C6 MSD wire/ NGK tr6 issue?!
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 401
Likes: 0
From: Dallas TX
C6 MSD wire/ NGK tr6 issue?!
I actually am having a problems with the MSD wires and the NGK TR6's on my LS2... just wondering if you could give me a hand. Each MSD wire reads between 28-30 ohms and my factory reds read at about 750-800 each. My problems is that when I put the MSD on the car with the Taylor boots I get a "service charging system" and it surges from 11.8 (idling) -14.2 (driving). I took the MSD wires off and the voltage stays about normal at idle (13.1-12.8) and normal while driving (14.2-14.5). I have a red top optima battery... Any Ideas? Any insight will be appreciated. Thanks in advance.
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 20,933
Likes: 905
From: salem OR
I actually am having a problems with the MSD wires and the NGK TR6's on my LS2... just wondering if you could give me a hand. Each MSD wire reads between 28-30 ohms and my factory reds read at about 750-800 each. My problems is that when I put the MSD on the car with the Taylor boots I get a "service charging system" and it surges from 11.8 (idling) -14.2 (driving). I took the MSD wires off and the voltage stays about normal at idle (13.1-12.8) and normal while driving (14.2-14.5). I have a red top optima battery... Any Ideas? Any insight will be appreciated. Thanks in advance.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 401
Likes: 0
From: Dallas TX
well I am saving up to buy some Longtubes and the boots will protect the wires from the heat from the heaters. I dont get it! Why would it cause my volts to drop?
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 20,933
Likes: 905
From: salem OR
They won't melt but I don't get super high temps. Some have talked about this same charging issue. I've never had the trouble.
Run a tr-6 search.
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,790
Likes: 29
From: STL MO
St. Jude Donor '09-'10
Are you sure your wires are snapped all the way on to the plug with the heat sox? Try without them to see if your problem goes away. I run MSD wires with my AR headers, I don't see the need for heat sox with them. I am running TR-5 plugs in my 06.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 401
Likes: 0
From: Dallas TX
UPDATE:
Well I did a few things trynig to to see what the issue was related with:
- NGK TR6's that I installed in 11/09 w/MSD wires and boots = gave "service charging system" and volts would fluxuate between 11.8 (idling) - 14.2 (driving).
- NGKs with stock reds = would cause the voltage to be higher but would never be steady! Voltage would continue to fluxuate.
- NGK's with MSD's without the boots = Same issue, fluxuating voltage and "service charging system" would still come on.
- NGK's with MSD' and switched the coils around = Same
Soooo, since the battery is good and post are tight and no acid on them... and I removed the 12 Volt cable from the alternator to where it wouldnt be near the #1 coil or cable and I was still getting the message and the volts would fluxuate. I decided I am due for a new set up spark plugs anyways... lets change them. I had read to "NOT" gap TR6's... something to do with the electroid or something like that. Well I did some research and found out that they should be gapped around 0.35 with the TR6's. So $17.95 later and 8 TR6's gapped properly with the MSD wires and boots and my voltage only fluxuates from 13.1-13.7 (idling) and 13.8-14.2 (driving) no "Service Charging System" yet!
Thank God!
Now I just need to find out how to fix my rear hatch to open! lol
Well I did a few things trynig to to see what the issue was related with:
- NGK TR6's that I installed in 11/09 w/MSD wires and boots = gave "service charging system" and volts would fluxuate between 11.8 (idling) - 14.2 (driving).
- NGKs with stock reds = would cause the voltage to be higher but would never be steady! Voltage would continue to fluxuate.
- NGK's with MSD's without the boots = Same issue, fluxuating voltage and "service charging system" would still come on.
- NGK's with MSD' and switched the coils around = Same
Soooo, since the battery is good and post are tight and no acid on them... and I removed the 12 Volt cable from the alternator to where it wouldnt be near the #1 coil or cable and I was still getting the message and the volts would fluxuate. I decided I am due for a new set up spark plugs anyways... lets change them. I had read to "NOT" gap TR6's... something to do with the electroid or something like that. Well I did some research and found out that they should be gapped around 0.35 with the TR6's. So $17.95 later and 8 TR6's gapped properly with the MSD wires and boots and my voltage only fluxuates from 13.1-13.7 (idling) and 13.8-14.2 (driving) no "Service Charging System" yet!
Thank God!
Now I just need to find out how to fix my rear hatch to open! lol
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 401
Likes: 0
From: Dallas TX
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Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 20,933
Likes: 905
From: salem OR
UPDATE:
Well I did a few things trynig to to see what the issue was related with:
- NGK TR6's that I installed in 11/09 w/MSD wires and boots = gave "service charging system" and volts would fluxuate between 11.8 (idling) - 14.2 (driving).
- NGKs with stock reds = would cause the voltage to be higher but would never be steady! Voltage would continue to fluxuate.
- NGK's with MSD's without the boots = Same issue, fluxuating voltage and "service charging system" would still come on.
- NGK's with MSD' and switched the coils around = Same
Soooo, since the battery is good and post are tight and no acid on them... and I removed the 12 Volt cable from the alternator to where it wouldnt be near the #1 coil or cable and I was still getting the message and the volts would fluxuate. I decided I am due for a new set up spark plugs anyways... lets change them. I had read to "NOT" gap TR6's... something to do with the electroid or something like that. Well I did some research and found out that they should be gapped around 0.35 with the TR6's. So $17.95 later and 8 TR6's gapped properly with the MSD wires and boots and my voltage only fluxuates from 13.1-13.7 (idling) and 13.8-14.2 (driving) no "Service Charging System" yet!
Thank God!
Now I just need to find out how to fix my rear hatch to open! lol
Well I did a few things trynig to to see what the issue was related with:
- NGK TR6's that I installed in 11/09 w/MSD wires and boots = gave "service charging system" and volts would fluxuate between 11.8 (idling) - 14.2 (driving).
- NGKs with stock reds = would cause the voltage to be higher but would never be steady! Voltage would continue to fluxuate.
- NGK's with MSD's without the boots = Same issue, fluxuating voltage and "service charging system" would still come on.
- NGK's with MSD' and switched the coils around = Same
Soooo, since the battery is good and post are tight and no acid on them... and I removed the 12 Volt cable from the alternator to where it wouldnt be near the #1 coil or cable and I was still getting the message and the volts would fluxuate. I decided I am due for a new set up spark plugs anyways... lets change them. I had read to "NOT" gap TR6's... something to do with the electroid or something like that. Well I did some research and found out that they should be gapped around 0.35 with the TR6's. So $17.95 later and 8 TR6's gapped properly with the MSD wires and boots and my voltage only fluxuates from 13.1-13.7 (idling) and 13.8-14.2 (driving) no "Service Charging System" yet!
Thank God!
Now I just need to find out how to fix my rear hatch to open! lol
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,366
Likes: 9
From: Jacksonville FL
Silly question and a bit off topic, but why run TR6's in an LS2? Is it blown or turbo'd? Other than FI or a radical cam, I don't see a need to step your heat range down, just seems like it would eventually create a lot of deposits that would normally get burned off over time. Just thoughts from my random mind.
Safety Car
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,598
Likes: 78
From: Miami FL
2020 C6 of the Year Finalist - Unmodified
St. Jude Donor '08-'09-'10-'11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16,'17,'18-'19-'20-'21-'22
Plugs and alternator wire, not the MSD wires
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 401
Likes: 0
From: Dallas TX
Silly question and a bit off topic, but why run TR6's in an LS2? Is it blown or turbo'd? Other than FI or a radical cam, I don't see a need to step your heat range down, just seems like it would eventually create a lot of deposits that would normally get burned off over time. Just thoughts from my random mind.
Former Vendor
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,470
Likes: 2
From: Portland OR
St. Jude Donor '10-'11-'12
tr6 is just a cooler heat range, doesn't hurt a thing but it could foul quicker. Most tuners I know will tell you to run the hottest one you can without having an issue.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 401
Likes: 0
From: Dallas TX
"We have seen this problem twice now, and after a little digging we found that GM has a bulletin regarding the 0621 code and spark plugs. It simply states that if any spark plug other than AC Delco iridium plugs are installed this code may appear. The fix was to remove the NGK Tr55 or TR6's and replace with AC Delco factory plugs.
We did this, left the code active in the tune and the customer has had no issues since. The Pulse technology of the NGK plug or other aftermarket plugs must have an interference with the electric systems and cause the service light to come on.
Hope this helps, because we spent many hours trying to resolve this and it came down to a 20 minute plug change.
Jeremy Preston "
Former Vendor
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,470
Likes: 2
From: Portland OR
St. Jude Donor '10-'11-'12
per post #45 on this link:
"We have seen this problem twice now, and after a little digging we found that GM has a bulletin regarding the 0621 code and spark plugs. It simply states that if any spark plug other than AC Delco iridium plugs are installed this code may appear. The fix was to remove the NGK Tr55 or TR6's and replace with AC Delco factory plugs.
We did this, left the code active in the tune and the customer has had no issues since. The Pulse technology of the NGK plug or other aftermarket plugs must have an interference with the electric systems and cause the service light to come on.
Hope this helps, because we spent many hours trying to resolve this and it came down to a 20 minute plug change.
Jeremy Preston "
"We have seen this problem twice now, and after a little digging we found that GM has a bulletin regarding the 0621 code and spark plugs. It simply states that if any spark plug other than AC Delco iridium plugs are installed this code may appear. The fix was to remove the NGK Tr55 or TR6's and replace with AC Delco factory plugs.
We did this, left the code active in the tune and the customer has had no issues since. The Pulse technology of the NGK plug or other aftermarket plugs must have an interference with the electric systems and cause the service light to come on.
Hope this helps, because we spent many hours trying to resolve this and it came down to a 20 minute plug change.
Jeremy Preston "
Ya ok and you should only use GM wires as well. 
MSD and NGK is one of the most popular and widely used combinations on the LS engines in the world. Whats next Ford telling you to only use Motorcraft? Or do they? LOL
One of the most widely respected members/vendor/mechanic/tuning guru on this board uses the NGK by the truck load with zero complaints. I've also seen someone try and say piston slap was rod knock from the wrong oil on here as well.. so ... take it for what its worth. If there was an issue it would be well know and widely publicized.
Last edited by 99blancoss; Sep 7, 2010 at 10:39 PM.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 401
Likes: 0
From: Dallas TX
yeah that link pretty much tells you everything you have to do to have the "service charging system" removed, if the alternator is working properly and the battery is fine also. Good fine!
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 401
Likes: 0
From: Dallas TX
Ya ok and you should only use GM wires as well. MSD and NGK is one of the most popular and widely used combinations on the LS engines in the world. Whats next Ford telling you to only use Motorcraft? Or do they? LOL
One of the most widely respected members/vendor/mechanic/tuning guru on this board uses the NGK by the truck load with zero complaints. I've also seen someone try and say piston slap was rod knock from the wrong oil on here as well.. so ... take it for what its worth. If there was an issue it would be well know and widely publicized.
