Question for the engine builders out there:
In the process of changing heads, I decided to take the opportunity to inspect the lifters, and discovered that some of the lifters are showing signs of wear on the rollers. I’ve pulled down a few engines with roller lifters before, but I can’t say I’ve ever seen this much wear on the rollers. I’ve only pulled one head so far and only 6 of the 8 lifters show some form of wear. The pictures are of the worse ones. These lifters are the factory LS3/LS7 lifers and have less than 5,000 miles on them, roughly half of those miles were with the stock cam and then I swapped in a VR PD-1 (223/239, .610”/.623”, 118+4) cam. I’ve only ever used Mobil-1 5W-30 Dextros oil in it, and I gave changed the oil like 4 times since I’ve had the car. I’m wondering if the problem may be that the cam core is the hardened 8620 alloy?
I can’t feel anything from dragging my nail over the wheels, but it’s pretty visible, especially under magnification like in the pics below>
I wanted to install the Johnson drop-in lifters, but it seems that they are on backorder. I’m seriously thinking of holding off on reassembly until I can get my hands on some good quality drop in lifters.
The cam looks fine by the way: nice and shiny with not a scratch on it that I can see.
Have any of you seen this kind of wear on stock lifters? Should I change these lifters? Or am I worrying too much?

 

Gee Sammy,
Now you have me worried! I'M far from an expert, but that looks like the hardened casing is worn off those lifters. I also have the Cam Motion 8620 cam core, but my cam lift is more gentle than yours. Lets see what the experts say.

 

Like heavy duty valve springs might be good to stop valve float, and keep good seat pressure, but this comes at a cost on lifters and cam lobes surely?

 

They may last for a while with as few miles as you put on your Vette. BUT, it's SO easy to change them with the heads off....and such a pain to have to go back in there. If a lifter goes t!ts up, it will take the cam with it. Plus, when they start coming apart, little pieces of lifter and cam will be all through your engine.

Maybe get in contact with Cam Motion and get their take on things.

 

Just thinking out aloud. Could wrong push rod length cause this?

 

 

I would change them just because as Old Motorhead said, its so easy to do now and so much work later.
As far as why they are worn like that.... it could be a number of things, or a combination of them. I just listened to a top valvetrain guy on a podcast, who explains that contrary to what is the norm in the industry, we all run more seat pressure than we really need for our use. Don't really know if that could have contributed.
The main change I would make, if it was my car, is that I would never run mobile 1. I know that can be debated forever, but I think a higher zinc oil can not hurt, and can only benefit our cars that have stiffer valvetrains, and in turn more wear on parts.

 

Thanks. I’m of the same view, on both excess spring pressures and zinc. I will change the lifters, no question about it. I’m not putting those back in my motor. The question is, does it make sense to put the GM LS7s back in there? Are the rollers on the Johnsons going to resist that kind of wear any better, even if I could get my hands on a set?? Should I change the cam to a normal induction hardened core?? This is what I’m struggling with.
BTW: which oil do you run, Jody?

 

Nope. And I’ve meticulously checked pushrod length to make sure I have the right lifter preload.

 

Thanks Rodney.
I’ll give cam motion a call today.
I will change them. Turns out you were right, again!
I may just take your advice and stick a regular cored BTR Stage III in it too...
Exotic parts lead to exotic lessons, is the moral of this story, I guess.

 

Lots of guys run LS7 lifters with no issues although I prefer link bar myself. As far as the cam core... I don't see that should be an issue.
I run Driven LS30 in my engine from the start, at the reccomendation of LME.

 

Thanks. I’ve looked at that oil before. I can’t get it here off the shelf though. I may just import a couple of cases myself.
I’m also thinking of getting the Johnson SLR with the link bars, since BTR has those in stock.
Question for you, with the link bar lifters, can you still change the cam without pulling the heads, by using a dowel and turning the engine whilst inserting the dowels? Does that work? Because I would only change to link bar lifters if I can change the cam in the future without pulling the heads.

 

I really don't know. I never thought about it because have no intention of swapping cams. LOL... If a cam is spec'd right for your build... why swap it.

 

fretting from excessive spring and seat pressure

 

I don’t know how it could be excessive spring pressure. I’m running BTR .660” springs, like lots of others on here, and BTR claims that those aren’t even heavy enough to run with roller rockers. There is no discernible wear on the rollers that you can feel with your fingertips or by slowly dragging my fingernail across the surface. I’m thinking that from looking at them that’s it more in the nature of burnishing than actual wear. Or maybe canuk is right that it’s the Mobil 1 oil causing it?
I have to wonder how many others have inspected their stock lifters to seeing there’s wear on the rollers like this, since most folks on here don’t change their cylinder heads?

 

Spring pressure would vary with installed height, but I'd assume that was calculated and checked.

 

Sorry for the backorders on 2110's!!! They've been going out the door as of this week, with plenty behind it.

There's a few potential problems, but hard telling without the parts in hand. How's the cam look?

 

I have never been a fan of Mobil 1.

 

I've been running Euro spec Mobil 1 0w40 in my LS3's. It has much higher zinc and phosphorous levels than the other Mob 1 oils.

I believe Lingenfelter recs using 15/50 Mob 1 in anything they supercharge. Just food for thought. I'd use the 0/40 in any stock short block LS3 and whatever the engine builder recommends for a "built" engine.

 

Umm, don't start that. Andy's the only one who's always right And he's off somewhere in ZL1 Camaro land.

And personally, I'd get Pat G to spec you a cam. Not much of a fan of the really wide LSA blower cams. Especially with big duration valve events like BTR's Stage III.