AFM Range Tech Idea
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,800
Likes: 2,653
From: Down south in Dixie
I didn't Joe. I wanted to be able to remove it all easily when I take her in for service. I just lay the cord/switch over the steering column. The length allowed the switch button to be right on top of the column itself, and the unit just hangs down causing no problems at all.
Last edited by Rebel Yell; Sep 1, 2018 at 03:59 PM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 2,438
Likes: 590
From: Tellico Plains Tennessee
Like some others, I don't see a reason to turn the Range on or off during driving, nor change its function based on a predetermined speed. Most of us bought the Range to eliminate V4 altogether, most common reason is TC problems. Its cool, I guess, to add functionality but this doesn't seem to fit most people's needs.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 8,669
Likes: 2,724
From: Atlanta GA
BREAKING NEWS: Man on internet questions reading comprehension of another forum member as passive-aggressive intelligence insult. Film at 11.
PS: Why is that people think they can be dicks and then self-exonerate themselves with "Cheers" and a beer glass? A dick is a dick, emoticon or not. Own your actions.
PS: Why is that people think they can be dicks and then self-exonerate themselves with "Cheers" and a beer glass? A dick is a dick, emoticon or not. Own your actions.
don't pay attention to him and maybe he will go away lol lol
Dave
Dave
Safety Car
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,101
Likes: 719
From: Northeast MA & Mad Beach FL
I don't know who makes the plugin module because I do my own mods in the code, not with a Range module. But I think it'd be nice if the Range module had a little slide switch on the top that offered a few different options:
- AFM ON
- AFM OFF below 35 mph
- AFM OFF below 66 mph
- AFM OFF
(Or heck even simpler, a rocker switch that just had two positions, AFM OFF and AFM OFF BELOW 65).
So that gives you the option to selectively turn it off in the city but keeping it for the highway, which is how I coded mine up. That lets me drop down to V4 at 75mph and just cruise cheaply.
Thoughts? Would you want it selectable? It'd be trivial for them to do.
- AFM ON
- AFM OFF below 35 mph
- AFM OFF below 66 mph
- AFM OFF
(Or heck even simpler, a rocker switch that just had two positions, AFM OFF and AFM OFF BELOW 65).
So that gives you the option to selectively turn it off in the city but keeping it for the highway, which is how I coded mine up. That lets me drop down to V4 at 75mph and just cruise cheaply.
Thoughts? Would you want it selectable? It'd be trivial for them to do.
I have a slight shutter once in awhile when it's running in V4, and it varies from slight to non existent over the course of driving around 4-5 hours in a day.
Cruising anywhere from 65 mph on up can't, tell if it's in V8 or V4.
IMO GM should have programmed it as you suggest, Off at low speeds, On at highway speeds.
My Range is setup with an On/Off switch and I turn it on After the engine is started.
And there is no ill affect turning it Off and On while driving.
It's no different than the way it turns Off and On from the factory except now its controlled manually.
::cheers
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 8,729
Likes: 1,508
From: Redmond WA
The reason I brought it up is that I don't mind AFM and think it's a decent feature at 65mph cruising on the Interstate. Since I don't need 600 ft-lb to go 65mph on flat ground, why not shut a few cyl down?
But I don't want it kicking in around town now that I have the Corsa exhaust, it gurgles and drones (in AFM only). So I turned it off in the city, but kept it on the highway, and thought others might want that same flexibility, but it would seem not! Question asked and answered.
But I don't want it kicking in around town now that I have the Corsa exhaust, it gurgles and drones (in AFM only). So I turned it off in the city, but kept it on the highway, and thought others might want that same flexibility, but it would seem not! Question asked and answered.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 7,137
Likes: 3,176
From: Kannapolis MA.
GM,Must have figured that Lugging a engine is ok. Now that they figured that out.Start dropping cylinders.The drive train has to make adjustments with the Torque and RPM'S some how...NO THANKS..Range On all the time.
I do understand OP'S Thinking.
I do understand OP'S Thinking.
Last edited by DALE#3; Sep 2, 2018 at 01:09 PM.
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 13,599
Likes: 12,856
From: Virginia
Besides the above, I don't want an on-off switch/cable hanging down under the dash. I don't get why anyone would want to turn their devise on and off.
Last edited by Kevin A Jones; Sep 2, 2018 at 01:18 PM.
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Drifting
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,332
Likes: 630
The reason I brought it up is that I don't mind AFM and think it's a decent feature at 65mph cruising on the Interstate. Since I don't need 600 ft-lb to go 65mph on flat ground, why not shut a few cyl down?
But I don't want it kicking in around town now that I have the Corsa exhaust, it gurgles and drones (in AFM only). So I turned it off in the city, but kept it on the highway, and thought others might want that same flexibility, but it would seem not! Question asked and answered.
But I don't want it kicking in around town now that I have the Corsa exhaust, it gurgles and drones (in AFM only). So I turned it off in the city, but kept it on the highway, and thought others might want that same flexibility, but it would seem not! Question asked and answered.
But to answer your question about 'why not shut a few cyl down' - because it causes massive drivetrain vibrations that damage the drivetrain. Look up the issues the A8 cars have had and look up how the GM designers talked about strengthening the driveline to deal with said vibrations. Sure, GM saves some money on emissions laws, but the customer ends up with drivetrain problems.
Advanced
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 54
Likes: 33
From: Ellijay
I just used double sided tape made for trim attachment. I have the cord running left to right just under the dash. I have the switch in easy reach. I really only use the switch if I'm not going to be driving it for more than a few days. Just so there's no draw on the battery.
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 54,204
Likes: 180
From: S.W. Ohio. . . . . . NRA Life Member
the Range device is not really about 4cyl - 8cyl... it's more about avoiding a future TC failure. Just happens that not allowing the 4cyl mode is what is done to save the TC. So, there's never really a reason to disable it.
I just got back from a road trip to Michigan. With the Range installed (8cyl mode all the time) I averaged 26.9mpg with the AC on.
I just got back from a road trip to Michigan. With the Range installed (8cyl mode all the time) I averaged 26.9mpg with the AC on.
Heel & Toe
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 24
Likes: 8
From: St. Louis
I don’t want to start a fight here but I do have a question. First, I have not done a lot of research on this problem so please no verbal beatings. Just trying to learn since I have a 19 Z A8. Are we sure that the actual problem is cause by the AFM system/vibrations and not a design issue or flaw of the TC? It could be setup/designed differently but I have a 2009 G8 GT with the A6 and AFM, but called DOD (displacement on demand). I haven’t heard or read any reports of the G8 GT’s having torque converter issues caused by the AFM. They did only made these cars for 2 years in the states and many years in Australia as the Holden commodore, and they are getting into the high mileage zone but no real issues like we are talking here. So, is it possible that the TC issues are caused by something else other than the AFM? And if not, how worried should I be with the AFM damaging the TC in my auto Z since it doesn’t really drive around or stay in 4 mode much at all.
thanks for the input
Edit
i did find more to read on the topic here. It seems the AFM is the issue. I still ask, should I be worried?
thanks for the input
Edit
i did find more to read on the topic here. It seems the AFM is the issue. I still ask, should I be worried?
Last edited by 2019z06; Sep 2, 2018 at 05:36 PM.
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 13,599
Likes: 12,856
From: Virginia
I just used double sided tape made for trim attachment. I have the cord running left to right just under the dash. I have the switch in easy reach. I really only use the switch if I'm not going to be driving it for more than a few days. Just so there's no draw on the battery.
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,203
Likes: 51
From: Englewood OH
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 8,669
Likes: 2,724
From: Atlanta GA
Dave
Safety Car
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,101
Likes: 719
From: Northeast MA & Mad Beach FL
I don’t want to start a fight here but I do have a question. First, I have not done a lot of research on this problem so please no verbal beatings. Just trying to learn since I have a 19 Z A8. Are we sure that the actual problem is cause by the AFM system/vibrations and not a design issue or flaw of the TC? It could be setup/designed differently but I have a 2009 G8 GT with the A6 and AFM, but called DOD (displacement on demand). I haven’t heard or read any reports of the G8 GT’s having torque converter issues caused by the AFM. They did only made these cars for 2 years in the states and many years in Australia as the Holden commodore, and they are getting into the high mileage zone but no real issues like we are talking here. So, is it possible that the TC issues are caused by something else other than the AFM? And if not, how worried should I be with the AFM damaging the TC in my auto Z since it doesn’t really drive around or stay in 4 mode much at all.
thanks for the input
Edit
i did find more to read on the topic here. It seems the AFM is the issue. I still ask, should I be worried?
thanks for the input
Edit
i did find more to read on the topic here. It seems the AFM is the issue. I still ask, should I be worried?
But there is one thing I read out of all of them that makes me take notice.
With the A8 being a longer Transmission because of the 8 Gears, GM had to use a Short Stubby TC in order for it to fit in the C7.
In a word, apparently it's not Robust enough to handle the constant engaging and disengaging of the Clutch Packs while in V4.
The vast majority work fine, but there's definitely many that do not.
With the latest Transmission fluid formula used for the Flush fix, it helps some owners, but not others, then a new TC is put in.
There's been a lot of success with either one of those fix options, but, not 100% for either.
So in one sense we could say AFM is at fault, but it wouldn't be if the TC was able to handle it.
AFM actually works fine, it's the TC that doesn't because it can't handle it.
And yes, without AFM we wouldn't have this problem, or would we ?
There's been some owners that knew about this possible issue and never used AFM V4 mode since new and they still needed a new TC
My question is, with thousands of C7's with the A8 out there without TC problems, why does it happen to some, and not others.
Just my thoughts and info for what its worth
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 7,137
Likes: 3,176
From: Kannapolis MA.
Roll off the Dice?
Or not?
Last edited by DALE#3; Sep 3, 2018 at 06:48 AM.
Heel & Toe
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 24
Likes: 8
From: St. Louis
There's Hundreds of threads on this and a Sticky.
But there is one thing I read out of all of them that makes me take notice.
With the A8 being a longer Transmission because of the 8 Gears, GM had to use a Short Stubby TC in order for it to fit in the C7.
In a word, apparently it's not Robust enough to handle the constant engaging and disengaging of the Clutch Packs while in V4.
The vast majority work fine, but there's definitely many that do not.
With the latest Transmission fluid formula used for the Flush fix, it helps some owners, but not others, then a new TC is put in.
There's been a lot of success with either one of those fix options, but, not 100% for either.
So in one sense we could say AFM is at fault, but it wouldn't be if the TC was able to handle it.
AFM actually works fine, it's the TC that doesn't because it can't handle it.
And yes, without AFM we wouldn't have this problem, or would we ?
There's been some owners that knew about this possible issue and never used AFM V4 mode since new and they still needed a new TC
My question is, with thousands of C7's with the A8 out there without TC problems, why does it happen to some, and not others.
Just my thoughts and info for what its worth
But there is one thing I read out of all of them that makes me take notice.
With the A8 being a longer Transmission because of the 8 Gears, GM had to use a Short Stubby TC in order for it to fit in the C7.
In a word, apparently it's not Robust enough to handle the constant engaging and disengaging of the Clutch Packs while in V4.
The vast majority work fine, but there's definitely many that do not.
With the latest Transmission fluid formula used for the Flush fix, it helps some owners, but not others, then a new TC is put in.
There's been a lot of success with either one of those fix options, but, not 100% for either.
So in one sense we could say AFM is at fault, but it wouldn't be if the TC was able to handle it.
AFM actually works fine, it's the TC that doesn't because it can't handle it.
And yes, without AFM we wouldn't have this problem, or would we ?
There's been some owners that knew about this possible issue and never used AFM V4 mode since new and they still needed a new TC
My question is, with thousands of C7's with the A8 out there without TC problems, why does it happen to some, and not others.
Just my thoughts and info for what its worth
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 54,204
Likes: 180
From: S.W. Ohio. . . . . . NRA Life Member
Instructor
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 109
Likes: 2
From: Rancho Mission Viejo, CA
I have a slight shutter once in awhile when it's running in V4, and it varies from slight to non existent over the course of driving around 4-5 hours in a day.
Cruising anywhere from 65 mph on up can't, tell if it's in V8 or V4.
IMO GM should have programmed it as you suggest, Off at low speeds, On at highway speeds.
My Range is setup with an On/Off switch and I turn it on After the engine is started.
And there is no ill affect turning it Off and On while driving.
It's no different than the way it turns Off and On from the factory except now its controlled manually.
::cheers