What size headers?
Drifting
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,627
Likes: 143
From: Goodyear Az
External Engine Modifications LS2 (Bolt-Ons)
10.626 @ 126.98 - Dennis50NJ - 05 A4 Z51 - CAI, cb, conv, ewp, pfast, 3.73, hdr, ptb, tune, & more, DR
External Engine Modifications LS3 (Bolt-Ons)
10.802 @ 126.84 - HOXXOH - 08 A6 F55 - CAI, conv, ptb, Z06 Exhaust, tune, & more, DR
Number 1 each category and both with 1.75" primary tube headers.
Go fish!
10.626 @ 126.98 - Dennis50NJ - 05 A4 Z51 - CAI, cb, conv, ewp, pfast, 3.73, hdr, ptb, tune, & more, DR
External Engine Modifications LS3 (Bolt-Ons)
10.802 @ 126.84 - HOXXOH - 08 A6 F55 - CAI, conv, ptb, Z06 Exhaust, tune, & more, DR
Number 1 each category and both with 1.75" primary tube headers.
Go fish!
Race Director
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 16,557
Likes: 2,106
From: Peoria/Phoenix AZ
C6 of Year Finalist (performance mods) 2019
Drifting
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,627
Likes: 143
From: Goodyear Az
I understand now, I thought you were saying those cars were tested with larger primary headers too. Area under the curve.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,385
Likes: 102
External Engine Modifications LS2 (Bolt-Ons)
10.626 @ 126.98 - Dennis50NJ - 05 A4 Z51 - CAI, cb, conv, ewp, pfast, 3.73, hdr, ptb, tune, & more, DR
External Engine Modifications LS3 (Bolt-Ons)
10.802 @ 126.84 - HOXXOH - 08 A6 F55 - CAI, conv, ptb, Z06 Exhaust, tune, & more, DR
Number 1 each category and both with 1.75" primary tube headers.
Go fish!
10.626 @ 126.98 - Dennis50NJ - 05 A4 Z51 - CAI, cb, conv, ewp, pfast, 3.73, hdr, ptb, tune, & more, DR
External Engine Modifications LS3 (Bolt-Ons)
10.802 @ 126.84 - HOXXOH - 08 A6 F55 - CAI, conv, ptb, Z06 Exhaust, tune, & more, DR
Number 1 each category and both with 1.75" primary tube headers.
Go fish!
That has the same effect as "I run 8psi of boost and run xxx time if I made 10psi of boost I would probably slow down"
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,385
Likes: 102
Dyno comparisons prove him wrong and all the evidence he has is different cars with different mods at different tracks at different da and different times of the year are a little faster....is he really trying to cite the headers as the difference in times? Lmao
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 8,672
Likes: 2,726
From: Atlanta GA
Exactly...he's comparing different cars at different times. I really dont understand the point here? Who's to say those cars wouldn't be faster with bigger headers? The guy has no proof at all that larger headers slow you down....
Dyno comparisons prove him wrong and all the evidence he has is different cars with different mods at different tracks at different da and different times of the year are a little faster....is he really trying to cite the headers as the difference in times? Lmao
Dyno comparisons prove him wrong and all the evidence he has is different cars with different mods at different tracks at different da and different times of the year are a little faster....is he really trying to cite the headers as the difference in times? Lmao
Close thread.....
Dave
Race Director
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 16,557
Likes: 2,106
From: Peoria/Phoenix AZ
C6 of Year Finalist (performance mods) 2019
I'm so sorry that I was wrong to not believe those sacred dyno charts that told me how wrong I was, but when Dennis (RIP) tried the bigger ones and then went back to small, it was like a beacon that I couldn't resist. The voices kept saying "bigger is not better'', "bigger is not better", "bigger is not better". And then it was just me and Dennis alone at the top, which showed the rest that the "bigger is not better" mantra is true.
The real question is: What did Dennis and I know that you haven't learned yet?
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Drifting
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,385
Likes: 102
Try this for an argument. So maybe if the slower cars swapped to smaller headers they'd go quicker.
The irony here is hilarious, you used the inverse of that argument saying "all the fastest cars run 1-3/4" but when I turned it around and said maybe they would be faster with 1-7/8 you refute it? lol
Obviously you don't understand and it's pretty simple. You stated "Literally no argument can be made for 1-3/4 headers" and I showed you two examples where cars with 1 3/4" headers led a field followed by cars with all sorts of exhaust systems. If bigger was better, then one of those other cars would be at the top.
Obviosly you dont understand....How are you going to compare different cars, with different mods, ran on different days and say fractions of a second in time difference are only because of the smaller headers? There is no way you can make that claim yet you sight that as some sort of credible source lol the thousands of variables there are impossible to consider.
I'm so sorry that I was wrong to not believe those sacred dyno charts that told me how wrong I was, but when Dennis (RIP) tried the bigger ones and then went back to small, it was like a beacon that I couldn't resist. The voices kept saying "bigger is not better'', "bigger is not better", "bigger is not better". And then it was just me and Dennis alone at the top, which showed the rest that the "bigger is not better" mantra is true.
The real question is: What did Dennis and I know that you haven't learned yet?
The irony here is hilarious, you used the inverse of that argument saying "all the fastest cars run 1-3/4" but when I turned it around and said maybe they would be faster with 1-7/8 you refute it? lol
Obviously you don't understand and it's pretty simple. You stated "Literally no argument can be made for 1-3/4 headers" and I showed you two examples where cars with 1 3/4" headers led a field followed by cars with all sorts of exhaust systems. If bigger was better, then one of those other cars would be at the top.
Obviosly you dont understand....How are you going to compare different cars, with different mods, ran on different days and say fractions of a second in time difference are only because of the smaller headers? There is no way you can make that claim yet you sight that as some sort of credible source lol the thousands of variables there are impossible to consider.
I'm so sorry that I was wrong to not believe those sacred dyno charts that told me how wrong I was, but when Dennis (RIP) tried the bigger ones and then went back to small, it was like a beacon that I couldn't resist. The voices kept saying "bigger is not better'', "bigger is not better", "bigger is not better". And then it was just me and Dennis alone at the top, which showed the rest that the "bigger is not better" mantra is true.
The real question is: What did Dennis and I know that you haven't learned yet?
I'm still waiting for you to tell me how mods done on an A-B test that make mroe power would somehow slow a car down? I mean hell if parts that make mroe power dont make you faster then I guess we shouldnt do headers, heads, cam, intake etc. I mean after all its all just hearsay? lmao
Btw the fastest bolt m6 5th gen and bolt on fbodys run 2" headers. maybe you should tell them what they're missing out on man
Last edited by redbird555; Oct 1, 2017 at 09:41 AM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 8,672
Likes: 2,726
From: Atlanta GA
May I ask what qualifications you have ....other than a bunch of quotes from the internet ....which if it's on the internet it must be true ...right
Can you tell us about your real world testing and the logs that you kept with the results of what worked and what didnot ?? you do have many logs right ?
I am not sure why you are so hell bent on proving a point...and arguing with one of the best who has kept countless records of what works and what does not work (and before you start on me ..yes I do keep logs ..and I am running small tubes lol)
If you think Large Tubes work the best that's great .... you are entitled to your opinion but as HOXXOH points out it's about what makes the whole package work ....
Dave
Last edited by Dcasole; Oct 1, 2017 at 09:58 AM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 8,434
Likes: 411
From: Texas
Race Director
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 16,557
Likes: 2,106
From: Peoria/Phoenix AZ
C6 of Year Finalist (performance mods) 2019
No need to apologize to me man everyone is wrong sometimes, maybe you can learn from this comparison.
Apparently you missed the sarcasm.
I'm still waiting for you to tell me how mods done on an A-B test that make mroe power would somehow slow a car down? I mean hell if parts that make mroe power dont make you faster then I guess we shouldnt do headers, heads, cam, intake etc. I mean after all its all just hearsay? lmao
You fail to understand the concept that it's not just one single thing that makes a car faster. Just because there is more protein in beans, is no reason to substitute them for the cherries on a banana split.
Btw the fastest bolt m6 5th gen and bolt on fbodys run 2" headers. maybe you should tell them what they're missing out on man
And all this time I thought we were talking about LS2/3 Vettes. Silly me.
Apparently you missed the sarcasm.
I'm still waiting for you to tell me how mods done on an A-B test that make mroe power would somehow slow a car down? I mean hell if parts that make mroe power dont make you faster then I guess we shouldnt do headers, heads, cam, intake etc. I mean after all its all just hearsay? lmao
You fail to understand the concept that it's not just one single thing that makes a car faster. Just because there is more protein in beans, is no reason to substitute them for the cherries on a banana split.
Btw the fastest bolt m6 5th gen and bolt on fbodys run 2" headers. maybe you should tell them what they're missing out on man
And all this time I thought we were talking about LS2/3 Vettes. Silly me.
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 38
Likes: 2
From: Baldwin City Kansas
If you're only consideration for the banana split it as a fuel source in the body, then you should absolutely substitute beans for cherries as the cherries contain too many carbohydrates and with the saturated fat in the cream it is very unhealthy. You want a more nutrient dense source of energy found in the beans. Substitute the ice cream for broccoli and chicken or better yet some tuna, and those syrups, for a dash of some soy sauce, and you got a pretty nice meal.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 1,120
Likes: 110
From: Chattanooga TN
If you're only consideration for the banana split it as a fuel source in the body, then you should absolutely substitute beans for cherries as the cherries contain too many carbohydrates and with the saturated fat in the cream it is very unhealthy. You want a more nutrient dense source of energy found in the beans. Substitute the ice cream for broccoli and chicken or better yet some tuna, and those syrups, for a dash of some soy sauce, and you got a pretty nice meal.