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I saw a video on YouTube last night of an angry Z06 owner who had to purchase new front tires after putting about 12,000 miles on them. Turns out that - although they looked good on the outside (lots of tread left) - a 1" area on the inside of both fronts was worn down to the threads.
He took it in to his dealer and they said that was due to his fronts being set at the factory 3-degree camber. He also said that they were surprised that he got over 12,000 miles on his tires, because they usually needed replacing around 8,000-10,000 miles. He was mad that they would not cover the cost of new tires under warranty and that he had to buy a new pair for $1,200.
Since that, he took his Z06 in to a friendly Firestone Tire Center that was very helpful. He said that they took the camber out of the front (along with selling him 2 new tires) and that now his front tires should last much, much longer. However, the message of his video was "Z06/GS owners beware! There is something the dealers don't tell you, so you need to know this!"
For all of you veteran Corvette Forum members out there - what do you think? Is this true? What has your experience been?
I bought a 2017 Z06 a month-and-a-half ago and it only has about 800 miles on it so far (it's been a cold and snowy winter here in Central Ohio). Do I need to take my car in and have the camber reduced in order to extend the life of my front tires?
Help, please! Any advice you could pass my way would be greatly appreciated.
I saw a video on YouTube last night of an angry Z06 owner who had to purchase new front tires after putting about 12,000 miles on them. Turns out that - although they looked good on the outside (lots of tread left) - a 1" area on the inside of both fronts was worn down to the threads.
He took it in to his dealer and they said that was due to his fronts being set at the factory 3-degree camber. He also said that they were surprised that he got over 12,000 miles on his tires, because they usually needed replacing around 8,000-10,000 miles. He was mad that they would not cover the cost of new tires under warranty and that he had to buy a new pair for $1,200.
Since that, he took his Z06 in to a friendly Firestone Tire Center that was very helpful. He said that they took the camber out of the front (along with selling him 2 new tires) and that now his front tires should last much, much longer. However, the message of his video was "Z06/GS owners beware! There is something the dealers don't tell you, so you need to know this!"
For all of you veteran Corvette Forum members out there - what do you think? Is this true? What has your experience been?
I bought a 2017 Z06 a month-and-a-half ago and it only has about 800 miles on it so far (it's been a cold and snowy winter here in Central Ohio). Do I need to take my car in and have the camber reduced in order to extend the life of my front tires?
Help, please! Any advice you could pass my way would be greatly appreciated.
So first of all I'll say that if you're angry that you have to replace tires on a Corvette after 12000 miles they you have unrealistic expectations. I'm going to assume these were not the Z07 spec Sport Cup 2 tires but were rather they were the Super Sports that have a fair bit more tread but in any case these aren't deep tread hard compound high mileage tires.
Now, if his dealer claimed the cars come with -3 deg of camber when they leave the factory then his dealer has no idea what they are talking about. In fact, those of us track rats that actually might want that much camber have to go to the some pretty significant measures and I don't know anyone that's gotten more then -2.8 or -2.9.
As I said before, it's the toe that causes most of the wear, not the camber. Think about taking a rubber ball and rolling it rather than dragging it across a surface. More camber just means you have slightly less surface rolling, your toe being off means you are dragging the tire as the car moves forward.
Also, go get a digital level, zero it on a surface, and see just how small the difference between 0, 1, 2, 3 degrees is, then also consider that the camber is constantly changing as the suspension moves and the car shifts weight. The weight of the driver, whether you have a passenger, the fuel load in the car, all of these will change the position of the suspension and the alignment.
I guess this is along way of saying, just because some guy posts an angry rant on the Internet doesn't mean it's true. The same could be said for me though
Poor-sha is correct; getting 12K miles out of a set of tyres on a Z06 should be considered an exception not the rule. Well as long as you don’t drive it like your grandmother would.
Plus it’s damn near impossible to get -2.0 front camber on a stock Z06 let alone -3.0, so again as Poor-sha states this is an improperly set toe issue, which seems to be quite common from the factory.
As for when to get your first alignment, I’d say after no more than a couple of hundred miles. Find a shop that really knows what they’re doing and can set the rear caster correctly. It will transform the handling and make it far safer when the car is being driven ‘aggressively’.
Hey guys, Does anyone know of a shop in the Chicago area/suburbs that does rear caster on our cars? I went to one of the best known corvette techs in the area (Crystal Lake) to get my car aligned and he did not have the tools.
Poor-Sha..... for us non-track rats, who also are not alignment experts. Do you recommend the DSC alignment to get the best possible longevity out of the tires???
I'm not foolish, I don't expect 30k miles, but what will get us the best wear, even if we drive it hard?
If you're not tracking it I'd go with the street recommendations from DSC. Light track go with the street track settings. I had a little over 9000 miles on mine when I replaced the ss's but I wore out a set of cups on another set of wheels during that 9,000 miles on track. I have no idea how many miles I got out of the street tires but less than 9,000 for sure. The toe was not correct on my car either and that's what caused the wear.
Here's the latest DSC alignment specs that are currently posted on their site. Note that their recommendation for rear toe is different depending on if you have the OE toe bar or the aftermarket Granatelli adjustable toe-links.
Go to the DSCSport.com site and under the "Technical" tab select "Setup Notes" and you'll see where you can click on the alignment specs to get a .pdf file:
...but what will get us the best wear, even if we drive it hard?
If you drive aggressively on the street I'd recommend the DSC "STREET/OCCASIONAL TRACK" specs.
Below is the GM recommendation for street alignment specs. You can see that the front camber is different on each side, and that's to compensate for crowned roads that can cause a pull with equal camber.
Like badhabit said: "The toe was not correct on my car either and that's what caused the wear."
I totally agree with that - toe is usually what causes excessive tire wear, especially cording on the inside or outside of the tire instead of even tread wear.
The problem with the GM alignment below is that GM has rather wide +/- specs, and a normal alignment shop will just go for green readings on the readout of their machine and you can end up with something different on each side but still be within specs. So, make sure your alignment guy gets as tight to the spec as possible on each side. And of course their machine will not read rear caster, so make sure they write down your before and after rear caster specs on the sheet their machine prints out.
You can see that the document below is from 2015. I'm sure nothing has changed since then except the GS has been built, and I'd use the FE6 or FE7 specs for a Z06 or GS for a pure street alignment:
As Poor-Sha points out I think you're being unrealistic on the miles you expect to get out of the tires. For comparison, I'm running a slightly aggressive alignment and I get 4,000 street miles out of a set of front tires.
Here's mine getting aligned at Mike Levitas' shop in MD. What a difference.
GM specifies toe as degrees. The machine pictured here and other brands as well show the toe in distance (either mm or inches). That is because they measure the distance from the imaginary center of the car to the front and rear of the rim based on the size of the head attached to the wheel. If you use the distance shown on the DSC charts or pictures of their machine display you need to verify your measurements are made at the same distance apart as the machine is making them. For example a .5 mm difference between the front and rear of a 20 inch diameter wheel is a lot different angle than a .5mm difference from front to rear of a 20 foot diameter wheel. This is a graph that shows how the angle measured varies with the distance and the diameter of the wheel.
This chart is copied from the Smart Strings User Manual.
I can measure total toe with my toe plates and the tape measure notches in the toe plates are 24 inches apart so .5 mm per wheel may not be measurement I am looking for.
The other thing to consider is .5 mm is about equal to 3/128 or 1.5/64ths. That is a very hard measurement to eye ball with a tape measure especially if you can't get your eye's field of view perpendicular to the measurement point.
Bill
Last edited by Bill Dearborn; 01-12-2018 at 04:01 PM.
Thanks I called my dealer and spoke to the service manager and he said that he spent a lot of money on a new lift but that it wouldn't accomadate a Z07 because of limited access and the side skirts and splitter. I'll call around and see who has the expertise.
My dealer in Lake Bluff IL, the Chevy Exchange, seemed to have no trouble aligning Z06s. When my car was first delivered I asked the dealer to do an alignment because I had heard of alignment problems from the factory. They said fine and that GM would cover it. Unfortunately, after it was done they said GM would not cover it because the car had no miles on it. They said GM will cover an alignment after 500 miles, to allow the suspension to settle in. Since alignment was not covered by GM, dealer and I split the cost. Used the Pfadt Performance Street settings that have been published elsewhere. I have checked tire depth and see uniform depth all around after 10,000 miles with the exception of the inside of the right front tire which is one 32nd less than the rest of the tires. Will keep an eye on it but so far seems OK. --Bob
My dealer in Lake Bluff IL, the Chevy Exchange, seemed to have no trouble aligning Z06s. When my car was first delivered I asked the dealer to do an alignment because I had heard of alignment problems from the factory. They said fine and that GM would cover it. Unfortunately, after it was done they said GM would not cover it because the car had no miles on it. They said GM will cover an alignment after 500 miles, to allow the suspension to settle in. Since alignment was not covered by GM, dealer and I split the cost. Used the Pfadt Performance Street settings that have been published elsewhere. I have checked tire depth and see uniform depth all around after 10,000 miles with the exception of the inside of the right front tire which is one 32nd less than the rest of the tires. Will keep an eye on it but so far seems OK. --Bob
I've had my 500-mile oil change and currently have 800 on mine. When it comes time for the 1,500-mile service, I'll talk to the dealer about including an alignment.
It's good to know that with your current setup, your tires are wearing well!
01-12-2018, 07:49 AM
I'll call around and see who has the expertise.
