I've searched the forum and couldn't find the info I was looking for so I figured I'd start a thread to try and get it all in the same place.

I plan to get a set of longtubes which will require tuning. I have a Diablo Trinity T-1000 already. Bought it back when I had my previous car. Not sure what I need to do to use it on this vehicle but I'll ask Diablo that. I see some people get a Diablewtune. I assume this can work for headers but not sure. I've seen on the forum that some people use HP tuners. I know nothing about them. I've seen some vendors offer EFI Live tuning, once again I know nothing about it. Another vendor offers SCT X4 with remote tuning. There is the option to go to a speed shop and get dyno tuned with whatever software/hardware they use.

My questions are which tuning device is the best to use? Do they really offer that much difference in variables they can change? The one speed shop I spoke with doesn't use the T-1000. Can I get similar results with remote tuning from one of the vendors here compared to dyno/street tuning? I figure a dyno is the best way but asking opinions and if anybody here has personal experience with both.

 

I was under the impression that you do not need a tune with longtubes unless you go catless and need to turn the rear o2 sensors off.

 

There are, as you found, many tuning devices. The Diablosport tuners are handheld tuners typically used for throttle response adjustment and air filters really. Unfortunately they are very limited with the tables in the ECU they have access to. They offer built in tunes that adjust very little overall. They do support custom tunes. Headers can be tuned for through DiabloSports, which requires a custom tune from someone such as Diablew. Diablo shines though because they can remove the tune quickly without a trace before taking it in to the dealer and then put the tune back when you leave.

HP Tuners, and EFI Live are tuning "suites". They are professional level tuning software with an associated hardware interface that allows for complete access to all needed variables in the ECM. The difference between these two are basically brand, but most people prefer HP Tuners, as do I. These programs typically require training and experience to use them.

SCT tuners are popular with the Mustang crowd, I don't have any experience with them on Chevy's. For the Mustangs they were similar to the Diablo's.

Remote tuning is possible with all of these options, but can take longer to get it right as they are not present when you do your runs between changes. Duno tuning is always best. This allows the tuner to make changes quickly and if there is a problem when testing changes they can immediately let off the throttle. The most common setup is going to by an "in person" tune on a dyno using HP Tuners or EFI live, and what I would recommend..

This is not correct actually. "Long tubes" indicate the primary runners are "longer" and therefore relocate the O2 sensors farther downstream. As a result, a tune is 100% required as the relocation of the O2's causes unexpected readings to the computer that must be adjusted for. Also, yes, shutting off the rear O2's is best.

 

You really don't have to it will run fine as if you didn't put them on the car. But to get the boost are HP from adding them you will need to have the cat tuned. Plus the only thing that will happen also putting the LT headers with pulling the back cat off the car the check engine light will come on is all. ASK ME HOW I KNOW THAT.

 

My experience in the past was using tuneboy and power commander for ducati's and triumphs and now with cars the SCT X4. I have used it on both of my Ford Raptors and my 15 1LE Camaro all utilizing remote tunes.( all seperate SCT handhelds as it stores your stock tune)My personal opinion is if your only doing exhaust such as long tubes and an intake all you will need is a remote tune. Anything after that best to get a dyno tune.

For my Camaro I bought kooks headers, cai with SCT X4 tuner and remote tune from Steve and Victor at RDP. I had a grin from ear to ear everytime I drove that car and it ran perfect!

Im hesitant to go this route with my grand sport because of warranty but I just ordered kooks and SCT X4 from RDP today, hard to resist the feel and sound of a good tune and headers!!!!!

 

Speed shop I'd go to quoted $500 for dyno tune and $100 for 2 HP tuner credits. I assume the 500 is for the expertise and time on dyno/street making adjustments and $100 is to access the software. If adjustments were needed I assume I'd have to take the car in since I wouldn't have a device or the software to change it. Should I buy a HPT VCM scanner?

I'm looking into the most cost effective way to add the headers and I have a Diablo Trinity so using that seems easiest but I can sell that and use the better software. FYREANT I've seen your posts and you seem to know your stuff (and build your own engine!) so if EFI Live or HP tuners is best thats what I'll go with.




[QUOTE=brettmess24;1595378579)
Im hesitant to go this route with my grand sport because of warranty but I just ordered kooks and SCT X4 from RDP today, hard to resist the feel and sound of a good tune and headers!!!!![/QUOTE]

I see this deal and the free lifetime tunes. Thats what got me really investigating tuning devices. If you go this route please post back with your results.

 

Thanks for the accolades

What we should consider is what are the plans with the car? Is it going to be just headers and maybe an intake? Or are you going to add a supercharger and meth at some point? If your keeping to just minor bolt ons, you can get away with a diable tune. If you have bigger plans, you'll eventually have to do something like HPT or EFI to take full advantage of the mods.

$500+$100 is a decent price for a dyno tune. I paid $800 for mine which included them buying the credits. I would also cost compare what it will take to have a remote tune done on the diablo. HP Tuners Pro suite can be purchased for around $500-$600. Maybe less if you buy used. It will come with 8 credits if you buy new and takes 2 to license your car. If you buy used, the previous owner may have used some or all of the credits obviously.

Ant

 

Guys, AFAIK, the very important point here is that Diablo devices do not have access to all necessary tables, while HP tuner and EFI live do. As such, no matter how good the tuner is, the tune will be incomplete at best, ineffective at worst when diablo devices are used. The check engine light is obviously very important, but turning the check engine light off is only one part of the tune..

 

Correct. I can at least confirm the Diablo has the ability to get to the necessary tables to tune for headers and intakes. They can shut off the rear O2's and adjust the MAF accordingly. I used to have a Diablo a couple years ago.

 

I most certainly will

Give Steve a call at RDP he is more than willing to answer your questions. They call him dyno Steve for a reason.

I could be wrong but I believe the SCT is just the conduit to receive the custom tune and clear codes etc. I don't think there are any limits on the actual tune. You can data log and send that info to Steve. I might do just that if I don't like the tune the way it is, but he's tuned tons of corvettes with headers and intake. I know every car is different but they have to be darn close with limited mods.

 

I believe this is the case also..

 

I don't know about the capabilities of SCT, but just to be clear, we were talking about the limited access to maps of some of these products including to the tuners, not the limits on what end users can do.

 

I'm not sure I understand what your asking "limited access to maps" there is no limit if you have a dyno and experience. Without it you could tune based on datalogging if you know what your doing....

Are your referring to the maps that the manufacturer of the handheld device might have made? I wouldn't use those imho maybe just to get by...

I can't speak for the specific tuners and I have never used Diablo but I know they dyno the cars get the parameters set up how they like them for AFR, type of fuel, modifications and driveability. After they are happy with the tune they share that same tune with others and have the ability from experience and knowledge to customize them appropriately. Your paying for that specific tune they have made and there first had knowledge.

Same as the "canned" tunes that come with some of the devices. These are usually very very safe tunes that may or may not add HP. If I had the same mods fyreant has Redline could send me his tune they made for him and I could download that to my car for example.

Now with an auto transmission a lot can be done to change shift points etc on how you drive the car. My Raptor driveability was greatly improved from 5*Tunning and the conduit was the SCT X4.

My Camaro and grand sport are both manual transmission cars. All I can say is my RDP tune for my Camaro with Kooks headers, cai intake etc was a different animal and was an absolute blast to drive. I kick myself for not doing it sooner.

 

What he was explaining is that not all tuning software is created equal. The ECM is programed via dozens and dozens of "maps" or "tables" that have X and Y axis' and use extrapolated data to populate some of the fields. Diablo CANNOT get to a good chunk of these tables. As an example, if HP Tuners can get to 100 tables in the ECM, Diablo can only get to like 5-10.

The dyno itself has nothing to do with the parameters. The dyno is only used to measure the performance itself. The parameters come from an unrelated third party tuning software such as those that are mentioned above.

 

Gotcha, makes perfectly good sense! Let's get Steve in here and see if he can answer that or I'll call him tomorrow.

Go to the first page on this link, looks pretty extensive but I'm in banking...😂

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...rdp-store.html

 

Yes, the SCT is just like the Diablo. If I told you there was 1,000+ settings that you can change in HP Tuners, vs the 20-30 you see on this page, that would put it into perspective lol. I used to have an SCT tuner for my Mustang and had lifetime tunes through BAMA tunes on the American Muscle website bundled with it. Well, long story short, the tunes were garbage and made the car slower and lowered gas mileage. A trifecta of crap. Your mileage may vary though..

 

I'd love to have a SC down the road but right now I think I'll stop at headers E85 and a tune. On the way to the grocery store I nailed it in first with the paddle shift and I was going 70 in a 35 before I knew it. A SC and 650+ hp sounds great but for a car I don't race I'm not sure all that power is necessary.

I don't believe I need the most advanced level of tuning for my current goals. How much tuning do Headers, a filter, and E85 require? This is interesting though if there really are that many more variables EFI and HPT have access to over the other devices. I'm a few months out on getting the headers but I'm figuring out exactly who I'm getting the parts from and how it will get tuned.

I know theres a guy on this forum that did headers and E85 to the tune of 475rwhp or something similar. I'd be curious to find him and see what he used.

 

Pretty sure for E85 you will need to be tuned using a "real" tuning suite, or go to a dyno shop that does it for you. Doubt you will get anyone remote tuning corn oil..

 

Edgyvette had a post with Higgs remote tuning a package with E85 using HPT. I think there is another later post though that says they switched to EFI Live. Anywho it leads me to believe its possible and folks can/do remote tune all of their bolt ons. I'll be contacting them as the time gets closer. They guarantee best prices so can't beat that.

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...e-special.html

 

good call