Dry Sump vs Wet Sump
03-03-2014, 01:02 AM
#1
Racer
Thread Starter
Dry Sump vs Wet Sump
Ok here is my question...
Is it true that a dry sump motor will produce more horsepower than a traditional wet sump system. If this is correct why is it that Chevy is rating the Z51 and non Z51 cars with the same horsepower numbers? I understand the reasoning behind the installation of the dry sump in the Z51 and not in the Base cars. I was just wondering about the horsepower....
I am sure this has been discussed but I could not find it when I did a search... Thanks.....
Is it true that a dry sump motor will produce more horsepower than a traditional wet sump system. If this is correct why is it that Chevy is rating the Z51 and non Z51 cars with the same horsepower numbers? I understand the reasoning behind the installation of the dry sump in the Z51 and not in the Base cars. I was just wondering about the horsepower....
I am sure this has been discussed but I could not find it when I did a search... Thanks.....
Last edited by Papas02C5; 03-03-2014 at 06:25 AM.
03-03-2014, 06:13 AM
#2
Safety Car
Ok here is my question...
Is it not true that a dry sump motor will produce more horsepower than a traditional wet sump system. If this is correct why is it that Chevy is rating the Z51 and non Z51 cars with the same horsepower numbers? I understand the reasoning behind the installation of the dry sump in the Z51 and not in the Base cars. I was just wondering about the horsepower....
I am sure this has been discussed but I could not find it when I did a search... Thanks.....
Is it not true that a dry sump motor will produce more horsepower than a traditional wet sump system. If this is correct why is it that Chevy is rating the Z51 and non Z51 cars with the same horsepower numbers? I understand the reasoning behind the installation of the dry sump in the Z51 and not in the Base cars. I was just wondering about the horsepower....
I am sure this has been discussed but I could not find it when I did a search... Thanks.....
The factory "dry sump" system is kinda crappy anyways just like it was on the c6z.
03-03-2014, 06:24 AM
#3
Racer
Thread Starter
I'm not trying to start a "which oil is better" thread. I am just curious about all I have read about the dry sump systems. This is the first car I have owned with a dry sump system installed...
03-03-2014, 06:26 AM
#4
Race Director
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If you want to free up HP through the crankcase then look into a vacuum pump.
www.GZMotorsports.com
I had one on my Z06 and it was a big difference!
www.GZMotorsports.com
I had one on my Z06 and it was a big difference!
03-03-2014, 06:40 AM
#5
Safety Car
I understand that. My point is that between the factory set ups the hp difference is so minor that it's not worth noting.
03-03-2014, 10:49 AM
#6
Melting Slicks
My understanding is that dry sumps main attribute is always having enough oil and reservoirs to help ensure the pump always has enough oil to pump into the engine.
I’m sure both the dry and wet sump engines have measures to ensure there is no crankshaft “windage” so the counterweights don’t beat the oil into foam.
I’d bet there would be more difference in HP between individual engines of the same type than between an average of several engines of each type. Don
I’m sure both the dry and wet sump engines have measures to ensure there is no crankshaft “windage” so the counterweights don’t beat the oil into foam.
I’d bet there would be more difference in HP between individual engines of the same type than between an average of several engines of each type. Don
03-03-2014, 11:17 AM
#7
Melting Slicks
Really depends on the application, I dont think the advantage on these is in freeing up power. Its keeping oil supply under hard cornering and adding more volume to keep it cooler.
A well designed race type dry sump will scavenge oil from various places, valley, heads etc so oil never drips down on the cam/crank and causes windage. Plus that scavenge stages cause negative pressure in the crankcase so no need for vacuum pumps. Plus people want to put engines lower in the chassis so that puts the oil closer to the crank so you are limited by a large capacity wet sump system.
Plus most aftermarket dry sump pumps are more efficient then the OE type they replace, so they can pick up a few HP. Then there is the safety aspect of dumping a quart of oil on a racetrack if a rod goes through the pan as opposed to 10 quarts.
The Vette OE setup is a nice option for hard cornering but I dont think there is a much of a power benefit from it. Even the best dry sump as opposed to mediocre wet sump with a decent windage tray isnt going to make much more power, whatever extra HP you get is bonus for spending a lot of time and money plumbing a multi-stage dry sump. Keeping air-free oil supplied at all times is its main benefit.
A well designed race type dry sump will scavenge oil from various places, valley, heads etc so oil never drips down on the cam/crank and causes windage. Plus that scavenge stages cause negative pressure in the crankcase so no need for vacuum pumps. Plus people want to put engines lower in the chassis so that puts the oil closer to the crank so you are limited by a large capacity wet sump system.
Plus most aftermarket dry sump pumps are more efficient then the OE type they replace, so they can pick up a few HP. Then there is the safety aspect of dumping a quart of oil on a racetrack if a rod goes through the pan as opposed to 10 quarts.
The Vette OE setup is a nice option for hard cornering but I dont think there is a much of a power benefit from it. Even the best dry sump as opposed to mediocre wet sump with a decent windage tray isnt going to make much more power, whatever extra HP you get is bonus for spending a lot of time and money plumbing a multi-stage dry sump. Keeping air-free oil supplied at all times is its main benefit.
03-03-2014, 11:22 AM
#8
Team Owner
Both setups are SAE tested by GM. If there was enough of a power difference to claim more, believe me, GM would. A dry sump can add power depending on how bad the wet sump is and how good the dry sump is.
03-03-2014, 11:24 AM
#9
Melting Slicks
The HP boost comes from the lack of oil hitting the crank. In short, in a traditional pan when you are doing performance related items (hard cornering, acceleration, braking) it is likely that the crank is sloshing through oil. This means you are losing power because it has to slosh through oil instead of air.
The reason why the power is the same is engines aren't given power numbers while actually moving. So, on a dyno, you are likely to see the exact same horsepower between the two. In the real world it feels like the dry sump engine has more power because it retains all of it instead of losing it through turns and hard acceleration.
GM keeps the HP number the same because of this
03-03-2014, 12:10 PM
#10
Team Owner
The dry sump has less horsepower as the crankshaft has to pressurize the oil twice as it has two oil pumps. It takes horsepower to drive the oil pump(s).
03-03-2014, 12:18 PM
#11
Safety Car
I'm not sure what would make any dry sump system crappy over another... care to explain?
The HP boost comes from the lack of oil hitting the crank. In short, in a traditional pan when you are doing performance related items (hard cornering, acceleration, braking) it is likely that the crank is sloshing through oil. This means you are losing power because it has to slosh through oil instead of air.
The reason why the power is the same is engines aren't given power numbers while actually moving. So, on a dyno, you are likely to see the exact same horsepower between the two. In the real world it feels like the dry sump engine has more power because it retains all of it instead of losing it through turns and hard acceleration.
GM keeps the HP number the same because of this
The HP boost comes from the lack of oil hitting the crank. In short, in a traditional pan when you are doing performance related items (hard cornering, acceleration, braking) it is likely that the crank is sloshing through oil. This means you are losing power because it has to slosh through oil instead of air.
The reason why the power is the same is engines aren't given power numbers while actually moving. So, on a dyno, you are likely to see the exact same horsepower between the two. In the real world it feels like the dry sump engine has more power because it retains all of it instead of losing it through turns and hard acceleration.
GM keeps the HP number the same because of this
Needs upgraded...
http://store.katechengines.com/are-l...ge-3-p144.aspx
03-03-2014, 12:35 PM
#12
Team Owner
The wet sump pans in modern cars are designed well to keep oil off the crank. They have windage trays/etc. I doubt the crank is just cutting through oil during corners.
03-03-2014, 04:15 PM
#13
Heel & Toe
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Most performance cars now have a windage tray which keeps the oil away from the crank which will also increase the HP very slightly as well as keeping the oil from being aireated by the crank. The purpose of the dry sump system is to insure there is always adequate oil supply under high corning forces. The external tank works as a surge tank or reservoir to make sure the pump has consistent supply. It is true that the larger pump will require a slight more HP to drive, however in the overall picture your couldn't detect it on a dyno.
03-03-2014, 06:23 PM
#14
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03-03-2014, 08:06 PM
#15
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St. Jude Donor '14-'15
So before anybody starts shelling out for a conversion...
03-04-2014, 07:11 PM
#16
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03-04-2014, 07:33 PM
#17
Racer
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03-04-2014, 09:04 PM
#18
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I had one one my z06 and there was a definite seat of the pants difference. it is worth it. no oil in the intake is a huge bonus. even with catch cans I would get at least some....vacuum pump removes all lines into the engine.
03-04-2014, 09:28 PM
#20
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