Best Cold Air Intake for my c6?
11-10-2013, 11:06 AM
#21
Race Director
I answered your question several times... your the one who refused to read what others have posted.
Ok... Here it goes Dennis... The answer to your question AGAIN!!!
More un restrictive, Non turbulent, cool air. (With a big credit to the "NON TURBULENT"
That is why you saw the gains you are seeing!
I honestly feel your giving way to much credit to the placement of the air scoop when you should be giving it to the actual intake design!
I have been trying to suggest to you that the design of the VR may be the reason so many people are seeing such great gains. I believe the placement of the scoop is just one small part of it.
And again, I know your going to keep asking the question so here is the answer AGAIN!
More un restrictive, Non turbulent, cool air.
Honestly Dennis, your the worst possible representative for the Vararam intake could possibly have...your trash talking scares anyone who may be on the fence for one away... They really should do some damage control where ever you post about their intake.
SPEED SAFE, AIR RAM
Ok... Here it goes Dennis... The answer to your question AGAIN!!!
More un restrictive, Non turbulent, cool air. (With a big credit to the "NON TURBULENT"
That is why you saw the gains you are seeing!
I honestly feel your giving way to much credit to the placement of the air scoop when you should be giving it to the actual intake design!
I have been trying to suggest to you that the design of the VR may be the reason so many people are seeing such great gains. I believe the placement of the scoop is just one small part of it.
And again, I know your going to keep asking the question so here is the answer AGAIN!
More un restrictive, Non turbulent, cool air.
Honestly Dennis, your the worst possible representative for the Vararam intake could possibly have...your trash talking scares anyone who may be on the fence for one away... They really should do some damage control where ever you post about their intake.
SPEED SAFE, AIR RAM
it is the PLACEMENT OF THE AIR INTAKE IT REACHES AMBIENT SOONER, AND AIR IS FORCED INTO IT A SPEED AND MORE AT FASTER SPEEDS and they front intake can be placed wrong if not installed correctly, I know that's hard for your simple mind to comprehend, I guess your no common sense attitude cant let you see when your wrong, but while you were dreaming of going fast and trying to figure out how I was already doing it as far as me being a Representative of vararam they dont feel your sentiments, I also have there new Great headers & x pipes high flow catts that are setting. records, no matter how big of a jerkoff you are, or i am the vararam works and the fastest cars prove it. and i am one of them proving it
11-10-2013, 11:33 AM
#22
Le Mans Master
The funny thing is Dennis... your the only one I have ever heard who suggested the Vararam does not work. Even in the last tread you attacked everyone in; nobody suggested the Vararam did not work except you...You need to get control of those voices in your head.
We did inform you that your gains had nothing to do with Ram Air... but other than that nobody said it was a bad intake... Perhaps you should see a doc about those voices... Just saying.
On a side note... it does look monstrous under the hood and I like the fact that its making use of all the available space. And I agree that the plastic should not make a difference unless its weak and flimsy, I have never installed one so I cant speak for the quality but the size and shape shown in the picture above appears to be a decent intake.
SPEED SAFE, AIR RAM
We did inform you that your gains had nothing to do with Ram Air... but other than that nobody said it was a bad intake... Perhaps you should see a doc about those voices... Just saying.
On a side note... it does look monstrous under the hood and I like the fact that its making use of all the available space. And I agree that the plastic should not make a difference unless its weak and flimsy, I have never installed one so I cant speak for the quality but the size and shape shown in the picture above appears to be a decent intake.
SPEED SAFE, AIR RAM
I do also agree that this topic has been discussed before and should be a sticky.
11-10-2013, 12:37 PM
#23
Burning Brakes
Haha thank you AirRam Dennis clearly has passion behind his thinking. The thing that Dennis doesn't understand that this is open forum and everyone has opinion including him. The fact that he feels that Vararam is he best intake is great I get it but when you compare an aftermarket intake to the stock intake that plain ignorant. This thread was created because someone was asking for opinions and thoughts about C6 intakes.
I do also agree that this topic has been discussed before and should be a sticky.
I do also agree that this topic has been discussed before and should be a sticky.
Originally Posted by Mark Twain
'Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.'
SPEED SAFE, AIR RAM
Last edited by AIR_RAM; 11-10-2013 at 12:53 PM.
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nobucks (06-19-2020)
11-10-2013, 01:09 PM
#24
Race Director
This is directly from the horses mouth
The actual gain from Ram effect is much higher than what is listed. Even if there was ZERO pressure rise. The intercooling of the entire induction system is what you are after.
If you start a car on planet earth and bring it to operating temp, the air temp INSIDE the intake manifold plenum will rise. On an LS-3, we see about 20-60 deg above ambient temp. If the MAF is reading ambient, you will still see 20-40 deg temp rise above ambient in normal operating conditions. That's a 2-4 % gain in power with ZERO pressure rise, because the runners of the manifold are pulling actual ambient temp air.
A stock LS-3 is Below 14.7 PSI after 4800RPM they drop from 14.5-14.6 to 14.10 PSI up to 5800 RPM.
People tend to look at peak numbers in a data log but not inside the actual log itself.
Your actual HP gain is the DA change inside the intake manifold + pressure.
That's about 13 HP from the pressure gained and 14hp gain from the DA change inside the manifold (385 Rear Wheel HP stock LS-3). That's a stone solid 27 rear wheel HP gain and this does not include any gains on the Dyno or from tuning etc...
Hope this helps VR Tech
If you start a car on planet earth and bring it to operating temp, the air temp INSIDE the intake manifold plenum will rise. On an LS-3, we see about 20-60 deg above ambient temp. If the MAF is reading ambient, you will still see 20-40 deg temp rise above ambient in normal operating conditions. That's a 2-4 % gain in power with ZERO pressure rise, because the runners of the manifold are pulling actual ambient temp air.
A stock LS-3 is Below 14.7 PSI after 4800RPM they drop from 14.5-14.6 to 14.10 PSI up to 5800 RPM.
People tend to look at peak numbers in a data log but not inside the actual log itself.
Your actual HP gain is the DA change inside the intake manifold + pressure.
That's about 13 HP from the pressure gained and 14hp gain from the DA change inside the manifold (385 Rear Wheel HP stock LS-3). That's a stone solid 27 rear wheel HP gain and this does not include any gains on the Dyno or from tuning etc...
Hope this helps VR Tech
"The air Speed at your throttle body at WOT will be well over 150MPH+"
Actually, this is not correct for this application.
The problem is that most people/companies assume airflow/velocity values that are too high for the actual running engine. The air speed at the throttle body as measured at 5,800 RPM on a stock LS-3 is only about 37 MPH, its “NOT” some astronomical number.
This air speed correlates with mass airflow meter readings in LB’s/Min using a 4.0 ID tube 1-2 inches in front of the throttle body. If the air speed were 150 MPH the MAF sensor would spike and peak out of its HZ range around 2,500 RPM.
It’s important to note that, every engine is different based on HP/cubic inch, Intake manifold plenum volume, crank firing interval and inlet diameter. (The LS engines fire one cylinder per half crank rotation)
We probe into every intake/intake manifold in several key areas during on road testing. This is done to establish the peak MPH number we have to break to create Ram effect for a particular engine. This also produces a multitude of data, from Air temp to pressure drop, allowing us to establish the flow and thermal dynamic efficiency of a particular stock or modified system.
The old LS-6 Motor was 55 MPH, current Dodge Hemi engines are 43-45MPH.These are all similar engines with different inlet diameters and manifold plenum volumes.
The ability of a device or part to flow air as measured on a flow bench and the engines actual airflow requirements in dynamic running conditions are very different.
Hope this clears up the confusion on air speed required for Ram effect on an LS-3 engine.
VR Tech.
Actually, this is not correct for this application.
The problem is that most people/companies assume airflow/velocity values that are too high for the actual running engine. The air speed at the throttle body as measured at 5,800 RPM on a stock LS-3 is only about 37 MPH, its “NOT” some astronomical number.
This air speed correlates with mass airflow meter readings in LB’s/Min using a 4.0 ID tube 1-2 inches in front of the throttle body. If the air speed were 150 MPH the MAF sensor would spike and peak out of its HZ range around 2,500 RPM.
It’s important to note that, every engine is different based on HP/cubic inch, Intake manifold plenum volume, crank firing interval and inlet diameter. (The LS engines fire one cylinder per half crank rotation)
We probe into every intake/intake manifold in several key areas during on road testing. This is done to establish the peak MPH number we have to break to create Ram effect for a particular engine. This also produces a multitude of data, from Air temp to pressure drop, allowing us to establish the flow and thermal dynamic efficiency of a particular stock or modified system.
The old LS-6 Motor was 55 MPH, current Dodge Hemi engines are 43-45MPH.These are all similar engines with different inlet diameters and manifold plenum volumes.
The ability of a device or part to flow air as measured on a flow bench and the engines actual airflow requirements in dynamic running conditions are very different.
Hope this clears up the confusion on air speed required for Ram effect on an LS-3 engine.
VR Tech.
11-10-2013, 01:15 PM
#25
Race Director
11-10-2013, 01:41 PM
#26
Race Director
I answered your question several times... your the one who refused to read what others have posted.
Ok... Here it goes Dennis... The answer to your question AGAIN!!!
I honestly feel your giving way to much credit to the placement of the air scoop when you should be giving it to the actual intake design!
placement of the scoop is just one small part of it.
AIR RAM
Ok... Here it goes Dennis... The answer to your question AGAIN!!!
I honestly feel your giving way to much credit to the placement of the air scoop when you should be giving it to the actual intake design!
placement of the scoop is just one small part of it.
AIR RAM
11-10-2013, 02:20 PM
#28
Hey guys. I am new to this and just bought my first Corvette. A sweet '07 Z51 (completely stock with Paddle Shifters) and very low miles. I picked her up near sea level and was blown away by the performance along the 1,000 mile ride home to Colorado. I know its not a Z06 but for an old dude like me it really made me smile. The disappointment hit the next morning when I realized what 7,200 ft. MSL can do to ones performance. I had lost nearly 100 HP and it felt like a whole different car. Short of going for a turbo or supercharger which I can't do I need to learn more about how to get some of this power back. It would seem that better air flow would be a good start and maybe a programmer too (?) but I am starting from scratch and trying to find bolt-on or programming solutions to my high elevation issues without having to make mechanical changes to the vehicle itself. I could really use some solid advice. I posted here first because i know that better airflow will be a big part of this equation. Thanks for whatever you can offer.
Last edited by ColoradoZ51; 11-10-2013 at 02:23 PM.
11-10-2013, 03:02 PM
#30
Race Director
Hey guys. I am new to this and just bought my first Corvette. A sweet '07 Z51 (completely stock with Paddle Shifters) and very low miles. I picked her up near sea level and was blown away by the performance along the 1,000 mile ride home to Colorado. I know its not a Z06 but for an old dude like me it really made me smile. The disappointment hit the next morning when I realized what 7,200 ft. MSL can do to ones performance. I had lost nearly 100 HP and it felt like a whole different car. Short of going for a turbo or supercharger which I can't do I need to learn more about how to get some of this power back. It would seem that better air flow would be a good start and maybe a programmer too (?) but I am starting from scratch and trying to find bolt-on or programming solutions to my high elevation issues without having to make mechanical changes to the vehicle itself. I could really use some solid advice. I posted here first because i know that better airflow will be a big part of this equation. Thanks for whatever you can offer.
11-10-2013, 04:50 PM
#31
Burning Brakes
But I think you may be confusing the LS3 "INTAKE MANIFOLD" which is considered well designed and little to be gained with the FAST 102 unlike the factory LS2 intake where the LS2 shows huge gains by replacing the intake manifold. Many people say the LS3 comes from the factory with a great intake manifold.
As for "Cold Air Induction Systems" AKA "Intakes" are all worth 10-15 RWHP on a DYNO... and most of them will show noticeable improvement at speed.
I hope this clears it up for you.
Hey guys. I am new to this and just bought my first Corvette. A sweet '07 Z51 (completely stock with Paddle Shifters) and very low miles. I picked her up near sea level and was blown away by the performance along the 1,000 mile ride home to Colorado. I know its not a Z06 but for an old dude like me it really made me smile. The disappointment hit the next morning when I realized what 7,200 ft. MSL can do to ones performance. I had lost nearly 100 HP and it felt like a whole different car. Short of going for a turbo or supercharger which I can't do I need to learn more about how to get some of this power back. It would seem that better air flow would be a good start and maybe a programmer too (?) but I am starting from scratch and trying to find bolt-on or programming solutions to my high elevation issues without having to make mechanical changes to the vehicle itself. I could really use some solid advice. I posted here first because i know that better airflow will be a big part of this equation. Thanks for whatever you can offer.
Or a custom tune will also help... But I think you just need to drive it more where your at... Most the power should come back.
SPEED SAFE, AIR RAM
Last edited by AIR_RAM; 11-10-2013 at 05:10 PM.
11-10-2013, 06:32 PM
#32
Race Director
Im sure the factory Cold Air Intake is good for the masses... But you will not break any land speed track records with the factory intake on your engine.
But I think you may be confusing the LS3 "INTAKE MANIFOLD" which is considered well designed and little to be gained with the FAST 102 unlike the factory LS2 intake where the LS2 shows huge gains by replacing the intake manifold. Many people say the LS3 comes from the factory with a great intake manifold.
As for "Cold Air Induction Systems" AKA "Intakes" are all worth 10-15 RWHP on a DYNO... and most of them will show noticeable improvement at speed.
I hope this clears it up for you.
You may need to let your PCM adjust to the higher altitude atmospheric pressure. I would take it for several trips around town and see if that does not bring some of your power back. The PCM can take up to 100-400 miles to adjust.
Or a custom tune will also help... But I think you just need to drive it more where your at... Most the power should come back.
SPEED SAFE, AIR RAM
But I think you may be confusing the LS3 "INTAKE MANIFOLD" which is considered well designed and little to be gained with the FAST 102 unlike the factory LS2 intake where the LS2 shows huge gains by replacing the intake manifold. Many people say the LS3 comes from the factory with a great intake manifold.
As for "Cold Air Induction Systems" AKA "Intakes" are all worth 10-15 RWHP on a DYNO... and most of them will show noticeable improvement at speed.
I hope this clears it up for you.
You may need to let your PCM adjust to the higher altitude atmospheric pressure. I would take it for several trips around town and see if that does not bring some of your power back. The PCM can take up to 100-400 miles to adjust.
Or a custom tune will also help... But I think you just need to drive it more where your at... Most the power should come back.
SPEED SAFE, AIR RAM
:lol :sea level to 7000 ft and most the power will come back, and im trying to prove you dont no jack **** about cai, i wont even bother to try, the masses really know you dont no now
11-10-2013, 06:51 PM
#33
Race Director
Next; "Drive it more"; Driving won't add Horse Power, the car's computer can't adjust that much for less oxygen and high altitude.
Next; "Most of the power will come back". A tune will help BUT it's never going to ring back anything close to low altitude power.
11-10-2013, 07:04 PM
#34
Tolero Apto Victum
Also, please see post #8. Good Luck, ColoradoZ51.
11-10-2013, 07:20 PM
#35
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/memb...inmonster.html
Also, please see post #8. Good Luck, ColoradoZ51.
Also, please see post #8. Good Luck, ColoradoZ51.
11-10-2013, 07:26 PM
#36
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/memb...inmonster.html
Also, please see post #8. Good Luck, ColoradoZ51.
Also, please see post #8. Good Luck, ColoradoZ51.
I will keep trying to get more info on this design.
11-10-2013, 07:42 PM
#37
Race Director
Thanks for all of your replies. I have driven it approximately 400 miles since arriving in Colorado and in fact I found myself at 11,000 feet just an hour ago heading up to Silverton. The car definitely feels a little better now since arriving here and putting on some miles (which is what the GM dealer also told me would happen to some extent) but I still have long way to go. I have been a pilot for 30 years so I know what density altitude does to a normally aspirated piston engine so I am not kidding myself here. I'm not going to get all of the power back no matter what I do but if I could get 40 HP with a good cold air induction and a chip (maybe?) I would be happy.
11-10-2013, 07:58 PM
#38
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Wich Dr (01-03-2021)
11-10-2013, 08:08 PM
#39
Burning Brakes
LMAO...
I love it when a jack *** sticks his foot I his mouth!
SPEED SAFE, AIR RAM
I love it when a jack *** sticks his foot I his mouth!
SPEED SAFE, AIR RAM
11-10-2013, 08:11 PM
#40
Race Director