This is particularly a problem with positive displacement s/c. You can pulley down a centri to make it pretty responsive. With a meth injection kit, heat soak is kept in check on centris.
Supercharger Question...
Thread Starter
Go Canes!
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 5,975
Likes: 329
From: Boca Raton FL
St. Jude Donor '11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16-'17-'18-'19-'20-'21
Supercharger Question...
I am considering a supercharger in the near future for my C-6 convertible and wanted to know the thoughts on a centrifical Prochargee vs a top mounted Magnacharger. Here are the pro & cons that I have learned, but I dont know if they are right....
Magnacharger...
Always on
Low maintenance
quicker low end torque
Cost installed with tune with a Magnavold Fuel system...
$8K - including a painted hood to fit.
Procharger..
Fits under stock hood.
Not always on, power when you need it.
Needs maintenance (changing oil in unit)
Cost installed with tune..
$7.5K
This is what I have been told, but I never tested either.
Which is better? The car is seldom taken to the track, but I will go more with the F/I unit.
Thx
Magnacharger...
Always on
Low maintenance
quicker low end torque
Cost installed with tune with a Magnavold Fuel system...
$8K - including a painted hood to fit.
Procharger..
Fits under stock hood.
Not always on, power when you need it.
Needs maintenance (changing oil in unit)
Cost installed with tune..
$7.5K
This is what I have been told, but I never tested either.
Which is better? The car is seldom taken to the track, but I will go more with the F/I unit.
Thx
Burning Brakes
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 908
Likes: 66
From: Lower RGV
St. Jude Donor '10-'11-'12
Former Vendor
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,470
Likes: 2
From: Portland OR
St. Jude Donor '10-'11-'12
Well it means a few different things depending on what your talking about but for this case here is a quote:
It should be part of your research.. here is another helpful quote
you should be doing the searching and looking for as much information as you can, not just on here but the internet as well... lots of info to be had out there, you just need to look for it.
When you heat soak todays engines, especially supercharged, the computer sees a hotter air coming in and backs off the fueling and spark to help resist knock retard. As all know, cold air makes power. A blower of course raises the intake temps. So a heat soaked engine doesnt have the timing and fuel being added to a non heat soaked engine, hence more power.
Efficiency and heat soak are two completely different parameters.
Lets say we stick the supercharger in the trunk where the heat soak factor is zero. Is that it now: we have a good design? Or maybe the plumbing run from the trunk to the front of the car will incurr massive losses?
How about the fact that centrifugal superchargers have a lot less heat soak than positive displacement ones since they don't sit atop of the engine, but also produce virtually zero boost whatsoever below 2000RPM: Irrelevant?
At zero PSI boost, most positive displacement superchargers near 100% efficiency. Lets run very little boost then; after all, efficiency is all that matters?
Get my point? Each design has its advantages and disadvantages. Heat soak is a tiny portion of the overall equation; you have to understant all the factors and how they interact with each other, you can't just pick one because it is the easiest one to visualize and then base your entire decision on that. Case in point: The eaton top mounted positive displacement supercharger is the most heat soak prone blower design on the market today. Still, it is precisely what GM decided to use on the Corvette ZR-1, and it is also the supercharger of choice for most of the AMG Mercedes Benz line, the new Audi RS-4, etc etc... Are all auto manufacturers stupid, or are the other factors like reliability, ease of packaging, boost response, area under the curve, noise, etc more important overal? Does that mean if I want to build a drag car I need to pick an Eaton? No, a centrifugal would work better there. Is the centrifugal better under all circumstances? No. Is a turbo better under some circunstances? Yes. Is a turbo better all the time? No.... Etc etc etc... You asked a very simple question, but it doesn't have a simple answer. You have to determine exactly what you want your car to do, and what its intended usage will be, and then you pick the system that will suit you best.
Lets say we stick the supercharger in the trunk where the heat soak factor is zero. Is that it now: we have a good design? Or maybe the plumbing run from the trunk to the front of the car will incurr massive losses?
How about the fact that centrifugal superchargers have a lot less heat soak than positive displacement ones since they don't sit atop of the engine, but also produce virtually zero boost whatsoever below 2000RPM: Irrelevant?
At zero PSI boost, most positive displacement superchargers near 100% efficiency. Lets run very little boost then; after all, efficiency is all that matters?
Get my point? Each design has its advantages and disadvantages. Heat soak is a tiny portion of the overall equation; you have to understant all the factors and how they interact with each other, you can't just pick one because it is the easiest one to visualize and then base your entire decision on that. Case in point: The eaton top mounted positive displacement supercharger is the most heat soak prone blower design on the market today. Still, it is precisely what GM decided to use on the Corvette ZR-1, and it is also the supercharger of choice for most of the AMG Mercedes Benz line, the new Audi RS-4, etc etc... Are all auto manufacturers stupid, or are the other factors like reliability, ease of packaging, boost response, area under the curve, noise, etc more important overal? Does that mean if I want to build a drag car I need to pick an Eaton? No, a centrifugal would work better there. Is the centrifugal better under all circumstances? No. Is a turbo better under some circunstances? Yes. Is a turbo better all the time? No.... Etc etc etc... You asked a very simple question, but it doesn't have a simple answer. You have to determine exactly what you want your car to do, and what its intended usage will be, and then you pick the system that will suit you best.
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 179
Likes: 2
From: Lincoln California
I am considering a supercharger in the near future for my C-6 convertible and wanted to know the thoughts on a centrifical Prochargee vs a top mounted Magnacharger. Here are the pro & cons that I have learned, but I dont know if they are right....
Magnacharger...
Always on
Low maintenance
quicker low end torque
Cost installed with tune with a Magnavold Fuel system...
$8K - including a painted hood to fit.
Procharger..
Fits under stock hood.
Not always on, power when you need it.
Needs maintenance (changing oil in unit)
Cost installed with tune..
$7.5K
This is what I have been told, but I never tested either.
Which is better? The car is seldom taken to the track, but I will go more with the F/I unit.
Thx
Magnacharger...
Always on
Low maintenance
quicker low end torque
Cost installed with tune with a Magnavold Fuel system...
$8K - including a painted hood to fit.
Procharger..
Fits under stock hood.
Not always on, power when you need it.
Needs maintenance (changing oil in unit)
Cost installed with tune..
$7.5K
This is what I have been told, but I never tested either.
Which is better? The car is seldom taken to the track, but I will go more with the F/I unit.
Thx
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Thread Starter
Go Canes!
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 5,975
Likes: 329
From: Boca Raton FL
St. Jude Donor '11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16-'17-'18-'19-'20-'21
Well it means a few different things depending on what your talking about but for this case here is a quote:
It should be part of your research.. here is another helpful quote
you should be doing the searching and looking for as much information as you can, not just on here but the internet as well... lots of info to be had out there, you just need to look for it.
It should be part of your research.. here is another helpful quote
you should be doing the searching and looking for as much information as you can, not just on here but the internet as well... lots of info to be had out there, you just need to look for it.
I want eye candy, but I want power also.. I only have headers (with the stock mufflers) and intake on the car, and it is plenty fast. I dont drive like a lunatic, but I do like to get on it now and then. I definately need bragging rights with a buddy who just bout a 560 HP supercharged Caddy, and I am behind him with my Vette!!! So.... The things I like about a centrifical unit is the fact that it is very streetable at the lower RPMs, what scares me is that I was told that you need to change the centrifical's oil when you change the engine's oil. Also, there is the noise factor. My car is a convertible and I like to talk when I am with my girl in the car.
Are the oild changes on the centrifical a big deal? Would it not be easier to get a magnacharger or edelbrock. All the options will produce MORE than enough power for me.
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 41,732
Likes: 1,718
From: Springfield MO
Check out the Edelbrock E-force units. Top mounted TVS2300 unit, looks like a factory install, every nut, bolt and washer comes with the kit, including a hand held tune. They sell for around $7,000, but I see some vendors offering free installs. The 554 hp unit does not require the Z06 fuel pump, but the 599 hp unit does, making it a more expensive kit to purchase and increases the installation difficulty, thus more cost.
It also fits under your stock hood, saving you $$$$$$.
It also fits under your stock hood, saving you $$$$$$.
Thread Starter
Go Canes!
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 5,975
Likes: 329
From: Boca Raton FL
St. Jude Donor '11-'12-'13-'14-'15-'16-'17-'18-'19-'20-'21
Check out the Edelbrock E-force units. Top mounted TVS2300 unit, looks like a factory install, every nut, bolt and washer comes with the kit, including a hand held tune. They sell for around $7,000, but I see some vendors offering free installs. The 554 hp unit does not require the Z06 fuel pump, but the 599 hp unit does, making it a more expensive kit to purchase and increases the installation difficulty, thus more cost.
It also fits under your stock hood, saving you $$$$$$.
It also fits under your stock hood, saving you $$$$$$.
Pro
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 719
Likes: 14
From: Poplar Bluff, MO
St. Jude Contributor
As 99blacoss said, you will be well served to ask this question in the FI section of the forum. There are lots of guys over there with both centrifugal and roots blowers as well as forum vendors that can answer all your questions. Link http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-f...n-nitrous-123/
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 212
Likes: 3
From: Melbourne Florida
Honestly, you really want to keep your factory hood because with a new hood you will need to blend the paint into the fenders and you really do not want to do that...Defin would weigh my decision as well.
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 41,732
Likes: 1,718
From: Springfield MO
Premium Supporting Vendor
Joined: Oct 2004
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From: Providing the most proven supercharger kits for your C5/6/7 609-752-0321
Feel free to give us a call if you would like to discuss your options, we sell and install every type of supercharger for the Corvette, and can give you real world reviews and pro's and con's for each.
Along with that, we also manufacture our own centrifugal kit that blows away the theory of a centri not having any low end TQ by our kit design.
Along with that, we also manufacture our own centrifugal kit that blows away the theory of a centri not having any low end TQ by our kit design.
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C5/C6 and C7 Supercharging Specialist
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C5/C6 and C7 Supercharging Specialist
ECS Supercharger Kits / Mantic Clutches
www.EastCoastSupercharging.com
Facebook Page
ECS YouTube Channel
Former Vendor
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,482
Likes: 3
From: Carmichael ca
I've installed a couple of Edelbrock Superchargers on C6s recently and the throttle response is awesome They have an intercooler that helps reduce heat soak and like has been said, it fits under the stock hood. They are pretty quiet also, so its a real sleeper set up.
They have an intercooler that helps reduce heat soak and like has been said, it fits under the stock hood. They are pretty quiet also, so its a real sleeper set up.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,999
Likes: 1,684
From: Southeast TX
Find both and drive them (or at least bum a ride). You won't find one that makes more power that's USABLE on the street than a TVS setup. They make extra power in an RPM band that you actually use on a daily basis. Boost comes in just over idle. If you want big power numbers in the upper RPM range that you rarely use, get the centri. If you want the feel of an extra 200 cubic inches under the hood at all times, go for the TVS. Stock like fuel eco with either. Just kinda depends on what you're looking for.
You can make a TVS deliver power like a centri....with the TVS, just don't push too hard on the acc pedal until you see 4000+ rpm
You can make a TVS deliver power like a centri....with the TVS, just don't push too hard on the acc pedal until you see 4000+ rpm
Safety Car
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 4,537
Likes: 1,403
From: Bethesda MD
Then you can remove the plate and have enough power to ensure your engine is gone in 10,000 miles. 
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 5,578
Likes: 61
From: Austin TX
Find both and drive them (or at least bum a ride). You won't find one that makes more power that's USABLE on the street than a TVS setup. They make extra power in an RPM band that you actually use on a daily basis. Boost comes in just over idle. If you want big power numbers in the upper RPM range that you rarely use, get the centri. If you want the feel of an extra 200 cubic inches under the hood at all times, go for the TVS. Stock like fuel eco with either. Just kinda depends on what you're looking for.
The vast majority of your driving the rpm is near idle! Well below 2000 rpm, and many times below 1500 rpm. If you want to feel extra power under normal driving, the TVS type blowers can't be beat.