it now that I have it. I run Meth injection because I could not realize my power goals with the setup I've got right now without it. And to that effect it does perform; my IATs are below ambient and the car pulls strong even on the hottest days. When all is said and done, it IS a cheap way to make more power, and when it is working (big caveat here) it does protect your engine and allow a safer tune than would otherwise be possible on pump gas alone. What is why "everyone else likes it", as you said. It is also possible to tune for it so that when the system fails (not IF. When: Those pumps running pure meth like to go about every other year or so) the engine doesn't blow up, and that I have seen first hand before.

But it is also more crap to worry about and more crap to break. You need to be constantly aware of wether the system is working or not, how much methanol you have left, and make sure it is always topped off. I ran out in the middle of nowhere, 700 miles from home, and had to drive the car off boost untill I could find a gas station that would sell me 10 bottles of "HEET" water remover. Further south, that product is not available, so you'd be running around looking for a race track that carries it, or having to drive your car back home.

Its a pain in the butt and if there was any way I could do away with it and still make the power I make now, safely. I would. On the grand scheme of things if all you want is that 625RWHP and don't care about having the most competitive car on the drag strip, get yourself a nice blower cam, some headers and a good tune and you will be able to make that power without it, and be happy. It will lose a lot more power on hot days and it won't make as much power as it could, but you won't have to worry about meth running out, pumps failing, leaks springing up, nozzles getting blocked, meth controllers failing, etc etc...

Also, doesn't Andy's personal car makes just shy of 700RWHP with no methanol injaction and crappy California 91 octane fuel?

 

LS3 A6 625rwhp...a pretty tall order for an otherwise bone stock car. What version of the A&A head unit were you planning on using?

 

Not true. I made 654/595 on an LS2 at 11psi no meth with a cam, exhaust, headers and drove the hell out of it for many miles. I now make 770/667 on 9psi on my LS7 with meth and 750 without. Meth is great for safety as long as you tune the car to be safe if there is no meth.Iit's all in the tune and as powerlabs said many people have done it safely.

 

His Z06 makes 736rwhp with crappy 91, no meth. I don't remember what his 08 LS3 made before the motor was forged.

 

Stock LS7 Steve, and is raced or just dyno'd? If raced, what has it ran?

 

Forged pistons, stock crank and rods, T-Trim, fuel system. No drag times.

 

I'm just saying without a cam that is a tall order...and on the ragged edge if you do. If it was easy, your previous build would have made 625 and not 597...with meth you could have added a pound or two of boost and made 625. Agree?

 

Agreed on all accounts, except I think my previous build would have picked up more than just 25hp from boost AND meth.
I think my previous build with a 3.6" pulley would hit 625WHP. I think it would hit that number with a cam too, possibly without the added boost. It would probably do it reasonably safely.

I think blower + a mild blower cam (ZR-1 cam is a good choice) + Headers, specially on an LS3 (bigger engine) can be reasonably reliable at that power level, or even a bit beyond, WITHOUT meth.

 

I think the head he quoted me was the standard. I was not wanting to go with a cam because I plan to do an HPDE event now and then and I am afraid a cam would add to much heat.

Then again I am not sure if HPDE will allow meth on the track????????

 

I guess I should add that I am doing all this expecting that I will need to rebuild the trans someday. That does not bother me. Even if I need to change pistons and other parts, I am ok with that. Having my car in the shop two times a year I can live with. If I am taking it to the shop once a month then I will not be happy.

 

I am a meth proponent no doubt. Without it, on pump gas it's hard to reliably crack 600 RWHP without lots of cubes.

To throw a wrench in it though, as E85 becomes more prevalent I think we'll see more and more guys throwing in a set of 80# injectors rather than 60#ers, running E85 and able to make the same boost/timing/power levels that us meth sprayers are.

 

The presence of an aftermarket cam in your engine has very little to do with how hot it will run. If that is your only reason to not add a cam then you should really reconsider.

Having a blower will make your car run hotter no matter what. A larger radiator (DeWitts is the best one out there) and mindful driving will allow many enjoyable laps provided it isn't a really hot day.
I don't see why the track would have an issue with a meth tank either.

 

Coolhand,
I would listen to Powerlabs. I would say he knows more than most because he's done almost everything wrong and has learned from it. I very much value Powerlabs input. Definitely not knocking PL, just for the record. Btw, Sam, Do you remember I backed you a few times during previous discussions with Dog Ring from ECS?