Any issues with not tuning after kooks header install
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 139
Likes: 0
From: Lynchburg Va
Any issues with not tuning after kooks header install
I am a new guy buying a used kooks headers system off the forum. Kooks headers and midsection with corsa sport exhausts. I intend to try and install myself. I am a long way from any tuning shop, so it may be a while before I can get a tune. Any issues with running this without a tune for a while. System came off an 05 C6 z51 6sp, which is what I am putting it on. Thank you in advance for the help
Race Director
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,396
Likes: 169
I put a set on my 2005 and had zero issues with the headers only mod. The ECM is designed to opperate the engine under many varied parameters, from temp to altitude. It may take a few start/run sequences for it to learn the new variables, but it should be fine within 2 or 3 hours of run time.
Some on this forum will say you must retune, and I'm not saying that a performance tune would not give you a few more ponies. But, IMO, it's not necessary.
Good luck.
Some on this forum will say you must retune, and I'm not saying that a performance tune would not give you a few more ponies. But, IMO, it's not necessary.
Good luck.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,259
Likes: 1
From: Las Vegas NV
St. Jude Donor '10
No issues here either without a tune.
The car shouldn't thrown any codes as long as you have all the O2's working. As has been said, you'll likely need to drive it around a bit and start/turn it off a couple times for the ECM to recognize the changes, but it'll be fine.
By getting a tune, it's only optimizing the system and helping you get the most power available. But it will run fine without it.
The car shouldn't thrown any codes as long as you have all the O2's working. As has been said, you'll likely need to drive it around a bit and start/turn it off a couple times for the ECM to recognize the changes, but it'll be fine.
By getting a tune, it's only optimizing the system and helping you get the most power available. But it will run fine without it.
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 10,399
Likes: 26
From: Austin Texas
Chances are you will get a CEL from the rear O2 sensors that can only be permanently removed by manipulating the ECM computer (Tune). Doesn't seem to make any difference whether you use aftermarket cats or a cat delete, 99 out of 100 will get a CEL.
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,955
Likes: 22
From: Lehigh Valley Pennsylvania
You won't have any issues other than you won't be making any more hp
You have to tune for headers, both my GTO and Vette dynoed 5-6 hp higher base pull to header pull without any changes to the tune. After tune around 20 hp/tq gain.
You have to tune for headers, both my GTO and Vette dynoed 5-6 hp higher base pull to header pull without any changes to the tune. After tune around 20 hp/tq gain.
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I installed headers on my 05 with no tune and drove it for about 6 months....no problem. However, I eventually had it tuned and picked up 23 more horsepower.
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 2,578
Likes: 0
From: Noblesville IN
Sounds like the tune is worth more than the headers....
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,762
Likes: 4
From: Chandler Arizona
Not really. I picked up 26 rwhp and 39 rwtq with only LG LT's. After the tune the car was more consistent, but only picked up 5 more hp.
I'm a little skeptical of anyone that gets over 20 hp with a tune. Either the car was running terrible to begin with or the engine was heat soaked on the "before" pull. For example, my car when it was completely stock lost 18 rwhp on a second dyno pull because it was pulling timing due to high inlet air temps and high water temps. A tune along with a 160 stat will make the car more consistent and prevent this from happening.
And by the way, my 365 rwhp car (pretty low hp for a bolt on car) runs 12.03 at 118.7 mph in Phoenix (1250 foot altitude).
I'm a little skeptical of anyone that gets over 20 hp with a tune. Either the car was running terrible to begin with or the engine was heat soaked on the "before" pull. For example, my car when it was completely stock lost 18 rwhp on a second dyno pull because it was pulling timing due to high inlet air temps and high water temps. A tune along with a 160 stat will make the car more consistent and prevent this from happening.
And by the way, my 365 rwhp car (pretty low hp for a bolt on car) runs 12.03 at 118.7 mph in Phoenix (1250 foot altitude).
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,307
Likes: 111
From: Tucson AZ
You will probably get a check engine light.
You will probably get a check engine light. It is not catastropic.
It may help you to understand the purpose of the four different O2 sensors. The front O2 sensors are monitoring air/fuel ratio for each bank and reporting to the ECU which is then adjusting fuel inputs.
The rear O2 sensors are also monitoring air/fuel ratio, but are behind the Cats. Therefore the rear O2 output should be flat (the Cats should burn all the O2 and fuel remnants). Occasionally, the ECU runs a Cat check right after engine start up. It is checking that the Cat output is still 0. The Cats are normally installed right up next to the cast iron exhaust manifolds. This is so they heat up to operating temp immediately and "light off".
When we add long tube headers, we relocate the Cats further down the pipe and now they take longer to light off. Thus, even when you use Cats in a long tube header car, you will occasionally get a check engine light because it did not pass the initial Cat start up check.
Tuners will turn off this report by having the ECM ignore the rear O2 sensor inputs.
Hope this helps.
It may help you to understand the purpose of the four different O2 sensors. The front O2 sensors are monitoring air/fuel ratio for each bank and reporting to the ECU which is then adjusting fuel inputs.
The rear O2 sensors are also monitoring air/fuel ratio, but are behind the Cats. Therefore the rear O2 output should be flat (the Cats should burn all the O2 and fuel remnants). Occasionally, the ECU runs a Cat check right after engine start up. It is checking that the Cat output is still 0. The Cats are normally installed right up next to the cast iron exhaust manifolds. This is so they heat up to operating temp immediately and "light off".
When we add long tube headers, we relocate the Cats further down the pipe and now they take longer to light off. Thus, even when you use Cats in a long tube header car, you will occasionally get a check engine light because it did not pass the initial Cat start up check.
Tuners will turn off this report by having the ECM ignore the rear O2 sensor inputs.
Hope this helps.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 139
Likes: 0
From: Lynchburg Va
Very helpful
You will probably get a check engine light. It is not catastropic.
It may help you to understand the purpose of the four different O2 sensors. The front O2 sensors are monitoring air/fuel ratio for each bank and reporting to the ECU which is then adjusting fuel inputs.
The rear O2 sensors are also monitoring air/fuel ratio, but are behind the Cats. Therefore the rear O2 output should be flat (the Cats should burn all the O2 and fuel remnants). Occasionally, the ECU runs a Cat check right after engine start up. It is checking that the Cat output is still 0. The Cats are normally installed right up next to the cast iron exhaust manifolds. This is so they heat up to operating temp immediately and "light off".
When we add long tube headers, we relocate the Cats further down the pipe and now they take longer to light off. Thus, even when you use Cats in a long tube header car, you will occasionally get a check engine light because it did not pass the initial Cat start up check.
Tuners will turn off this report by having the ECM ignore the rear O2 sensor inputs.
Hope this helps.
It may help you to understand the purpose of the four different O2 sensors. The front O2 sensors are monitoring air/fuel ratio for each bank and reporting to the ECU which is then adjusting fuel inputs.
The rear O2 sensors are also monitoring air/fuel ratio, but are behind the Cats. Therefore the rear O2 output should be flat (the Cats should burn all the O2 and fuel remnants). Occasionally, the ECU runs a Cat check right after engine start up. It is checking that the Cat output is still 0. The Cats are normally installed right up next to the cast iron exhaust manifolds. This is so they heat up to operating temp immediately and "light off".
When we add long tube headers, we relocate the Cats further down the pipe and now they take longer to light off. Thus, even when you use Cats in a long tube header car, you will occasionally get a check engine light because it did not pass the initial Cat start up check.
Tuners will turn off this report by having the ECM ignore the rear O2 sensor inputs.
Hope this helps.
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 10,399
Likes: 26
From: Austin Texas
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 6,388
Likes: 2
From: Huntsville AL
