Is Tuning Required ?
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Instructor
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Is Tuning Required ?
I know this topic has been touched on before ,but I did not get a clear understanding. Is tuning necessary if I run with K&N air filters? Will I run rich and loss power if I do not get a tune? Who is using K&N's #33-2136?
Thanks in advance!
Thanks in advance!
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 7,695
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From: Imperial Beach CA
Originally Posted by spectra6.0
I know this topic has been touched on before ,but I did not get a clear understanding. Is tuning necessary if I run with K&N air filters? Will I run rich and loss power if I do not get a tune? Who is using K&N's #33-2136?
Thanks in advance!
Thanks in advance!
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Oct 2004
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Originally Posted by jimman
I am and will be getting tune later this week.
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2004
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From: stafford country, va. Avatar: Me on turn 3 @ Bristol (The World's Fastest Half-Mile)
Originally Posted by spectra6.0
Our vettes need tuning just because I changed the the air filters? That is kind of hard to believe GM has it set up that way.
it might idle richer, but then again the computer should adjust for that.
with added airflow it SHOULD increase the amount of fuel depending upon the airflow into the engine. back in the carb. days that's what we would do but we didn't have the use of the computer and all them sensors. we would increase the jets in the carb. until we matched the fuel to the airflow for a specific range. that's why when you pull up behind some rods the fuel vapors burn your eyes. when the exhaust burns your eyes you are running too rich for that airlfow rate. more air = more fuel, more fuel = requirement for more air.
at least that's how it's supposed to work.
Last edited by Zig; May 24, 2005 at 09:18 AM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 7,695
Likes: 51
From: Imperial Beach CA
Originally Posted by spectra6.0
Our vettes need tuning just because I changed the the air filters? That is kind of hard to believe GM has it set up that way.
Safety Car
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From: stafford country, va. Avatar: Me on turn 3 @ Bristol (The World's Fastest Half-Mile)
Originally Posted by jimman
Apparently it has to do with computer sensing air increase and adding fuel to keep Cats cool.
the cats gotta be hot to burn the fuel vapors.
if this is the case then replacing the cats with more robust units would require a tweek of the computer so it would know the new melting point.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 7,695
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From: Imperial Beach CA
Originally Posted by Zig
shouldn't that be "below the rated melting point", instead of cool ?
the cats gotta be hot to burn the fuel vapors.
if this is the case then replacing the cats with more robust units would require a tweek of the computer so it would know the new melting point.
the cats gotta be hot to burn the fuel vapors.
if this is the case then replacing the cats with more robust units would require a tweek of the computer so it would know the new melting point.
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2004
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From: stafford country, va. Avatar: Me on turn 3 @ Bristol (The World's Fastest Half-Mile)
Originally Posted by jimman
There are several posts referencing this, Jim Hall, Andreas, etc.
yes, i've been following threads about increased airflow and cat protection. the extra fuel keeps the cats from heating up so much as to disintegrate. this will also produce more carbon in the exhaust pipes. i'm wondering if it's really a cat protection mode (did they find that terminology in the computers program ?) or is the computer expecting more air than it's actually receiving ?
but, to answer spectra's question, i (personally) don't believe he would need to tune the computer just because he changes air filters. there should be enough leeway built into the computer for longevitiy performance self-adjustments. as time passes the engine is gonna develop new and different characteristics, the flow will change, efficiency will change, burn rate, etc. just from use.
but, that's my opinion and really doesen't mean anything. gotta take everything with a grain of salt and prove (test) it to find out if it's true or not.
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2004
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Originally Posted by jimman
I am and will be getting tune later this week.
Just curious.
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 3,565
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From: stafford country, va. Avatar: Me on turn 3 @ Bristol (The World's Fastest Half-Mile)
Originally Posted by cmb13
I'm actually surprised you're getting new filters. I've been following your threads and notice that you favor reproducibility testing and dyno runs. Have the filters proven to be effective? If not, why are you going ahead with it? K&N or BPP?
Just curious.
Just curious.
maybe jimman, know something he's trying to direct folks away from so it will be all his, hahahahaha
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 7,695
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From: Imperial Beach CA
Originally Posted by cmb13
I'm actually surprised you're getting new filters. I've been following your threads and notice that you favor reproducibility testing and dyno runs. Have the filters proven to be effective? If not, why are you going ahead with it? K&N or BPP?
Just curious.
Just curious.
After seeing what happened to Jim Hall's test and just leaving A & A corvette, Andy's place and seeing what he did with an LS2 tune on a Stock C6. I just couldn't resist seeing what will happen.
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Originally Posted by Zig
yes, i've been following threads about increased airflow and cat protection. the extra fuel keeps the cats from heating up so much as to disintegrate. this will also produce more carbon in the exhaust pipes. i'm wondering if it's really a cat protection mode (did they find that terminology in the computers program ?) or is the computer expecting more air than it's actually receiving ?
but, to answer spectra's question, i (personally) don't believe he would need to tune the computer just because he changes air filters. there should be enough leeway built into the computer for longevitiy performance self-adjustments. as time passes the engine is gonna develop new and different characteristics, the flow will change, efficiency will change, burn rate, etc. just from use.
but, that's my opinion and really doesen't mean anything. gotta take everything with a grain of salt and prove (test) it to find out if it's true or not.
but, to answer spectra's question, i (personally) don't believe he would need to tune the computer just because he changes air filters. there should be enough leeway built into the computer for longevitiy performance self-adjustments. as time passes the engine is gonna develop new and different characteristics, the flow will change, efficiency will change, burn rate, etc. just from use.
but, that's my opinion and really doesen't mean anything. gotta take everything with a grain of salt and prove (test) it to find out if it's true or not.
Thanks for all the replies!
Zig, I would have to go along with your thinking, sounds pretty good to me!
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,099
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From: Branford Connecticut
Tuning requirements - Callaway Honker
This post is from Callaway Cars Inc. It is not intended to be an advertisement for our products. Rather, it is simply additional technical information for interested enthusiasts. It is in response to a growing concern that "tuning" is required whenever installing high flow air intake systems on C6 Corvettes.
Apparently, some intake systems require PCM calibration (tuning) in order to prevent engine management functions from adding excessive fuel, negating any increase in performance.
We have not experienced these unpredictable air-fuel ratio excursions during design and development of the Honker C6. We've had one system on a car for over 10,000 miles without incident.
Without tuning, installing the Honker on an otherwise-stock C6 generated a 12 rwhp increase. At the dragstrip, the C6 was more than two-tenths quicker with Honker installed.
Some of the details are in the following statement that was sent to Honker customers who were concerned about tuning requirements:
[URL=http://www.callawaycars.com/callaway/HonkerC6PressRelease-51705.htm/URL]
Apparently, some intake systems require PCM calibration (tuning) in order to prevent engine management functions from adding excessive fuel, negating any increase in performance.
We have not experienced these unpredictable air-fuel ratio excursions during design and development of the Honker C6. We've had one system on a car for over 10,000 miles without incident.
Without tuning, installing the Honker on an otherwise-stock C6 generated a 12 rwhp increase. At the dragstrip, the C6 was more than two-tenths quicker with Honker installed.
Some of the details are in the following statement that was sent to Honker customers who were concerned about tuning requirements:
[URL=http://www.callawaycars.com/callaway/HonkerC6PressRelease-51705.htm/URL]