Skid Row Joe

All, ^^^^ of which has been covered here in above posts.

GM, may not have to prove anything. Nonetheless, GM may need to defend themselves in a Court of Law, if push comes to shove.

speedlink

You are missing the whole point of oil system algorithm. Foosh tried to explain it to you.

Oil can and will degrade when left sitting, even if it hasn't been used. The system calculates engine revolutions, heat, and time, among a few other criteria.
Why go through all the gyrations and hoops trying not to change the oil and attempt to fool GM if you ever had an engine warranty?
Change it when your oil life monitor reaches zero or slightly before!

Skid Row Joe

Actually, Foosh and others have decidedly chosen to go off topic here. My responses to them have been focused on their tangential off topic post.

My quest has been to gain information on A) how the system works, and B) how it interacts with the GM Chevrolet. dealer.

If you want to go off on interrelated topics like oil/filter life here, you're not getting the point.

Foosh

Bullshit Joe, I haven't been off-topic, just answering your bizarre assertions and questions. This isn't hard to understand. You're either performing a lot of unnecessary mental gymnastics or perhaps you think it's just a funny game to play here. GM is no different than any other manufacturer.

On Star is irrelevant and not proof of an oil change. It is simply reading what the OLM says. What matters when it comes to oil changes and engine warranty repairs is proof that it is done at least once a year or according to GM specs for mileage/usage. The easiest way to prove that is to follow the OLM and have a dealer do it. They will reset the OLM and put that record in GMVIS.

You can also do it yourself, or have an independent shop do it. If you do it that way you must keep dated receipts for your oil and filter purchases or dated shop invoices from where an oil and filter change were done. That's fine too if your records are legible.

If you put a lot of mileage on the car, and do it yourself, and just can't control yourself from resetting the OLM randomly without changing the oil, you'd best have records that you changed the oil at least every 7500 miles. If one puts less than 7.5K per year on a car, they had better have records showing it was changed at least once a year, even if it's only a few miles on the car.

And BTW, it is the owner who faces the burden of proving their case in a court of law, because they'll only be there if they don't have definitive records. The manufacturer will be holding all the cards, and in a civil proceeding it is up to the plaintiff to prove their case.

Skid Row Joe

My quest has been to gain information on A) how the system works, and B) how it interacts with the GM Chevrolet. dealer.

If you want to go off on interrelated topics like oil/filter life here, you're not getting the point.


Not true, Foosh. None of my posts had anything to do with your and a couple other poster's far afield somewhat interrelated replies.

Foosh

It's been explained, ad nauseam. I just above tried to explain it to you one last time. If you don't get it now, you'll never get it.

Knock yourself out. I think everyone virtually everyone else has also lost patience with you.

Steve_R

Because lying and committing fraud are great ideas.

LT1 Z51

Foosh, GM can't use GMVIS to deny a warranty claim. No where does it state that you need to use a GM facility to get an oil change. In fact to require to do this would actually be illegal.

LT1 Z51

The time component of how fast oil degrades is not an exact science and no standard engineering basis backs up GMs claim that the oil needs to be changed every 12 months.

It is an arbitrary time period. Does GM have the right to set an arbitrary period. Sure. Do you have to follow it. Technically no. Read your owners manual. Even if the OLM goes off for mileage it is only recommended that you get an oil change.

To deny warranty work, GM would have to prove that the oil caused the failure. There is so much FUD on this topic it's ridiculous.

Should you follow the OLM, sure. Do you have to, absolutely not. Will you lose your warranty if you don't, again it depends.

It would help if people stated facts here not opinions.

LT1 Z51

Joe, you won't win this argument. There are lots of people who will follow GMs recommendations to a T and claim to anyone who does not that the sky is falling.

Any reasonable intelligent person will know that GM won't deny the warranty for no reason. You'd actually have to ruin your engine due to bad oil to even have GM look into this.

Foosh

I never said GM could use GMVIS to deny a warranty claim. You should read through this thread more carefully. I simply said that was the easiest way to avoid problems should the worst happen.

I was very clear that there are alternative ways to stay safe including DIY, but they involve keeping good records, in the event that the worst happens. Simply resetting the OLM w/o changing the oil and filter is not one of them.

One can argue all they want that the science doesn't support GM's claim the oil should be changed every year regardless of mileage. However, it is the requirement, and it's stupidly ridiculous to not follow such simple guidance and choose to fight it out in court or elsewhere. That is, of course, unless one is just a glutton for punishment.

LT1 Z51

I did and whether it was your intent or not, your post is worded to infer that there needs to be some authoritative proof. And that GMVIS is more authoritative than anything else including recipes.

You don't have to prove you changed the oil. That's what I'm getting at. In all these threads this is a crux of the argument. No where does it say you are REQUIRED to follow the OLM, just that it's recommended! Further if you did have an engine problem it doesn't say GM will demand your maintenance history.

Engineering can figure out if you had bad oil in the car or not by analyzing a failed part. If you have an engine failure you know the thing will be torn down and analyzed before they warranty it.

All this talk of the OLM, changing oil, providing proof, and whatever else is just **** retentive *** covering. Is it your choice to do it, sure, but to demand others do it and to make up reasons as to why is crazy. The OLM is a tool, not gospel.

Foosh

Now it is you who is handing out bad advice and clouding the issue. It is just so freaking simple to follow the guidance so that there is no question. I'm not "demanding" anyone do anything. I'm expressing my opinion that it is idiotic to do otherwise when it so cheap to do so.

I don't give a crap about an engineer's view of the world with regard to this simple issue. I'm talking about the real world.

LT1 Z51

That is your opinion.

Following the guidance is the best way to avoid all problems. But the world will not end if people do not.

If you are going to argue strongly in favor of following the guidance fine, but do not say to people that by circumventing it will cause irreparable harm unless you can back it up with data.

That's my big point of advocacy. I actually change my oil yearly. But because I want to, not because I fear the OLM or GM.

Foosh

Right we agree, and all I said all along. Now that wasn't so hard was it?

I'm well aware of cases on many vehicles where people have never changed the oil, and after 50K miles, the engines still haven't blown up. It's only when they do on rare occasion that the problems begin for those who haven't been smart.

Joy c7

We have two dealers in Fort Wayne that have had '17s on the lot for over a year. Do you think the dealers change the oil in them or just reset?

Foosh

I don't know, but it wouldn't surprise me if they just reset. In that case, it wouldn't matter warranty wise, because the car will show the date it went "in service" in GMVIS.

I'd ask for a fresh oil change before delivery because of all the times it was likely started cold, and moved a short distance from place to place without ever getting up to operating temp to burn off the condensation. Moreover, there is gasoline dilution of oil due to blow by cold pistons on gasoline rich starting engines.

Skid Row Joe

You bring up a massively good question.

Especially since I bought my new, 2017 C7 in November 2017, that was manufactured in August 2016.

I suppose some of the rabid annual-oil changers around here, will now proclaim that my GM warranty is null and void. In fact I'm certain that some will red flag my 4-month old C7, with 905 miles on it.

Shall I post my VIN #, Foosh? Since I have NO record of the annual oil change as having taken place in 2017? I'm sure that you will want to get GM to void my warranty.

Foosh

Cute Joe. All that matters is what happens since you've owned the car. It's your baby now, not the dealer's.

Skid Row Joe

I have no argument. That's what has become the folly of some here.

You might want to inspect/respond to my questions posed well beforehand. My questions were simple enough. What convoluted them were the rabbit holes some like Foosh chose to go off on. As well as the lady you just responded to.