Why Isn’t Airflow Increasing With Intake Mods?
Race Director
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 10,961
Likes: 2,643
From: Texas Hill Country
My last car was a 2012 GT and it had 2 factory widebands (and 2 downstream narrow bands) so the fuel metering was pretty accurate. The self adjustment window was very small though. There are multiple intake styles for coyotes that either require or don't require a tune, and it is my understanding that is related to the diameter of the MAF housing and overall air flow. That car did have a factory CAI that could support pretty big HP though. When I say they require a tune I mean the car doesn't run with the intake and no tune, most won't even idle. I'm surprised AFE put out a product that just makes the engine really lean and then brags about HP gains. Is there any merit to what they said about driving it 100 miles before you see the power increase?
The coyote could not however swing the timing 8 degrees as was indicated in this thread, it had the ability to go 2 degrees each way. Unless it was a super hot day or something 93 octane was enough to max out the 2 degrees of advance, so more octane got you nothing. If this car can keep advancing it until there's knock then I'm mixing some 110 the next time I go to the track.
I asked the top guys on the fast list what fuel they ran and nobody answered lol, maybe now I know why.
The coyote could not however swing the timing 8 degrees as was indicated in this thread, it had the ability to go 2 degrees each way. Unless it was a super hot day or something 93 octane was enough to max out the 2 degrees of advance, so more octane got you nothing. If this car can keep advancing it until there's knock then I'm mixing some 110 the next time I go to the track.
I asked the top guys on the fast list what fuel they ran and nobody answered lol, maybe now I know why.
I also tune Mustangs in addition to GM products. The AFE starts and runs just fine without a tune. Does that mean it doesn't need a tune to minimize fuel trims and dial in WOT fueling? Of course it does. Would you sprint through the forest blindfolded? Because when you install parts that move more air and don't at least check to see what they do, much less correct, that's exactly what you are doing. And putting your engine in the hands of an internet dyno across the country from you is not smart.
Not getting a tune is a mistake. As Chris Rock once said, "you can drive with your feet if you want to, that don't make it a good fkn idea!!!" (in my best Chris Rock voice)
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 2,204
Likes: 17
From: Fayetteville North Carolina
St. Jude Donor '15
First, you need to take what tblu has to say with a grain of salt. He is very new to tuning but has (according to him) decided to make it his profession except he won't tell us where he works....
I also tune Mustangs in addition to GM products. The AFE starts and runs just fine without a tune. Does that mean it doesn't need a tune to minimize fuel trims and dial in WOT fueling? Of course it does. Would you sprint through the forest blindfolded? Because when you install parts that move more air and don't at least check to see what they do, much less correct, that's exactly what you are doing. And putting your engine in the hands of an internet dyno across the country from you is not smart.
Not getting a tune is a mistake. As Chris Rock once said, "you can drive with your feet if you want to, that don't make it a good fkn idea!!!" (in my best Chris Rock voice)
I also tune Mustangs in addition to GM products. The AFE starts and runs just fine without a tune. Does that mean it doesn't need a tune to minimize fuel trims and dial in WOT fueling? Of course it does. Would you sprint through the forest blindfolded? Because when you install parts that move more air and don't at least check to see what they do, much less correct, that's exactly what you are doing. And putting your engine in the hands of an internet dyno across the country from you is not smart.
Not getting a tune is a mistake. As Chris Rock once said, "you can drive with your feet if you want to, that don't make it a good fkn idea!!!" (in my best Chris Rock voice)
I bought a diablosport but I doubt I will even load the canned tune because I still want to go after the stock record. When the time comes I'll just use it to pull timing for the nitrous. For now I'm going to try a 100 shot with no other mods and see what it'll run.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,375
Likes: 328
From: CA.
St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15
That's great info, thanks! I was always under the impression that if an intake didn't require a tune then it wasn't a very good intake, or at least not much better than stock. I know things change over time and the ability of the computer to self adjust is getting better and better though.
Your comments make me think that this engine might pick up a little from octane, if the timing self-adjustment window is that big I'm curious if anybody has tried 97 or 100 octane and logged the timing.
Your comments make me think that this engine might pick up a little from octane, if the timing self-adjustment window is that big I'm curious if anybody has tried 97 or 100 octane and logged the timing.
In the LS era the STOCK WOT fuel was always programmed in the high 11's or low 12's---With a CAI the leaness it creates at WOT would always make more HP immediately as they were pig rich STOCK---- The AFR would raise up to about a still safe 12.5---
-However the LT1's are programmed much leaner at WOT STOCK----in the 12.7 area---Adding a CAI onto a LT1 can put the WOT AFR in the mid 13's--so now they're much leaner---
Last edited by tblu92; May 7, 2015 at 09:53 PM.
Drifting
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,646
Likes: 188
In the LS era the STOCK WOT fuel was always programmed in the high 11's or low 12's---With a CAI the leaness it creates at WOT would always make more HP immediately as they were pig rich STOCK---- The AFR would raise up to about a still safe 12.5---
-However the LT1's are programmed much leaner at WOT STOCK----in the 12.7 area---Adding a CAI onto a LT1 can put the WOT AFR in the mid 13's--so now they're much leaner---
-However the LT1's are programmed much leaner at WOT STOCK----in the 12.7 area---Adding a CAI onto a LT1 can put the WOT AFR in the mid 13's--so now they're much leaner---
Basically the same difference
