Sway Bar(s) Question
Thread Starter
CF Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 23,313
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From: Tucson Arizona
Sway Bar(s) Question
I have a 2005 C6 Coupe MN6....on July 31 I'm scheduled to do the LPE 403 package conversion....Corsa Sport exhaust....LPE CAI, install LG Pro long tube headers (coated) and Z06 sway bars (possibly the B & M shifter as well).
I recall reading a thread where someone recommeded the Z51 sway bars. Is there any reason Z51 sway bars would be better to use than the Z06 sway bars? Or vice versa?
I appreciate the benefit of your experience.
I recall reading a thread where someone recommeded the Z51 sway bars. Is there any reason Z51 sway bars would be better to use than the Z06 sway bars? Or vice versa?
I appreciate the benefit of your experience.
Race Director
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 18,725
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From: Bergen County, NJ
Originally Posted by Wayne O
II recall reading a thread where someone recommeded the Z51 sway bars. Is there any reason Z51 sway bars would be better to use than the Z06 sway bars? Or vice versa?
I appreciate the benefit of your experience.
I appreciate the benefit of your experience.
And I'll say this Wayne to Wayne: I don't know if either would be better to use.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,064
Likes: 6
From: Pinellas Park Florida
In general, the Z51 bars and/or the Z06 rear bar will limit body roll, induce or allow more oversteer, add a bit of stiffness to the ride, and adds a bit more weight to the car.
Now why you would do this depends upon what you want to accomplish. I know it is a favorite mod on the forum for many with the base/f55 car, but unless you find yourself in situations where body roll is a problem like at the HPDE's, road track, or autocrossing, its' not likely a very useful modification. That said, it is a easy and cheap modification that adds some amount of additional cornering stability.
Now why you would do this depends upon what you want to accomplish. I know it is a favorite mod on the forum for many with the base/f55 car, but unless you find yourself in situations where body roll is a problem like at the HPDE's, road track, or autocrossing, its' not likely a very useful modification. That said, it is a easy and cheap modification that adds some amount of additional cornering stability.
Thread Starter
CF Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 23,313
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From: Tucson Arizona
Originally Posted by AutoCutter
In general, the Z51 bars and/or the Z06 rear bar will limit body roll, induce or allow more oversteer, add a bit of stiffness to the ride, and adds a bit more weight to the car.
Now why you would do this depends upon what you want to accomplish. I know it is a favorite mod on the forum for many with the base/f55 car, but unless you find yourself in situations where body roll is a problem like at the HPDE's, road track, or autocrossing, its' not likely a very useful modification. That said, it is a easy and cheap modification that adds some amount of additional cornering stability.
Now why you would do this depends upon what you want to accomplish. I know it is a favorite mod on the forum for many with the base/f55 car, but unless you find yourself in situations where body roll is a problem like at the HPDE's, road track, or autocrossing, its' not likely a very useful modification. That said, it is a easy and cheap modification that adds some amount of additional cornering stability.
I appreciate everyone's help and expertise.
Safety Car
Joined: Jun 2005
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Originally Posted by Wayne O
Thanks to both for your input and the excellent (above) description. While I don't track enough to scrap the f55 suspension (which I deem as a 'plush' setup) and go the coilover route....I am looking to achieve an added measure of cornering stability with the Z06 sway bars. Unless I hear of a good reason to opt for the Z51 vs. the Z06 sway bars, I think I'll stick to my original plan.
I appreciate everyone's help and expertise.
I appreciate everyone's help and expertise.
The C6 Z06 rear sway bar is larger than the Z51 bar. The front bar on both the Z51 and C6Z06 is the same. Adding the larger Z06 bar to the standard suspension C6 without changing the front to rear tire stagger setup will make the car much more prone to oversteer "loose" setup. With all that horsepower you are adding it should be no problem to get your car to rotate in the corner by adding a bit of throttle with the Z51 bar setup. I can do it now with my nearly stock HP C6. Unless you are adding larger rear tires with your setup or unless you are looking for a car that is much more prone to oversteer I would stick with the Z51 bars.
Race Director
Joined: Aug 2005
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From: Hudson WI
NCM Sinkhole Donor
Originally Posted by EuroRod
For what's it's worth, installing the rear Z06 sway, without matching with Z06 size wheels and tires, is inviting some oversteer. IMHO, the Z51 sway's might be a better choice.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,031
Likes: 4
From: Crete IL
My opinion is that on a regular C6 the Z51 sway bar setup is neutral enough. The Z06 has a different front spring than the Z51 but has the same rear spring. For my Z51 I put the Z06 front spring on first and noticed a little more understeer, althought this did not bother me much. I then put the Z06 rear sway bar on and the overall balance became similar to the stock Z51 setup. That tells me that that Z06 rear bar does make a difference. If the only things being changed are the sway bars then I wouldn't use the Z06 rear bar.
Last edited by rfopt; Jul 16, 2006 at 10:41 AM.
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Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,375
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From: Northern CA
Originally Posted by AutoCutter
In general, the Z51 bars and/or the Z06 rear bar will limit body roll, induce or allow more oversteer, add a bit of stiffness to the ride, and adds a bit more weight to the car.
Now why you would do this depends upon what you want to accomplish. I know it is a favorite mod on the forum for many with the base/f55 car, but unless you find yourself in situations where body roll is a problem like at the HPDE's, road track, or autocrossing, its' not likely a very useful modification. That said, it is a easy and cheap modification that adds some amount of additional cornering stability.
Now why you would do this depends upon what you want to accomplish. I know it is a favorite mod on the forum for many with the base/f55 car, but unless you find yourself in situations where body roll is a problem like at the HPDE's, road track, or autocrossing, its' not likely a very useful modification. That said, it is a easy and cheap modification that adds some amount of additional cornering stability.
Z51 bars feel right to me on an F55 car. Cornering is closer to neutral than stock but not squirlly. It goes around corners like spit through a trombone.
I definitely wouldn't want more tendency towards oversteer (Z06 rear bar), not even on a track.
If someone is undecided on Z51 vs Z06 bars, they should start off with the Z51 bars, then only go to the Z06 rear bar if they want to increase oversteer. The bars are real reasonably priced. so changing the rear bar twice wouldn't be much of a lo$$.
Safety Car
Joined: Jun 2005
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From: DFW This user does not support or recommend the product or service displayed in the ad to the right
Originally Posted by joesph
Wayne O my name is joseph cordova, from albuquerque, NM. if in need of brand new front Z06 SWAY BAR have brand new for sale-paid 144.34 plus shipping reply if interested!!!!!!!!!
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,064
Likes: 6
From: Pinellas Park Florida
The primary point of sway bars are to limit body roll. Sway bars, working in conjunction with the dampers and springs, attempt to keep the tires' contact points flat to the road. That said, and by the way, that was a gross generalization, a lot depends on your driving style and how you go in to corner. With my driving style, I noted that the inside back end would lift quickly in some corners leading to the C6 surprise oversteer. By changing tire pressures first and then moving to the Z06 rear bar, I was able to replace the surprise oversteer with a more predictable and controllable oversteer for me. How that setup would work for someone else can be a very different story.
Anyway, once you change your suspension, I would go find a large parking lot and do some corners & slaloms to see what your changes have done to your car. Additionally, this "testing" will teach how to drive the car with your changes. There has been a few members that have been very badly surprised on off ramps after installing Z51 bars. Good luck!
Anyway, once you change your suspension, I would go find a large parking lot and do some corners & slaloms to see what your changes have done to your car. Additionally, this "testing" will teach how to drive the car with your changes. There has been a few members that have been very badly surprised on off ramps after installing Z51 bars. Good luck!
Pro
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 535
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Originally Posted by AutoCutter
In general, the Z51 bars and/or the Z06 rear bar will limit body roll, induce or allow more oversteer, add a bit of stiffness to the ride, and adds a bit more weight to the car.
Now why you would do this depends upon what you want to accomplish. I know it is a favorite mod on the forum for many with the base/f55 car, but unless you find yourself in situations where body roll is a problem like at the HPDE's, road track, or autocrossing, its' not likely a very useful modification. That said, it is a easy and cheap modification that adds some amount of additional cornering stability.
Now why you would do this depends upon what you want to accomplish. I know it is a favorite mod on the forum for many with the base/f55 car, but unless you find yourself in situations where body roll is a problem like at the HPDE's, road track, or autocrossing, its' not likely a very useful modification. That said, it is a easy and cheap modification that adds some amount of additional cornering stability.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,064
Likes: 6
From: Pinellas Park Florida
Originally Posted by 05_C6Z51
I have the Z51 and would like to tighten it a bit more. The front isn't as solid as I want it to be in the turns. Any advice?
Assuming you have a good alignment on all four corners, I would raise the air pressure up to 33 or 34 pounds equal front and rear first. The run-flats seemed kinda flexy to me and that seemed to cure what vagueness I had; these tires drive somewhat odd to me and behave somewhat differently throughout the day. The front Z51 sway bar is just about right, but I think the rear bar allows a bit too much roll that can effect the inside front as well as the inside rear. However, some feel that the vague front end is the result of too little shock and this may be true. I think the shocks are about right for the spring rate and for moderate track use. For me, one off the shelf shock has been no better than another off the shelf shock; a semi custom or full custom is a different story.
Personally, I would try the air pressure route first for a week or so to see how the car feels, then if that doesn't get it, I would try the Z06 rear sway.
Safety Car
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Originally Posted by john_sblendorio
I was told by Beans that both sways and both springs are different in the z51 compared to the z06. Can anyone validate this?
Burning Brakes
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,031
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From: Crete IL
Originally Posted by john_sblendorio
I was told by Beans that both sways and both springs are different in the z51 compared to the z06. Can anyone validate this?
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,064
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From: Pinellas Park Florida
Originally Posted by john_sblendorio
I was told by Beans that both sways and both springs are different in the z51 compared to the z06. Can anyone validate this?
The front Z06 spring is different with a greater spring rate than the Z51.
The Z06 rear bar is larger by .20" (1.20 versus 1" for the Z51)
The Z06 and Z51 rear springs have the same spring rate.
That was from Gene at the Beans
Thread Starter
CF Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2006
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From: Tucson Arizona
Thanks everyone for your input and the benefit of your expertise and experience. I think dialing-in the proper feel may involve a bit of trial and error....and yes, I'm a believer in a wide open space to do this in... I'm not looking to windup in a ditch or against a wall. At certain times, I have access to what makes an excellent skid pad to practice on.
I had some hard cornering on not the greatest road surface when powering out...I experienced a little too much sideways hop. I wasn't on it hard enough to fishtail or power-drift so I thought a bit more 'stability' via adding the bars would help. I'll consult again with Lingenfelter but frankly, I value your opinions just as much. Ultimately, changing the rear bar is not too costly or involved so I may end up experimenting. I'm no great mechanic but I think I could handle changing out the rear sway bar
Everyone....thanks again. I appreciate your help!
I had some hard cornering on not the greatest road surface when powering out...I experienced a little too much sideways hop. I wasn't on it hard enough to fishtail or power-drift so I thought a bit more 'stability' via adding the bars would help. I'll consult again with Lingenfelter but frankly, I value your opinions just as much. Ultimately, changing the rear bar is not too costly or involved so I may end up experimenting. I'm no great mechanic but I think I could handle changing out the rear sway bar
Everyone....thanks again. I appreciate your help!