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Old Jan 18, 2007 | 01:03 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by Myhardtop
Your biggest problems are: 1) tuning, 2) weight and possibly 3) gearing.

Allow me further elaboration, and this is totally my opinion. I have had my fair share of trial and errors:

1) Tuning: Whenever you introduce a cam into a motor you are essentially changing the manner on which the car will behave...the whole package is now altered. A good tuning however, will/can make all the pieces come together but only if you or whomever had carefully chosen all the pieces. I've seen many people add a cam into a car and go slower; they may sound mean as hell but run worth a damn. If all your parts were chosen properly for your set up...ie TB, heads, intake and so on, then a good tuning can yield 20 to 30 additional rear wheel horses or more!

2) If I recall correctly, the Z51 C6 is lighter than your Automatic C6. Taking that into consideration, the package of that Z51 is such that it works around it’s given components. In other words, the whole thing was designed to maximize and complement what’s there (suspension, braking and power band due to gearing). Your friend essentially improved the already decently stout stock set up by adding headers (better exhaust flow) and CAI (better breathing capabilities).

3) Gearing plays a huge role. Remember, he has 3.42 gears PLUS his trans is geared to totally take advantage of the giving powerband of the LS2 mill with stock heads and cam. Great trans gearing was one of the C5 Z06’s advantages over the C5 coupes, Verts and FRC's.

Your improvement of let's say 30 to 40 rear wheel HP from stock will roughly net you about 2 to 2.5 tenth AND possibly 1.5 to 2.0 mph gain in the 1/4 mile considering your current weight and choice of transmission. By the sound of your set up, I believe that you really need a properly stalled torque converter to take full advantage of the new cam. Remember, if everything being equal (traction/power and driver) automatics really has an advantage over sticks from a stand still. Your particular combo vs his from a rolling start is not a big advantage right now over his better geared rear end and trans, lighter chassis and possibly better tuned Vette. Now, once you get that bad boy tuned and do something about that converter, you will smoke him from any point (rolling or standing start).

Replacing gears is a good idea, but if I were you, I would do Converter before a rear gears. The cost of gears and a torque converter I believe is about the same. Torque converters are typically good for at least a 0.3 tenth in ET reduction and it will compliment your new cam a little better than the gears at this point. In fact, a converter will "wake up" that semi-sleeping beast!

Again, this is just my opinion and this is what I've seen work on automatic C5's, 5.0's, Fbody's and also GN's.

Thanks
Thank you so much for posting your opinion on the matter... I actually have a 3500 vigilante on the car.. Tunning the TCM though will give me full advantage of the capabilities of the TC and will definately compliment the remaining components of the car..

.. Now I want a 3.42.. Shipping it will cost more than buying it though
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Old Jan 18, 2007 | 01:05 AM
  #42  
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You might want to think about L92 heads and L72 intake

Last edited by Z51 6spd; Jan 18, 2007 at 01:46 PM.
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Old Jan 18, 2007 | 03:07 AM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by Z51 6spd
You might want to think about L92 heads and L96 intake
I actually read a few threads and articles about those heads and L72 intake (haven't heard of the L96 to be honest)..

.. They sound quite promising at an outstanding price but i'm waiting for more real-life results.. I'm not in the mood to be someone else's guinea pig..!

I'm sure both items with compliment the setup especially the cam!

Just outta curiousity, if you're running an aftermarket heads/manifold combo, what is it and what kind of gains did you get?
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Old Jan 18, 2007 | 01:46 PM
  #44  
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Sorry L72 intake. Well I'm the guinea pig, because I'm ordering the L92/L72 in a week. No cam though, just my previous mods and a retune on the dyno. I will let you know, pretty sure I will make over 450 to the wheels. Making 407/411 right now with just a few bolt-ons. I counted up what I have spent in cash today for mods $9635 as for the things I remember, it is addictive. A really need to stop, i'm 23 and don't need to be spending that kind of money. Should be paying the car off. Heads and intake and i'm done really!

Last edited by Z51 6spd; Jan 18, 2007 at 01:56 PM.
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Old Jan 18, 2007 | 02:03 PM
  #45  
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I think with the Heads, you get what you pay for... (I think the L92 heads are too big for stock cubed motors)

I have several race videos posted on my myspace page http://www.myspace.com/rickschildge pulling a new C6 Z06 and a new Viper..

I think my heads/intake selection are a big part of why my car runs so well... - especially when you consider I have a very small cam.... 215/232....

Last edited by xstang; Jan 18, 2007 at 02:26 PM.
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Old Jan 18, 2007 | 02:53 PM
  #46  
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Put in less gas next time have it near empty save some weight.
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Old Jan 18, 2007 | 03:03 PM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by xstang
I think with the Heads, you get what you pay for... (I think the L92 heads are too big for stock cubed motors)

I have several race videos posted on my myspace page http://www.myspace.com/rickschildge pulling a new C6 Z06 and a new Viper..

I think my heads/intake selection are a big part of why my car runs so well... - especially when you consider I have a very small cam.... 215/232....
What head would you recommend for my set up, almost the same as you, but 228 on the intake and same as you on the exhaust.Just wondering because if I do upgrade again, it'll be heads only unless it's the general concensus the stock intake won't hold up.
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Old Jan 18, 2007 | 03:10 PM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by Evilways
What head would you recommend for my set up, almost the same as you, but 228 on the intake and same as you on the exhaust.Just wondering because if I do upgrade again, it'll be heads only unless it's the general concensus the stock intake won't hold up.
I'm running the AFR 205s now, but I'm considering switching to the AFR 225 Small bore heads... I'm also considering the Fm14 high lift cam to take advantage of the better flow at the higher lift....

If you are running under 600 lift, the AFR 205s would be perfect (with a 228 cam)... If you run bigger cam 230+ or more lift, my preference is AFR 225 small bore heads.... The 225s also give you more room if you decide to up the cubes later...
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Old Jan 18, 2007 | 03:11 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by xstang
I'm running the AFR 205s now, but I'm considering switching to the AFR 225 Small bore heads... I'm also considering the Fm14 high lift cam to take advantage of the better flow at the higher lift....

If you are running under 600 lift, the AFR 205s would be perfect (with a 228 cam)... If you run bigger cam 230+ or more lift, my preference is AFR 225 small bore heads.... The 225s also give you more room if you decide to up the cubes later...
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Old Jan 19, 2007 | 01:47 AM
  #50  
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You get what you pay for, not always. Like in your case AFRs are nice heads, but....... Stock LS2 with L92 heads L76 intake, and a somewhat warm cam (232/236 .050, .600 112 lobe) will make 547 hp 495 lb-ft per GM High Tech. Would bet money your 205 AFRs Fast 90 and somewhat warm cam wont make that. Hey I have A Fast 90 and love it, but #s don't lie, and you payed to much. Some times it pays to wait. By the way I really like your car, and ya its fast.
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Old Jan 19, 2007 | 09:06 AM
  #51  
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Originally Posted by Z51 6spd
You get what you pay for, not always. Like in your case AFRs are nice heads, but....... Stock LS2 with L92 heads L76 intake, and a somewhat warm cam (232/236 .050, .600 112 lobe) will make 547 hp 495 lb-ft per GM High Tech. Would bet money your 205 AFRs Fast 90 and somewhat warm cam wont make that. Hey I have A Fast 90 and love it, but #s don't lie, and you payed to much. Some times it pays to wait. By the way I really like your car, and ya its fast.
Wasn't that done on an engine dyno? Subtract the 17pct - drivetrain loss, convert the numbers to SAE then compare.. (The stock LS2 made 450HP in that article if I recall to show you how messed the numbers are)... The AFR heads are better I guarantee it... Flow numbers don't mean everything... I'm about to switch heads again and I could easily go with the cheap L92s, but I'm going with the Small bore Afr 225s... The L92s are too big for stock displacement...

Also look at the exhaust flow on those L92s heads compared to the AFRs? They don't even break 200....

AFR 0.100 0.200 0.300 0.400 0.500 0.550 0.600 0.650 0.700 0.800
Intake 68.6 152.9 217.4 263.9 300.7 318.6
Exhaust 58.6 115.9 168.8 205.4 219.8 229.9 232.5 235.69

L92s
Lift Intake Flow Exhaust Flow
(inches) (CFM) (CFM)
0.1 79.2 57.8
0.2 153 114.4
0.3 225 147.2
0.4 276 170.3
0.5 309.6 183.1
0.55 323.2 186
0.6 332.2 189.5
0.65 327.7 191.1

I'm not saying that you can't throw in a huge Cam and make better numbers than I am with my baby 215 duration cam.. I'm just saying the AFRs with the FAST intake will out perform the L92s L76 with the same cam...

They picked up 44RWHP switching the Heads and intake on a LS2.. I picked up closer to 60RWHP..... Sorry if I sound aggressive, I'm just passionate (-:

Last edited by xstang; Jan 19, 2007 at 09:45 AM.
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