brian98vette

The 1980s called and want their meme back

Which is why Apple developed an interface that doesn't, you know, have hard plasticy buttons like every phone developed before it. The interface changes as the application dictates.

I'm sure you didn't realize that Apple has voice recognition software prebuilt in the phone's OS from the get-go given your disdain for their products. You might want to re-think this argument especially with the introduction of the latest software that leap-frogs current implementations on any phone.

Agreed - right tool for the right job. Just research without prejudice and keep an open mind.

Sometimes the walled-garden in the correct approach - I'd be leery of this as well.

Exactly - let's see who fits this category. Oh yeah, Apple for all of its products.

You have some valid arguments about platform and software, but I believe you don't understand Apple in that context.

My $0.02 which adjusted for inflation is the same as everyone else's $0.02.

brian98vette

This has so much misinformation I'm almost not sure where to start.

New Silicon and OS in the iPad and iPad2? Check.
New form factor far different than any tablet PC prior? Check.
Pricing that competing companies can't beat (and turn a profit)? Check.
Life changing innovations that have touched everyone in technology circles? Check.

Apple products (or any products for that matter) aren't for everyone. But at least make a cogent argument for why you don't like them.

GCRoberts

Not sure anyone is saying it's a silver bullet for all things, but iOS is far more flexible than you're implying. In the case that any auto manufacturer chose iOS to run the radio/navigation, I'm sure Apple would design modifications to satisfy the environment. For example, when Apple introduced the iPad, they designed new View and Controller classes (SplitView) for developers to better take advantage of the larger screen. Yes, I am an iPhone Developer.

I personally think the iOS would be very well received in this capacity, but I highly doubt a car company would have the vision to take this path. It will more likely show up first on after market units, then possibly be adapted years later by auto manufacturers.

I've been a software engineer (C/C++/Java/Objective C) for 25 yrs, and would LOVE to have been forced to use Apple more often. I've had the opposite problem and have been forced to use Microsoft most of my career and likely have more contempt for them than you do Apple.

I have plenty of years of interface design experience and have found that Apple understands this topic better than anyone. While most Apple customers don't develop interfaces themselves, they recognize a good one when they see one. This is the primary reason they are so loyal; history tells them that Apple will give them a better interface than the next 10 solutions combined.

I don't recall Apple ever suggesting that iOS should be controlling jet fighters...but it's possible that I missed that memo.


You are correct that iOS has limited support for voice command. However, that will only be true until Friday when the iPhone 4S comes out. The new version iOS 5 has "Siri" voice recognition. Early reviews are stating that it's implemention is flawless. There are countless other features in iOS 5 that would also be quite useful in our cars as well, but that's beyond the scope of my comment.

Not the holy grail, but they sure do kick ***!

Sorry, but that analogy is pretty weak and in no way is applicable to the idea of using iOS to control the information system of a car.

Would have to disagree with your whole summary. But don't worry, I suspect you'll get your way. Not because adding iOS would be a bad idea, but because I have no confidence that any car company would be able to bridge the vision gap between what iOS is now and what it could become in a car.

brian98vette

I don't think it has to be an either/or. I agree that there's probably not an all-in-one interface that would work, but the ability to control some vehicle operations through one location (touch screen for Nav / radio / current DIC functions) makes sense IMO. Other features do need that tactile feedback.

XotiK ZO6

He did nail one part... anything by Apple costs 10X as much, and it really isn't any better, just different.

I would like to see a simple system with some traditional ***** or an intuative touch screen that locks when the cars moving. Don't need any nimnods driving playing the screen.

GCRoberts

I'll let the "isn't any better" comment go, even though I think that's crazy. But can you give me an example where Apple products cost 10x as much? You'll probably come back and compare at 64GB iPhone 4S to some $30 w/contract crappy phone that is only "technically" a smartphone but in no way compares equally to an iPhone.

And even if that was correct, do you really expect anyone to believe your presumption that people camp out to buy products that are 10x more expensive and are no better than the competition? Seriously??

I guess I could claim that people are crazy to spend $70,000 for a Corvette GS when they could get a "just as good" Hyundai for a third of the price. I could claim that, but I'd be wrong.

Neither you or the person you quoted "nailed" anything.

SCM_Crash

HAHA...


No arguing with an Apple yuppie.




And now the difference between my phone and the iPhone 4s.

http://www.differencebetween.com/dif...htc-sensation/

My phone unlocked was $499 + $90 for a 32GB class 10 SD. The iPhone 4s 32GB unlocked is $750.

Hardware comparison puts the Sensation ahead. The only benefit to the iPhone is that it has 256MB more RAM. After that, there's no benefit to the iPhone.

The iPhone 4s is also missing some key features like DLNA, HDMI and a built-in GPS antenna. Also, an update to the Sensation has been released upping the CPU speed to 1.5GHz from 1.2GHz. I'm actually running that now.

So, with Apple you pay more for less.

BTW, Apple's notebooks and inline devices are made by ASUSTek. The same manufacturer of my laptop. My laptop is a 17.3" Core i7 (2.0GHz) with 8GB DDR3 and a 5870 Radeon GFX card. This laptop cost me $1200. To get the same specs from Apple in a laptop would cost $3000. I know because I looked.

All Apple products cost WAY more than any other similarly spec'd device.


Now that this thread is thoroughly off-track, I'll get it back on track by saying that GM should buy Pioneer head units. Better sound quality and tons of good reviews as far as navigating through the menus.

And I agree we should have as much as we can as hardware physical buttons and dials. No need having it all touch screen. Steering wheel controls are nice, but I drive with my hand on the shifter so I like the controls to be near my hand.

rjwz28

No way should simple controls like radio volume and presets, climate control, driving modes, etc EVER be presented only by a touchscreen interface, IMHO. All of these are adjusted while moving on a regular basis. Is a **** or a button really that outdated? It may not be dazzling technology, but it works, and is easy to operate without taking your eyes off of the road.

rjwz28

Bad example. Nobody's safety is compromised by a crappy stereo. However, a bunch of people driving around in 500hp cars looking down and to their right at their touchscreen while attempting to turn on the AC and find something other than pop hits to listen to would be a disaster. Tell me how that's any different than texting and driving? Oh wait, I know: you can't keep the touchscreen in front of you while driving, because it's permanently mounted down and to the right. So arguably, it could be MORE dangerous to drivers than texting while driving. It's a silly idea. Keep physical controls in play and add voice to them if you need more tech. Any more is not only overdone but irresponsible.

tuxnharley

Enuf with the Apple dogma! Next thing ya know the applites will be calling for a Steve Jobs commerative edition C7...........




Like I said in my first post, just give me a good analog solution for the basic controls!

GCRoberts

I agree with you. But I don't think anyone is saying that you won't have any ***** or buttons anymore. Are people here under the impression that the iPhone/iPad doesn't have any buttons or switches? When people like myself or the OP makes comments about using iOS to run the entertainment/navigation system, we aren't stating that the whole car will be controlled exclusively by an iPhone touchscreen interface. The car would still have it's own (non-iOS based) computer just as it does today. Any control that should remain a physical switch, ****, or slider would continue to do so. These controls could also be tied into the iOS entertainment/nav system if it makes sense. You'd still have your "steering wheel audio controls" as you do today. Other functionality would be touch screen driven...such as the navigation system....just like almost all the car GPS units do today. You would also use the touch screen to switch from one input source (such as XM Radio, CD, HD Radio, etc) just as many aftermarket car stereos do today. Don't think of iOS as an iPhone, it's an Operating System that runs on the Apple "A-series" processor and can support as many inputs/outputs as required. You could have one GPS unit (and only one antenna) that can be used by multiple devices (Nav unit, radar detector, etc). You could attach mulitple cameras, radar receivers, laser shifters, etc. All of these devices could be controlled through custom apps which promotes competition and hence better products. You could attach your smartphone to allow network access allowing easy updates to your car's iOS computer and third party apps. It's a FAR better idea than many here realize.

BobRBob

There are no examples that I've seen where a comparable Apple product costs 10 times as much as the competition. No one would pay that much more. That said, Apple is able to sell products at a premium because the market perceives a quality difference and is prepared to pay a higher price. A MacBook Pro costs more than a PC laptop with comparable hardware specs but there's more to it than just hardware specs. Mac hardware is more pleasing to use and is clearly superior in design and quality to most PCs. A growing number of people appreciate this and will pay for it. The other difference is the OS. The Mac OS is technically superior to Windows 7 and much more mature. It is easier to use, more secure (no viruses), and far more reliable. This is, of course, a matter of opinion, but if you don't agree, then buy a Windows PC. A growing number of people do agree which has led to Apple's growing share of the PC market.

As for tablets, Apple owns the market because no one else had the vision to imagine such a thing as an iPad. Competitors and industry experts were literally still laughing at the IPad when Apple started shipping them and the lines started forming outside the Apple Stores around the world. Then the laughing stopped. Call it what you want but that's what happened, pure and simple.

Apple is an amazing example of getting it right. Innovative products, pleasing industrial design, excellent execution, brilliant business model.

Jobs was a genius.

RIP.

Jp23rockstar

For everyone, complaining about iOS, it would be a huge leap forward for the auto industry. I'm not even saying it has to be iOS, it could also be Android, all I'm saying is we take our phones everywhere we go, we could use our smartphones to link up to the navigation system via bluetooth, to make calls, etc. We could use the navigation screen to vehicle diagnostics all the way to the radio stations. I didn't mean to create such a hassle for everyone. For climate control, there should be *****, keep audio controls on the steering wheel, and make the navigation screen about 10inches, so we don't have to squint our eyes.

Z06Electron

Actually when the original G1 was launched with Android people did camp out, and the only reason people camp out for Apple products is because 95% of them are trying to sell them to the actual users who can't buy them because they are sold out to resellers.

I have a friend who is a reseller and will literally buy as many as he can physically order. I don't argue that people want them.

What I argue is the blanket statements like the ones above about technological innovation.

It is media babble regurgitation. I give my nephew **** about it all the time when he states the same crap, until I put my Android phone next to his and he can't do one single thing I can't, but I can do a ton he can't.

Are there cheap crap Android phones? Yes. Did Google drop the ball not putting minimum hardware requirements in place? Yes. Are they fixing that? Yes

When hardware is on par or better than iphone hardware, is Android better? Yes. And 45% of the World's smartphone users agree with me.

Z06Electron

Very.

List off the "totally all new" things Apple came up with on their own different than anything else on the market in the last 3-4 years?

I'm not talking "oh hey this is cool, let's steal this and make it Apple"

I'm talking "Holy **** there is NOTHING else like this anywhere!"

Z06Electron

lol ok. I work with both products daily.

You can't criticize a product because the CEO of its company dies?

That is just stupid.

Z06Electron

I have a bt920 in my Vert and It is ok, but the whole system is very outdated compared to my smartphone interface and I REALLY need something customizable like Android so I can make the user interface as easy as I want it to be.

Z06Electron

Android is the largest smartphone operating system in the World, look it up, so in answer to this statement, you are wrong.

Z06Electron

Customizable interface? No
Dual core processors? yeah and by the time you buy it quad cores will be coming to Android tablets.
Burst shutter photos? No
Flash player for online web content? No SUPER SUCK
4.3"+ screen? No
Kindle, nook, and Google books? yeah kind of although Apples terms are pissing these vendors off with book purchases
3d recording and playback? No
4G speeds? No
Facetime on network? No
HDMI output? No
DLNA? No, unless of course you want to buy an additional product called Apple TV then yes.
Bluetooth sync with itunes? No
Removable battery? No
Expandable memory? No

Need I go on?

SCM_Crash

Z06Electron, they're not going to give up... Believe me I've had this conversation time and time again. I don't dislike Apple, but it makes me look like I do when I have to explain to people that it's NOT the best product.

And I'm not sure why people took my "10x the price" exaggeration to heart. You cannot deny that ALL Apple products are over priced and ALWAYS more than the competition's prices. On the flip side you get slightly better support from Apple, although you cannot get Apple support at home like you can with Alienware/Dell and ASUS. Either way it's a crap shoot with Apple always being more expensive with out-dated ideas and hardware.

That's the truth. Whether Apple fan-boys want to accept it or not, Apple had a fantastic idea, pioneered the smart phone as we see it today, and then fell behind. Classic case of the tortuous and the hare.

I give it to Z06Electron that the his pioneer is out-dated, but so is my C5 stock radio, the C6 stock radio and pretty much every radio in any car. However, do they work well? Yes. I love my C5 radio. That's the reason I haven't replaced it. I hooked up a Parrot MKi9000 to it and now I have a direct connection for Bluetooth audio and phone calls (which BTW are fantastic in my car), direct line in, and if my girlfriend wants to use her iPhone as an mp3 player I have an iPod connection. All of it running through my car's stereo. And it sounds amazing!

Maybe I could care less about touch screen, but sometimes simple is just better.