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Are people really this small minded?? Tired of explaining it over and over.
Maybe another beer or two and it will come....
Race cars and aircraft use safety wire on drilled head bolts and fasteners. Guess those industries are small minded. And please explain it to me one more time. Your solution to drill the bolt flange is not an industry accepted solution. But , can't fix stupid.
Race cars and aircraft use safety wire on drilled head bolts and fasteners. Guess those industries are small minded. And please explain it to me one more time. Your solution to drill the bolt flange is not an industry accepted solution. But , can't fix stupid.
Well, the beer obviously didn't help...maybe try sober.
Thanks for the beer, now,, where the head of the bolt joins the shank of the bolt, they grind a radius. Look at a rated bolt and you will see it. This is there to stop stress cracking. If the bolt-shank /head interface was just a sharp edge, a crack can and will develop, causing fastener failure. When you drilled the bolt head flange, you may have drilled throught this radius , leaving sharp edges, and a crack can form at this location.
I know pinning the damper is done, but it's is not the correct way to solve this problem.
Thanks for the beer, now,, where the head of the bolt joins the shank of the bolt, they grind a radius. Look at a rated bolt and you will see it. This is there to stop stress cracking. If the bolt-shank /head interface was just a sharp edge, a crack can and will develop, causing fastener failure. When you drilled the bolt head flange, you may have drilled throught this radius , leaving sharp edges, and a crack can form at this location.
I know pinning the bolt is done, but it's is not the correct way to solve this problem.
AKA undercut shoulder. The only way to achieve a radius between the head and shoulder.
Thanks for the beer, now,, where the head of the bolt joins the shank of the bolt, they grind a radius. Look at a rated bolt and you will see it. This is there to stop stress cracking. If the bolt-shank /head interface was just a sharp edge, a crack can and will develop, causing fastener failure. When you drilled the bolt head flange, you may have drilled throught this radius , leaving sharp edges, and a crack can form at this location.
I know pinning the bolt is done, but it's is not the correct way to solve this problem.
Wow, it's just going down a serious rabbit hole now, and I feel like I'm taking advantage and high jacking the OPs thread. So, I'm going to explain how to get this pin out if I ever have to replace the HB. And once you see the solution, you're going to slap your head and realize just how simple this design is.
If I ever have to remove the HB, all I need to do is:
1. Pull the engine
2. Disassemble and remove the crankshaft w/HB attached
3. Take the assembly to a machine shop and have the bolt head milled off.
4. Drill out the bolt
5. Drill a new pilot hole for the next larger sized bolt.
6. Tap for the larger bolt
7. Reassemble the engine
8. Reassemble the HB with a larger bolt
9. Repin the bolt head
10. Install the engine
11. Done
Now, why in the world would you even think safety wire is easier than that? Feel pretty foolish now huh?
Wow, it's just going down a serious rabbit hole now, and I feel like I'm taking advantage and high jacking the OPs thread. So, I'm going to explain how to get this pin out if I ever have to replace the HB. And once you see the solution, you're going to slap your head and realize just how simple this design is.
If I ever have to remove the HB, all I need to do is:
1. Pull the engine
2. Disassemble and remove the crankshaft w/HB attached
3. Take the assembly to a machine shop and have the bolt head milled off.
4. Drill out the bolt
5. Drill a new pilot hole for the next larger sized bolt.
6. Tap for the larger bolt
7. Reassemble the engine
8. Reassemble the HB with a larger bolt
9. Repin the bolt head
10. Install the engine
11. Done
Now, why in the world would you even think safety wire is easier than that? Feel pretty foolish now huh?
I was being kind and trying not to LMAO....This guy makes it hard to do...Beside, I was having too much fun stringing along the safety wire.
Ok, when you pin a damper, you drill the hole into the crankshaft and damper hub . Then the damper will not spin on the crank, as you have created a key. You use a drill jig to get the proper angle to center the drill on the edge of the crankshaft snout and the damper hub. Then you install the bolt and safety wire the bolt head to the damper body. Drilling through and pinning the bolt head is not the correct way ..your lack of machining skill is showing. ARP Makes a kit with the correct drill guide and high strength bolt. Might want to look into this before your next beer.
If the hub is pinned it SHOULD not spin on the crank...thus a safety wire technically could hold the bolt in its place (IFF the pin stays put).
*edit* dam too slow
If the hub is pinned CORRECTLY it should not spin, thus safety wire on a cross drilled bolt head will stop the bolt from moving. The drill guide controls the drill bit angle. The hole is not square to the damper face as the crank snout is tapered.
So,,,,,,, don't drill the bolt flange and install a pin throught the bolt flange.
Angle drill the crank snout and damper hub with the correct drill guide. Ream the hole to correct size for proper interference fit , install hardened pin, install bolt , safety wire the bolt. Done this many times in our engine shop.
And no beer until quitting time, anyone else laughing?
OK Thanks, can you tell if the pulley assembly shifted off the rubber lined hub, or has the bolt come loose (or both)?
I asked about years BC it seems that 2005s had more (or most) frequencies of losing the bolt. GM made a change, but 2006s might have also used the old bolt design. ALL C6 years have failures of the HB, but in later years, the rubber fit is poor resulting in just the pulleys wobbling or leaving the hubs.
A challenge you're going to have in a DIY, is how much pressure is the HB exerting on the steering rack. The rack needs to first move upwards, before it will come out of its brackets. The HB might have to be cut off first. This will be tough w/o a lift.
Not sure what your plans are for replacement or future performance mods, but it might pay to look into an aftermarket HB like Powerbond or ATI. Both are far better and more reliable replacements than another GM unit.
If you have performance mods in mind, especially supercharging, it would pay to pin the HB while you're replacing it. Pinning this press fit unit to the crankshaft ensures you're not going to spin it or lose it again especially with the HP/TQ you can develop with boost. Also, the new style GM bolt is preferred. GM finally got that right.
When I pinned mine, I chose an extra step of capturing the bolt in the pinning as well. Now there is no chance I'll lose the HB or the bolt. There is only one other C6 that I know of that is pinned this way.
It's a longer story and off topic, so I won't go into the details, but along with pinning the bolt, I changed the torque specs as I am not a fan of torque to yield when I can create a work around, which I did with the pin.
And he is not a fan of "torque to yield " guess he knows more than the bolt and fastener industry engineers and manufacturers. Amazing!
You, sir, need to do some reading about the real world. And nice job pounding in your pin, looks like you hit the bolt head a few times. Maybe try it with one eye closed
Hey, could you check my spelling too while you're in there? Sentence structure? Punctuation? Let me know if I think I know more than all the English Language scholars too...ha ha....
Hey, could you check my spelling too while you're in there? Sentence structure? Punctuation? Let me know if I think I know more than all the English Language scholars too...ha ha....
Go to Off Topic, they will take care of your problems.
In the mean time, you never thanked me for all my hard work and information I shared with you.
If not, post your picture of how you pin your lug nuts
Go to Off Topic, they will take care of your problems.
In the mean time, you never thanked me for all my hard work and information I shared with you.
If not, post your picture of how you pin your lug nuts
This happens every time an internet alley mechanic tries his hand at reverse engineering. The first assumption made was incorrect, so an incorrect conclusion was drawn. Thereafter, more incorrect assumptions were made drawing more incorrect conclusions.
And, that is why, every time the rooster puffs his chest and crows, I find it funnier and funnier...
Go to Off Topic, they will take care of your problems.
In the mean time, you never thanked me for all my hard work and information I shared with you.
If not, post your picture of how you pin your lug nuts
Hey man, you're not giving up are you? Sorry if I shut you down. Didn't mean to call you an alley mechanic. I take that back.
I think you were on to something with the bolt torques. Can you expand on it? What's your take on torque to yield? I think you were on to something there...you had me thinking...
I know you spent a lot of time researching stuff for two days. Don't let all that hard work go down the tubes. What's your experience with torquing bolts?
Hey man, you're not giving up are you? Sorry if I shut you down. Didn't mean to call you an alley mechanic. I take that back.
I think you were on to something with the bolt torques. Can you expand on it? What's your take on torque to yield? I think you were on to something there...you had me thinking...
I know you spent a lot of time researching stuff for two days. Don't let all that hard work go down the tubes. What's your experience with torquing bolts?
I know of a guy that leaves bolts loose, but drills and pins them through the bolt head flange. He must be the expert. Use his advice. Me, just 40 years in the race industry.
I know of a guy that leaves bolts loose, but drills and pins them through the bolt head flange. He must be the expert. Use his advice. Me, just 40 years in the race industry.
OK, so have you ever torque yielded bolts in your 40 years? What happens when you torque yield a bolt? Why is that different than just a torque value?
No cheating now....with 40 years, this should come right off the tip of your tongue.
08-20-2017, 04:37 PM
