TM is now history
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,796
Likes: 1
From: Annandale VA
TM is now history
Had my C6 A6 tuned at Corvettes of Westchester last week, and TM is now a thing of the past. The new beta version of HP Tuners allowed TM to be defeated, without ever touching the TCM.
Despite some fairly good dyno numbers, my car was a dog at launch. My best track launch was a crummy 2.15. I could get some wheelspin for a burnout by brake torqueing, but off the line I got no wheelspin whatsoever, either at the track or on the street.
Those days are gone forever. The car now launches like a wild beast (at least compared to before), and leaves 10 feet of rubber on the 1-2 shift. It's like a completely different car.
See my thread in the Scan & Tune section for details. If you're considering a mail order tune from CoW, you won't be disappointed.
Despite some fairly good dyno numbers, my car was a dog at launch. My best track launch was a crummy 2.15. I could get some wheelspin for a burnout by brake torqueing, but off the line I got no wheelspin whatsoever, either at the track or on the street.
Those days are gone forever. The car now launches like a wild beast (at least compared to before), and leaves 10 feet of rubber on the 1-2 shift. It's like a completely different car.
See my thread in the Scan & Tune section for details. If you're considering a mail order tune from CoW, you won't be disappointed.
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 2,891
Likes: 1
From: NJ..."the way I saw it, everyone takes a beating sometimes."
I just read and posted over in your thread. I have an appointment coming up for a VR and tune from Chuck C.O.W. I love reading from satisfied customers. I'm looking foward to a better driving and better performing car from him.
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 53,282
Likes: 3
From: God Bless America
Originally Posted by HITMAN99
Had my C6 A6 tuned at Corvettes of Westchester last week, and TM is now a thing of the past. The new beta version of HP Tuners allowed TM to be defeated, without ever touching the TCM.
Despite some fairly good dyno numbers, my car was a dog at launch. My best track launch was a crummy 2.15. I could get some wheelspin for a burnout by brake torqueing, but off the line I got no wheelspin whatsoever, either at the track or on the street.
Those days are gone forever. The car now launches like a wild beast (at least compared to before), and leaves 10 feet of rubber on the 1-2 shift. It's like a completely different car.
See my thread in the Scan & Tune section for details. If you're considering a mail order tune from CoW, you won't be disappointed.
Despite some fairly good dyno numbers, my car was a dog at launch. My best track launch was a crummy 2.15. I could get some wheelspin for a burnout by brake torqueing, but off the line I got no wheelspin whatsoever, either at the track or on the street.
Those days are gone forever. The car now launches like a wild beast (at least compared to before), and leaves 10 feet of rubber on the 1-2 shift. It's like a completely different car.
See my thread in the Scan & Tune section for details. If you're considering a mail order tune from CoW, you won't be disappointed.
Glad to hear from someone who had a tune and can verify the TM program can be worked around. Did you remove and send your PCM to them for the tune? I have several local places to go for the tune on my 05, but I don't get the warm and fuzzies about their ability to work around the TM code and that is the piece I want fixed the most. Congrats on the upgrade, I bet its like having a completely different car.
Team Owner
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 26,714
Likes: 344
From: Houston, TX
Originally Posted by yell03
So TM is real.
I am getting my car tuned on Tuesday with HP tuners, hopefully I'll be as happy as you are
Howard
I am getting my car tuned on Tuesday with HP tuners, hopefully I'll be as happy as you are
Howard
Race Director
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 15,324
Likes: 2,080
From: Guelph, Ontario
Originally Posted by LS1LT1
So with more break in miles, TM removed, and killer air, I bet you'll see 12.1s or maybe even 12.0s!!
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,796
Likes: 1
From: Annandale VA
Originally Posted by 30YR W8T
HITMAN,
Glad to hear from someone who had a tune and can verify the TM program can be worked around. Did you remove and send your PCM to them for the tune? I have several local places to go for the tune on my 05, but I don't get the warm and fuzzies about their ability to work around the TM code and that is the piece I want fixed the most. Congrats on the upgrade, I bet its like having a completely different car.
Glad to hear from someone who had a tune and can verify the TM program can be worked around. Did you remove and send your PCM to them for the tune? I have several local places to go for the tune on my 05, but I don't get the warm and fuzzies about their ability to work around the TM code and that is the piece I want fixed the most. Congrats on the upgrade, I bet its like having a completely different car.
Most of the TM tables seem to apply whether the car is an M6 or an A6. The tables show the max TQ allowed in each gear. Exactly how the TQ is computed and/or measured is not obvious. As has been surmised by others, the torque is managed by retarding the timing. There is even one table that controls the retard decay rate --- how quickly the spark advance is returned back to its normal setting.
The HP Tuners software has easy to understand screen displays. As soon as the beta release goes into full production, I will probably get my own copy.
The '05 is apparently a little easier to tune than the '06. There was another forum member at the shop at the same time, also getting a tune. He also left with a big smile on his face.
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Team Owner
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 27,254
Likes: 137
From: Short Hills, NJ
Originally Posted by Patman
Once you get a few more runs on your car Marc, I'd love to see how it'll run with just the TM removed and nothing else. It would not surprise me one bit to see it drop a further 2 tenths.
So with more break in miles, TM removed, and killer air, I bet you'll see 12.1s or maybe even 12.0s!!
So with more break in miles, TM removed, and killer air, I bet you'll see 12.1s or maybe even 12.0s!!
If I do get some tuning/TM work done it will likely be along with thermostat/fan settings install as well but I too would certainly like to see what kind of gains I could see from it. 
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 38,314
Likes: 35
Originally Posted by HITMAN99
Had my C6 A6 tuned at Corvettes of Westchester last week, and TM is now a thing of the past. The new beta version of HP Tuners allowed TM to be defeated, without ever touching the TCM.
Despite some fairly good dyno numbers, my car was a dog at launch. My best track launch was a crummy 2.15. I could get some wheelspin for a burnout by brake torqueing, but off the line I got no wheelspin whatsoever, either at the track or on the street.
Those days are gone forever. The car now launches like a wild beast (at least compared to before), and leaves 10 feet of rubber on the 1-2 shift. It's like a completely different car.
See my thread in the Scan & Tune section for details. If you're considering a mail order tune from CoW, you won't be disappointed.
Despite some fairly good dyno numbers, my car was a dog at launch. My best track launch was a crummy 2.15. I could get some wheelspin for a burnout by brake torqueing, but off the line I got no wheelspin whatsoever, either at the track or on the street.
Those days are gone forever. The car now launches like a wild beast (at least compared to before), and leaves 10 feet of rubber on the 1-2 shift. It's like a completely different car.
See my thread in the Scan & Tune section for details. If you're considering a mail order tune from CoW, you won't be disappointed.
Hope you don't bust anything now that its gone.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 5,253
Likes: 50
From: Sandy Eggo Calif.
St. Jude Donor '06-'07-'08-'09-'10-'11-'12, '16
I had my A6 tuned by Ron Zimmer. What a difference! These cars are begging to be tuned, especially if you have headers.
CF Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 23,313
Likes: 25
From: Tucson Arizona
That's a good thing....it sounds like it made a definite improvement. I've read some of the ongoing debate about TM on the forum. With the install of my LPE 403 motor (headers, etc.) TM was addressed during the edit/tune. As far as breaking something....I was cautioned against loading-up too much off the line and especially about switching tires. For me, a hard launch with slicks would be chancing drive-train disaster (I do plan on beefing-up my drive-train).
I've heard of a few stock C6's blowing their differentials at the dragstrip. With TM throttled down or off, a little caution might be best.
("A gram of prevention is worth a kilo of cure"....go metric)!
I've heard of a few stock C6's blowing their differentials at the dragstrip. With TM throttled down or off, a little caution might be best.
("A gram of prevention is worth a kilo of cure"....go metric)!
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 3,565
Likes: 5
From: stafford country, va. Avatar: Me on turn 3 @ Bristol (The World's Fastest Half-Mile)
hitman99, just a couple of tm questions.
even though they can't tune the tcm for the a6, the torque table per gear still apply ?
does it display differently for a4s ?
can the same software be used to 'tune' a variety of vehicles ? i.e not corvette specific.
is it possible to use the same software to tune a suburban or an avalance, etc. etc. etc. ? a vehicle that is 4wd or awd.
did you have only the tm parameters changed or did other items get tuned as well ?
otherwise, nice improvement, cool.
Originally Posted by HITMAN99
Most of the TM tables seem to apply whether the car is an M6 or an A6.
The tables show the max TQ allowed in each gear. Exactly how the TQ is computed and/or measured is not obvious. As has been surmised by others, the torque is managed by retarding the timing. There is even one table that controls the retard decay rate --- how quickly the spark advance is returned back to its normal setting.
The HP Tuners software has easy to understand screen displays. As soon as the beta release goes into full production, I will probably get my own copy.
The '05 is apparently a little easier to tune than the '06. There was another forum member at the shop at the same time, also getting a tune. He also left with a big smile on his face.
The tables show the max TQ allowed in each gear. Exactly how the TQ is computed and/or measured is not obvious. As has been surmised by others, the torque is managed by retarding the timing. There is even one table that controls the retard decay rate --- how quickly the spark advance is returned back to its normal setting.
The HP Tuners software has easy to understand screen displays. As soon as the beta release goes into full production, I will probably get my own copy.
The '05 is apparently a little easier to tune than the '06. There was another forum member at the shop at the same time, also getting a tune. He also left with a big smile on his face.
does it display differently for a4s ?
can the same software be used to 'tune' a variety of vehicles ? i.e not corvette specific.
is it possible to use the same software to tune a suburban or an avalance, etc. etc. etc. ? a vehicle that is 4wd or awd.
did you have only the tm parameters changed or did other items get tuned as well ?
otherwise, nice improvement, cool.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,796
Likes: 1
From: Annandale VA
SEE BELOW
Originally Posted by Zig
hitman99, just a couple of tm questions.
even though they can't tune the tcm for the a6, the torque table per gear still apply ?
YES
does it display differently for a4s ?
DON'T KNOW FOR SURE, AS I'VE ONLY SEEN THE SCREENS FOR THE A6, BUT I SUSPECT THEY'RE THE SAME, AS THEY STILL HAVE 6 GEARS.
can the same software be used to 'tune' a variety of vehicles ? i.e not corvette specific.
YES.
is it possible to use the same software to tune a suburban or an avalance, etc. etc. etc. ? a vehicle that is 4wd or awd.
YES.
did you have only the tm parameters changed or did other items get tuned as well ?
NO, LOTS OF TABLES AND PARAMETERS GOT CHANGED. I BASICALLY GOT THE SAME TUNE AS ANOTHER GUY ON THE FORUM (BLVDBASHER?), WITH A LITTLE TWEAKING TO CLEAN UP THE LTRIMS.
otherwise, nice improvement, cool.
MONSTER IMPROVEMENT.
even though they can't tune the tcm for the a6, the torque table per gear still apply ?
YES
does it display differently for a4s ?
DON'T KNOW FOR SURE, AS I'VE ONLY SEEN THE SCREENS FOR THE A6, BUT I SUSPECT THEY'RE THE SAME, AS THEY STILL HAVE 6 GEARS.
can the same software be used to 'tune' a variety of vehicles ? i.e not corvette specific.
YES.
is it possible to use the same software to tune a suburban or an avalance, etc. etc. etc. ? a vehicle that is 4wd or awd.
YES.
did you have only the tm parameters changed or did other items get tuned as well ?
NO, LOTS OF TABLES AND PARAMETERS GOT CHANGED. I BASICALLY GOT THE SAME TUNE AS ANOTHER GUY ON THE FORUM (BLVDBASHER?), WITH A LITTLE TWEAKING TO CLEAN UP THE LTRIMS.
otherwise, nice improvement, cool.
MONSTER IMPROVEMENT.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,796
Likes: 1
From: Annandale VA
Yes I think you can get similar results, depending on your other mods of course. Chcuk said that his mail order tunes are not quite as aggressive for safety reasons, but that should only make a slight difference.
Former Vendor
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 11,792
Likes: 255
From: Ossining New York
St. Jude Donor '07-'08-'09-'10-'12-'13-'14
Thanks sooo Much!
Originally Posted by HITMAN99
Yes I think you can get similar results, depending on your other mods of course. Chcuk said that his mail order tunes are not quite as aggressive for safety reasons, but that should only make a slight difference.
Hey there HITMAN!
Hope you got home on time..... Thanks so much for the great posts...It was a pleasure working with you....
If anyone else has questions on tuning 06 & 07 A6 Corvettes, please don't hesitate to call me in the shop...Nights and evenings are always good as well.....Calling in your questions allows me to explain alittle clearer what it is that I do.....
Call any time...
STAY TUNED!
Chuck CoW
Tech Contributor
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,094
Likes: 197
From: Colorado Springs, CO
St. Jude Donor '08-'09-'10-'11
Originally Posted by jschindler
I don't think anyone ever doubted the effets of TM on a car with an automatic.
I have HPtuners and I will turn it off and on repeatedly for anyone that thinks it isnt real and it does have an effect of the 6 speed. It works by cutting timing which is just as bad on the motor regardless of the type of transmission.
Let me know where and when and you travel to me...Long Island NY till Nov 1 and then down in Memphis for some time.
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 3,565
Likes: 5
From: stafford country, va. Avatar: Me on turn 3 @ Bristol (The World's Fastest Half-Mile)
Originally Posted by SpinMonster
As I have said repeatedly before and will say it again so as to not be misquoted...
I have HPtuners and I will turn it off and on repeatedly for anyone that thinks it isnt real and it does have an effect of the 6 speed. It works by cutting timing which is just as bad on the motor regardless of the type of transmission.
Let me know where and when and you travel to me...Long Island NY till Nov 1 and then down in Memphis for some time.
I have HPtuners and I will turn it off and on repeatedly for anyone that thinks it isnt real and it does have an effect of the 6 speed. It works by cutting timing which is just as bad on the motor regardless of the type of transmission.
Let me know where and when and you travel to me...Long Island NY till Nov 1 and then down in Memphis for some time.
either place isn't too far for me so i just may take you up on your offer sometime. you wouldn't happen to be going to the 'skyline' cruise, would you ?
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,796
Likes: 1
From: Annandale VA
Zig, I can safely say that if you ONLY change the TM parameters, you will immediately notice a difference. I'm sure that's what SpinMonster meant when he said "turn it on and off repeatedly". If you had access to a scanning tool you could also see how the timing gets pulled when TM is engaged, and stays unchanged once TM is defeated.
Since you already have headers installed, I'd recommend the CoW mail order tune. You'll get the TM turned off, plus a whole lot more.
Since you already have headers installed, I'd recommend the CoW mail order tune. You'll get the TM turned off, plus a whole lot more.