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Time to Kill Nurburgring Lap Record Reporting

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Time to Kill Nurburgring Lap Record Reporting

 
Old 11-02-2018, 09:24 AM
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Default Time to Kill Nurburgring Lap Record Reporting

This is getting ridiculous. If a heavily modified car with aftermarket racing seats, chassis/aero upgrades, preproduction tires, and a lot of the notorious Porsche 'Ring tuning can be crowned as the "record holder" then the debate is over. Porsche, and other mostly European manufacturers, are simply not using production cars for these tests anymore. If you use experimental parts/tires, extensive third party modifications, and custom tunes for that particular track it completely defeats the purpose of the "production car" comparison. The ZR1 had no chance with the deck stacked against it like this.

If LG Motorsports' modified Z06 had set a new record while in Germany just weeks ago it would have gotten virtually ZERO press and would have been dismissed as "a heavily modified, far from production car". That is exactly what Porsche just ran and is being heralded as the new "King of the Ring". Disgusting.

​​​​​​https://carbuzz.com/news/porsche-911...ing-lap-record

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Old 11-02-2018, 10:23 AM
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I agree, "road legal" doesn't necessarily mean "showroom stock", which is what I would like to see from the car makers when this type of run is made.
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Old 11-02-2018, 12:10 PM
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I thought the production street car record is now held by Lamborghini.
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Old 11-02-2018, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by stevebz06 View Post
I thought the production street car record is now held by Lamborghini.
Did you read the article? It addresses that in the first paragraph.... A highly modified 911 GT2RS just beat the "stock" Aventador SVJ by 4+ seconds and is now considered the record holder...

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Old 11-02-2018, 12:15 PM
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Who cares? Well besides you.
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Old 11-02-2018, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by TARANTULA View Post
Who cares? Well besides you.
Apparently quite a few since manufacturers spend MILLIONS developing cars at the Ring and attempting record laps... My argument is that these tests/records should be disregarded as it is clear there is no "apples to apples" comparison to be had. There was a time when the Nurburgring lap time meant something to me when assessing a car's performance, value, etc. however it is clear now that it is an unreliable source of information due to cheating, unfair advantage, etc.

GM, don't waste your money testing at the Ring! I don't blame you one bit for not releasing the times for the Z06 and ZR1 either!
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Old 11-02-2018, 01:37 PM
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You sound bitter.
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Old 11-02-2018, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by HPT View Post
You sound bitter.
Thanks, great addition to the discussion
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Old 11-02-2018, 03:22 PM
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Originally Posted by TARANTULA View Post
Who cares? Well besides you.
You seem to care. A lot!
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Old 11-02-2018, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by HTXSkydiver View Post
This is getting ridiculous. If a heavily modified car with aftermarket racing seats, chassis/aero upgrades, preproduction tires, and a lot of the notorious Porsche 'Ring tuning can be crowned as the "record holder" then the debate is over. Porsche, and other mostly European manufacturers, are simply not using production cars for these tests anymore. If you use experimental parts/tires, extensive third party modifications, and custom tunes for that particular track it completely defeats the purpose of the "production car" comparison. The ZR1 had no chance with the deck stacked against it like this.

If LG Motorsports' modified Z06 had set a new record while in Germany just weeks ago it would have gotten virtually ZERO press and would have been dismissed as "a heavily modified, far from production car". That is exactly what Porsche just ran and is being heralded as the new "King of the Ring". Disgusting.

​​​​​​https://carbuzz.com/news/porsche-911...ing-lap-record
What makes you think the GT2 RS that ran 6:48.xx was actually showroom stock?
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Old 11-02-2018, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by HTXSkydiver View Post

Thanks, great addition to the discussion
No one's claiming it's a production car. Do some more research on Manthey-Racing, the parts on the car, the availability and support of those parts, then report back.
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Old 11-02-2018, 03:58 PM
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Here is the thing, nothing stops GM from doing the same. Reality is corvette is much harder to drive at the limit, not as balanced, and it would take too many laps to get the perfect lap as a result GM just doesnt bother. I hardly doubt if Lars Ken was given ZR1 he would run a sub 7 minute lap first try like he did with gt2rs. Gt2rs has things ZR1 doesnt offer like RWS, massive aero (in another league), magnesium roof and wheels, race bucket seats. Out of the box its easier to drive at the limit. We all know this but we still complain. Have you guys even sat in those porsche bucket seats? They are the closest racing seats in a road legal car you will see. I m sorry, the competition seats corvette has is just not good enough.

This keeps going back to the fact that these cars are built for very different purposes. You just cannot daily drive a gt2rs but zr1 you easily could.

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Old 11-02-2018, 04:12 PM
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Originally Posted by UnhandledException View Post
Here is the thing, nothing stops GM from doing the same. Reality is corvette is much harder to drive at the limit, not as balanced, and it would take too many laps to get the perfect lap as a result GM just doesnt bother.
Naw, it's budget that stops GM from doing the same.
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Old 11-02-2018, 04:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Warp Factor View Post
Naw, it's budget that stops GM from doing the same.
GM has far more profit surplus than Porsche in pure corporate terms speaking.
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Old 11-02-2018, 04:52 PM
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Who cares if a modified Porsche beats a stock Lambo Aventador. The Lambo hands down is much better looking.
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Old 11-02-2018, 05:40 PM
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Originally Posted by UnhandledException View Post
Here is the thing, nothing stops GM from doing the same. Reality is corvette is much harder to drive at the limit, not as balanced, and it would take too many laps to get the perfect lap as a result GM just doesnt bother. I hardly doubt if Lars Ken was given ZR1 he would run a sub 7 minute lap first try like he did with gt2rs. Gt2rs has things ZR1 doesnt offer like RWS, massive aero (in another league), magnesium roof and wheels, race bucket seats. Out of the box its easier to drive at the limit. We all know this but we still complain. Have you guys even sat in those porsche bucket seats? They are the closest racing seats in a road legal car you will see. I m sorry, the competition seats corvette has is just not good enough.

This keeps going back to the fact that these cars are built for very different purposes. You just cannot daily drive a gt2rs but zr1 you easily could.
Finally someone talking sense. Dont forget the weight advantage and transmission advantage. GM should have piloted a DCT in the ZR1. I have no idea why they stuck with the A8, which is known to be slower than the ZF A8 in the hellcat. I think power advantage is with the RS too, those things put down over 680rwhp.

GM will definitely have to step their game up by offering more options on the Corvette. Starting with a front lift kit, which all the top euro car makes have. Lift kit raises the front to clear driveways and speed bumps.

Last edited by serpent; 11-02-2018 at 05:41 PM.
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Old 11-02-2018, 06:09 PM
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Originally Posted by UnhandledException View Post
Here is the thing, nothing stops GM from doing the same. Reality is corvette is much harder to drive at the limit, not as balanced, and it would take too many laps to get the perfect lap as a result GM just doesnt bother. I hardly doubt if Lars Ken was given ZR1 he would run a sub 7 minute lap first try like he did with gt2rs. Gt2rs has things ZR1 doesnt offer like RWS, massive aero (in another league), magnesium roof and wheels, race bucket seats. Out of the box its easier to drive at the limit. We all know this but we still complain. Have you guys even sat in those porsche bucket seats? They are the closest racing seats in a road legal car you will see. I m sorry, the competition seats corvette has is just not good enough.

This keeps going back to the fact that these cars are built for very different purposes. You just cannot daily drive a gt2rs but zr1 you easily could.
You might be interested in this link, especially 6:00 to 7:30
https://video.search.yahoo.com/searc...f&action=click

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Old 11-02-2018, 06:21 PM
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Originally Posted by UnhandledException View Post
GM has far more profit surplus than Porsche in pure corporate terms speaking.
But only a tiny portion is allocated to the Corvette. Unlike Porsche, GM puts most of their development into Mom and Pop vehicles.

Last edited by Warp Factor; 11-02-2018 at 06:30 PM.
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Old 11-02-2018, 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Lavender View Post
What makes you think the GT2 RS that ran 6:48.xx was actually showroom stock?
I donít think it was lol. Thatís exactly my point
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Old 11-02-2018, 06:43 PM
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Originally Posted by HPT View Post
No one's claiming it's a production car. Do some more research on Manthey-Racing, the parts on the car, the availability and support of those parts, then report back.
So whatís your point? Who cares who makes the aftermarket parts or how available they are. The point is the car was modified and the record they claim is supposed to be for showroom stock cars.
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