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C7 reliability generally blows

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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 12:20 PM
  #121  
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Originally Posted by patentcad
I take it back.

I am a witch.
A very long winded narcissistic one.
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 03:17 PM
  #122  
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Originally Posted by SLOWRYDE
Idiot flypaper? We are all idiots because we disagree with the CR 'test' results because they differ from our real world experiences for this particular generation of Corvette? You state the percentages "impact a very small % of owners" which mirrors our experiences. That's good news for a mass produced item, isn't it?

I read where most people simply pointed out the flaws in the CR reviews and why it wasn't a good overall indication of the vehicles reliability. No one blamed YOU for the article, just the inflammatory nature of the threads title. I don't see it as a personal persecution (witch hunt?) just a disagreement.

This is the Corvette Forum and we are Corvette enthusiasts... the pushback to the article was predictable. Were you looking for validation for the article or simply stirring the pot? I honestly can't tell.

As far as the political innuendo and insults, they have no place in the forum. No one gives a **** what political party you or I support and they do nothing to clarify any points in Corvette discussions.
I think it's pretty stupid to A.) Get your panties in a twist over CR's evaluation of this car as not being the most reliable car you can buy, that's easy to believe and B.) try to refute a survey based on a much larger sample by saying 'well MY car is fine'. C.) Condemn Consumer's Union and CR as some left wing conspiracy.

Generally speaking I agree that the cars are pretty reliable, so 95% of us are happy campers. Service problems on these late model C7s impact a small % of Corvette owners. Plus very few owners really rely on the car, if it needs shop-time, it's easier to deal with than if your commuter mobile. It's my daily driver 8-9 months a year when the temps/road conditions work for a high performance car with summer tires.

CR is comparing this car to Toyotas that never break*. Modern cars are so much more reliable than in say the C3 or C4 era that even cars flagged for stuff like this still have great track records for the overwhelming majority of owners.

*to further underscore the pointless nature of anecdotal accounts when addressing overall reliability by car model consider this: Our 2017 Prius Prime (7500 miles) is tied up @ the dealership and they can't for the life of them figure out why the car keeps sending a couple of warning messages. They have contacted Toyota's American headquarters in Texas and it has gone all the way up the food chain to the engineers in Japan. That's not a typical Toyota story. By the way, the car is perfectly drivable, but it keeps telling us to get it back to the dealer. They are rapidly sailing towards lemon law territory. I really don't want to go there, I just hope they fix the car.

Anyway, I hope that makes some of you happy. Call it Korvette Witch Karma. Also, we already have 8" of snow, I'm pretty confident this dump will be closer to 2' than 1'.
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 03:18 PM
  #123  
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Originally Posted by dvilin
A very long winded narcissistic one.
You say that like it's a bad thing.
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 04:49 PM
  #124  
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I wouldn't trust ANYTHING the Consumers Report has to say! 40 years ago they were ok sometimes. Not anymore.
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 05:19 PM
  #125  
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Originally Posted by silberma
Just got a new 2019 Vette. Can someone please explain what is the transmission issue? What is the cause? Is it only on C7's? What are the symptoms? What is the fix? How long to fix?
Just keep driving it when the car starts to SHUDDER between 55-80 you'll know
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 05:22 PM
  #126  
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Originally Posted by patentcad
The knee jerk reactions here are so predictable. Anybody who puts CR down for whatever leftward bias they may have doesn't get it. I don't think that contaminates their product analysis for the most part. You have to take their stuff with a grain of salt. Were it not for CR, there would be no place to turn to for unfiltered data on stuff like car reliability or objective comparisons of consumer products. They get it wrong sometimes, but mostly they're pretty accurate.

But if you're happy with the steady flow of corporate propaganda and bullshit with no information to counter that, by all means, keep your mind closed and continue to wear your Make America Great Again cap. Just try not to shoot yourself with that gun you purchased to keep you and the family safer. As for me, I'm just sick of all this endless winning.

Right CR is a liberal publication typical idiotic response
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 05:28 PM
  #127  
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Originally Posted by sTz
So... the Chevy commercials are lying when the say that their cars are the most reliable on the planet, albeit, I didn’t see the Vette pictured... Funny spoof version nonetheless:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zSBsq6HBBzw
If they are using JD POWER its usually first 90 days reliability. You don't think CHEVY commercials are bias do you?
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 05:32 PM
  #128  
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Originally Posted by Telepierre
Indeed, but you recognized it as well so kudos for that..

and so I'll save you my litany on the definition of "reliability" so often conflated into things that do not have anything to do with reliability.

Suffice to say road noise and comfort in and out of the car have nothing to do with reliability...

Peace!
no but shuddering, infotainment failures, rubber moldings not fitting, ORANGE PEEL all add up
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 05:35 PM
  #129  
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Originally Posted by Bill Dearborn
Most automotive quality reports now a days include usage of the infotainment systems. If an owner needs to go to the dealer to receive instruction on how the system works that is considered a failure. Across the rating systems I see a number of cars downgraded because of owners being confused by the infotainment systems. Is that a true failure? The product is doing what is designed to do in the way it was designed to do it. Some people would never catch on no matter how simple you made the interface. Myself I would prefer to see failures related to Customer Confusion separated out of the overall reliability data and noted in a separate table. Failures should be real failures where somebody had to repair or replace an item not tell the owner how it is supposed to work. Usability is a different category that has to be accounted for in a different manner.

The main problem with CR data is that it is accurate for its sample size which is very limited. The number of people who submit reports is small. On top of that by the nature of Consumer's Union they have a specific set of values that may not represent a true cross section of owners. That means they can be somewhat biased about the things they complain about. This is true of all of their ratings not just on cars. You can get more reliable info from places like JD Power and others. I doubt most car companies consider CR a valuable feedback tool to improve their quality or the direction of their designs.

Bill
problem Bill IS THAT OWNERS fill out the questionnaire about their cars.
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 05:37 PM
  #130  
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Originally Posted by patentcad
Um...no. I had previously owned a C6 and the interior noise level was fine. After driving the C7 for a few months I found the tire noise in the new C7 so brutal I went out and bought sound deadening mats from a forum vendor. WAY worse than the C6. Happily the mats worked. Honest to god, WTF was GM thinking letting the car hit production with the cabin noise that bad? The hatchback area was acting like a giant speaker box to make the whole car like a Tire Noise Experience ride @ Walt Disney World.

But the mats were very effective, can't recall the name but if you want to quiet down that tire noise rumble, well worth the $250 or whatever I paid and they just drop in under the carpet in the rear and behind the front seats.
ditto
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 05:40 PM
  #131  
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Originally Posted by Baysider
Everything negative I have heard has been mostly with the first year of the C7's (quality control, transmissions, and overheat with Z06's) and little issues from then on. I think the expectation of most people is that there should be very few problems with generational vehicles, while they expect more problems with brand new introduction models. Realistically though these cars should be bulletproof as they are the flagships of the Chevrolet lineup.
I'm looking forward to selling my bulletproof C6 and getting a C7, but will only consider 2017's and newer when the time comes.
The 15s were dreadful
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 05:43 PM
  #132  
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 05:47 PM
  #133  
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Again some people can't stand the fact that THEIR car has problems and to them a harsh ride is not a big deal and annoyances like taking their car to the dealership is "just part of owning a sports car" It's like they use to say if you ride a HARLEY you have to fix a HARLEY same way with a CORVETTE but when you have owned several of these cars with virtually NO problems it's damn disappointing when your next one is a piece of crap
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 08:30 PM
  #134  
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For 42 years since I bought my first new C3 Corvette, my main concern/fear has always been the half-assed Chevrolet dealers' lack of competency on repairing/servicing my newly purchased Corvette. Not the new Corvette I just bought. CR, should beat the drum on the Chev. dealers - not the C7s.




.

Last edited by Skid Row Joe; Mar 7, 2018 at 08:31 PM.
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 08:41 PM
  #135  
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Originally Posted by sTz
So... the Chevy commercials are lying when the say that their cars are the most reliable on the planet, albeit, I didn’t see the Vette pictured... Funny spoof version nonetheless:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zSBsq6HBBzw
Good one and he is right about initial quality. Looks great on the showroom and test drive but once the "happy tag" is gone the crap comes up.

But CR is garbage and always hated the Corvette or anything with a pulse. But when a manufacturer that is selling a 650 hp sports car and states it is better to use the manual transmission if you are planning on tracking it in high ambient temps then you begin to wonder about quality. (States that in the 2018 sales brochure I believe or 2018.)

3LT dash issues seem to be the same problem as the C6 4LT issues. Roof creaks? Etc.
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 08:51 PM
  #136  
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Originally Posted by Steve_R
Thread title is incredibly misleading.


I have no idea who they're polling to get this, because the '14 is incredibly reliable, and has had few reports of problems (even here, where we hear every little thing, even if it isn't really a thing) .

And as it was said upthread, how freaking reliable can a report be when they cant even get the transmission correct, and are bringing in reports of (obviously) other years?
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 09:34 PM
  #137  
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Originally Posted by Steve_R
Someone mentioned idiot fly-paper? You post this to flat-out facts. Amazing. Guess the noise level in here is actually higher than in the car.
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 09:59 PM
  #138  
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Originally Posted by Walter Raulerson
If they are using JD POWER its usually first 90 days reliability. You don't think CHEVY commercials are bias do you?
Are you serious? Did you even watch the posted vid. Of course they’re bias, hence, the spoof...
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 10:34 PM
  #139  
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Originally Posted by Foosh
The self-report methodology hasn't changed. It was a big story at the time that an identical car can have bad ratings with one badge and great ratings with another, and a big black-eye for CR. They've been beaten up for other similar illogical ratings differences on identical products, which illustrate methodological flaws due to the unreliability of human perceptions.

I said it was 30 years ago because you asked me for additional data. Perhaps you feel like looking for it. I don't.
No need.... but in the absence of some actual DATA to contradict and prove CR reliability ratings are flawed, we will just need to accept them. You make a claim to the contrary, and we would just need to see the data to support the claim. Logical burden of proof.

I really have no reason to believe CR one way or the other, but I am a pragmatic person and have been given no reason not to.
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Old Mar 7, 2018 | 11:30 PM
  #140  
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I was trained and employed as a scientist. It is scientific fact that self-report data is always suspect, subject to multiple confounding biases, and must be taken with a grain of salt. That's why the NUMMI example was so striking. That's been explained multiple times, with multiple examples of bias, by multiple smart people above, but if you as a "pragmatic person" don't get that, you just don't get it, even though you've been given many compelling reasons.

Unfortunately, there is no other available published real "DATA" with regard to vehicle reliability except in the warranty records of manufacturers. They aren't sharing.

Last edited by Foosh; Mar 7, 2018 at 11:44 PM.
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