Corvette Manta Ray: GM's bold new plan
12-04-2018, 08:10 PM
#61
Banned Scam/Spammer
No kidding, PCMIII is a joke. He has absolutely no credibility and tries to pass of wild estimations as facts. He even denied Kai Spande ever said BGA max capacity was 33k in one thread and then completely contradicted himself by using the information in another thread. When he gets called out on it he remains silent because he knows he is full of it.
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12-04-2018, 08:11 PM
#62
Manta Ray has history, it was the name of the GM show car that foretold the 1968 C3.....I was 12 in 1966 and had an AMT model of it.
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12-04-2018, 08:11 PM
#63
I’m close enough to the inside to know the following about GM’s plans for the Corvette. I cannot reveal all I know without jeopardizing my business’s success, so please do not ask me to explain further, I will not answer. If you don’t believe me then that’s fine, I wouldn’t either if I was in your shoes, but I’m compelled to post now so there is less disappointment later when the Eagle has Landed.
The C8 Corvettes at Nürburgring are the real thing - the 2020 Corvette Manta Ray. This base Corvette will be powered by an updated LT1 V8 with about 520hp and 485 lb-ft torque. A DCT transaxle is used in all C8 Corvettes, no exceptions. The R&D investment in the DCT is said to be equivalent to that of both the manual and automatic in the C7 - they knew they had one chance to get the DCT right. The interior will be somewhat higher quality than the C7, and GM’s stylists have attempted a more “upscale” design. I have not seen it but those who have say it’s impressive, but still not at Porsche or Ferrari levels, which seems fair given the price.
In 2021 GM will revolutionize the Corvette lineup. In addition to the base Corvette two different high-end models will be introduced: Corvette Grand Tour and Corvette Grand Sport. The GT is as luxurious as if Cadillac designed it, because a Cadillac team is in fact responsible for the GT. It’s a true GT and in addition to standard MRC it will deploy a full gamut of NVH countermeasures like acoustic glass, heavy sound deadening, and special wheels/tires, all for a cross country tourer that with a twist of the mode dial will handle any road or even a race track. The GT will be propelled by a version of Cadillac’s 4.2L twin turbo V8 with the turbos moved to the sides, and this engine is said to be the quietest V8 GM has ever developed. Word is that GM benchmarked the Corvette GT’s NVH against German luxury tourers from Mercedes Benz and BMW. Not sports cars, tourers.
The Grand Sport moniker will be used for the insane sports version and it will feature additional escalating packages with more and more track orientation. GM found that buyers liked the name “Grand Sport” better than their alphanumeric gibberish “ZO6” so they ran with it. MRC is standard and in later years there will be a track package with DSSV and a higher output engine. What engine, you say? Hold on to your butts because the GS will be powered by a beastly 5.5L twin turbo V8 that is said to be frighteningly powerful and in private track sessions has dominated both “the Germans and Italians.” That’s just the first year GS, not the track-oriented version. My description isn’t hyperbole - those who have driven the GS tell me that it is literally frightening to floor it. GM even had a team of lawyers in to advise on the legal perils of selling such a potent vehicle for street use.
How the Corvette is sold will change as radically as the engine mounting position. Any GM dealer will be able to sell the Corvette brand, but on the flip side, it will be far more difficult for dealers to qualify to sell Corvettes. You won’t have to worry about Joey the Chevy Cruze expert wrenching on your Corvette since dealers will require a minimum count of certified Corvette techs and only those techs will be permitted to work on Corvettes. Since “Corvette” will be a brand unto itself it implies more than just the GT and GS sub-models, doesn’t it? Make of this what you will.
Interestingly, a mid engine Corvette makes space for the 7th gen Camaro to slip into the C7’s current segment in 2021, at current Camaro prices. The 2021 Camaro will be as revolutionary as the C8 but that’s for another forum at another time.
So there you have it, GM’s bold and brash sports car strategy. These will be the last of GM’s gasoline powered sports cars, a bright nuclear flash before the onset of an EV future. I’m familiar with one of the upcoming EV sports cars as well. Suffice to say, performance gearheads have absolutely nothing to worry about because every one of the sports cars (and sports CUVs) in development at GM are poised to vastly exceed expectations.
The C8 Corvettes at Nürburgring are the real thing - the 2020 Corvette Manta Ray. This base Corvette will be powered by an updated LT1 V8 with about 520hp and 485 lb-ft torque. A DCT transaxle is used in all C8 Corvettes, no exceptions. The R&D investment in the DCT is said to be equivalent to that of both the manual and automatic in the C7 - they knew they had one chance to get the DCT right. The interior will be somewhat higher quality than the C7, and GM’s stylists have attempted a more “upscale” design. I have not seen it but those who have say it’s impressive, but still not at Porsche or Ferrari levels, which seems fair given the price.
In 2021 GM will revolutionize the Corvette lineup. In addition to the base Corvette two different high-end models will be introduced: Corvette Grand Tour and Corvette Grand Sport. The GT is as luxurious as if Cadillac designed it, because a Cadillac team is in fact responsible for the GT. It’s a true GT and in addition to standard MRC it will deploy a full gamut of NVH countermeasures like acoustic glass, heavy sound deadening, and special wheels/tires, all for a cross country tourer that with a twist of the mode dial will handle any road or even a race track. The GT will be propelled by a version of Cadillac’s 4.2L twin turbo V8 with the turbos moved to the sides, and this engine is said to be the quietest V8 GM has ever developed. Word is that GM benchmarked the Corvette GT’s NVH against German luxury tourers from Mercedes Benz and BMW. Not sports cars, tourers.
The Grand Sport moniker will be used for the insane sports version and it will feature additional escalating packages with more and more track orientation. GM found that buyers liked the name “Grand Sport” better than their alphanumeric gibberish “ZO6” so they ran with it. MRC is standard and in later years there will be a track package with DSSV and a higher output engine. What engine, you say? Hold on to your butts because the GS will be powered by a beastly 5.5L twin turbo V8 that is said to be frighteningly powerful and in private track sessions has dominated both “the Germans and Italians.” That’s just the first year GS, not the track-oriented version. My description isn’t hyperbole - those who have driven the GS tell me that it is literally frightening to floor it. GM even had a team of lawyers in to advise on the legal perils of selling such a potent vehicle for street use.
How the Corvette is sold will change as radically as the engine mounting position. Any GM dealer will be able to sell the Corvette brand, but on the flip side, it will be far more difficult for dealers to qualify to sell Corvettes. You won’t have to worry about Joey the Chevy Cruze expert wrenching on your Corvette since dealers will require a minimum count of certified Corvette techs and only those techs will be permitted to work on Corvettes. Since “Corvette” will be a brand unto itself it implies more than just the GT and GS sub-models, doesn’t it? Make of this what you will.
Interestingly, a mid engine Corvette makes space for the 7th gen Camaro to slip into the C7’s current segment in 2021, at current Camaro prices. The 2021 Camaro will be as revolutionary as the C8 but that’s for another forum at another time.
So there you have it, GM’s bold and brash sports car strategy. These will be the last of GM’s gasoline powered sports cars, a bright nuclear flash before the onset of an EV future. I’m familiar with one of the upcoming EV sports cars as well. Suffice to say, performance gearheads have absolutely nothing to worry about because every one of the sports cars (and sports CUVs) in development at GM are poised to vastly exceed expectations.
Price is coming in under 170k over 150k
The poster seems upset that the truth (above) is starting to sink in and this is just a delusional attempt to try and sway public opinion his way until they unveil this 600/800hp monster at the Auto show with a starting price a little higher then a fully optioned ZR1.
If you think chevy is building a rear engine sports car for 5k more then the price of the current top of the line camaro-- OR if you think the current engines will fit in the mid engine platform you should be declared legally insane.
Last edited by ViperFan1; 12-04-2018 at 08:13 PM.
12-04-2018, 08:14 PM
#64
Melting Slicks
No kidding, PCMIII is a joke. He has absolutely no credibility and tries to pass of wild estimations as facts. He even denied Kai Spande ever said BGA max capacity was 33k in one thread and then completely contradicted himself by using the information in another thread. When he gets called out on it he remains silent because he knows he is full of it.
Spande said 33K was the maximum Corvette production at BGA which is going to build vehicles other than Corvette in the future. Get a clue.
Last edited by PCMIII; 12-04-2018 at 08:15 PM.
12-04-2018, 08:15 PM
#66
Burning Brakes
I’m close enough to the inside to know the following about GM’s plans for the Corvette. I cannot reveal all I know without jeopardizing my business’s success, so please do not ask me to explain further, I will not answer. If you don’t believe me then that’s fine, I wouldn’t either if I was in your shoes, but I’m compelled to post now so there is less disappointment later when the Eagle has Landed.
The C8 Corvettes at Nürburgring are the real thing - the 2020 Corvette Manta Ray. This base Corvette will be powered by an updated LT1 V8 with about 520hp and 485 lb-ft torque. A DCT transaxle is used in all C8 Corvettes, no exceptions. The R&D investment in the DCT is said to be equivalent to that of both the manual and automatic in the C7 - they knew they had one chance to get the DCT right. The interior will be somewhat higher quality than the C7, and GM’s stylists have attempted a more “upscale” design. I have not seen it but those who have say it’s impressive, but still not at Porsche or Ferrari levels, which seems fair given the price.
In 2021 GM will revolutionize the Corvette lineup. In addition to the base Corvette two different high-end models will be introduced: Corvette Grand Tour and Corvette Grand Sport. The GT is as luxurious as if Cadillac designed it, because a Cadillac team is in fact responsible for the GT. It’s a true GT and in addition to standard MRC it will deploy a full gamut of NVH countermeasures like acoustic glass, heavy sound deadening, and special wheels/tires, all for a cross country tourer that with a twist of the mode dial will handle any road or even a race track. The GT will be propelled by a version of Cadillac’s 4.2L twin turbo V8 with the turbos moved to the sides, and this engine is said to be the quietest V8 GM has ever developed. Word is that GM benchmarked the Corvette GT’s NVH against German luxury tourers from Mercedes Benz and BMW. Not sports cars, tourers.
The Grand Sport moniker will be used for the insane sports version and it will feature additional escalating packages with more and more track orientation. GM found that buyers liked the name “Grand Sport” better than their alphanumeric gibberish “ZO6” so they ran with it. MRC is standard and in later years there will be a track package with DSSV and a higher output engine. What engine, you say? Hold on to your butts because the GS will be powered by a beastly 5.5L twin turbo V8 that is said to be frighteningly powerful and in private track sessions has dominated both “the Germans and Italians.” That’s just the first year GS, not the track-oriented version. My description isn’t hyperbole - those who have driven the GS tell me that it is literally frightening to floor it. GM even had a team of lawyers in to advise on the legal perils of selling such a potent vehicle for street use.
How the Corvette is sold will change as radically as the engine mounting position. Any GM dealer will be able to sell the Corvette brand, but on the flip side, it will be far more difficult for dealers to qualify to sell Corvettes. You won’t have to worry about Joey the Chevy Cruze expert wrenching on your Corvette since dealers will require a minimum count of certified Corvette techs and only those techs will be permitted to work on Corvettes. Since “Corvette” will be a brand unto itself it implies more than just the GT and GS sub-models, doesn’t it? Make of this what you will.
Interestingly, a mid engine Corvette makes space for the 7th gen Camaro to slip into the C7’s current segment in 2021, at current Camaro prices. The 2021 Camaro will be as revolutionary as the C8 but that’s for another forum at another time.
So there you have it, GM’s bold and brash sports car strategy. These will be the last of GM’s gasoline powered sports cars, a bright nuclear flash before the onset of an EV future. I’m familiar with one of the upcoming EV sports cars as well. Suffice to say, performance gearheads have absolutely nothing to worry about because every one of the sports cars (and sports CUVs) in development at GM are poised to vastly exceed expectations.
The C8 Corvettes at Nürburgring are the real thing - the 2020 Corvette Manta Ray. This base Corvette will be powered by an updated LT1 V8 with about 520hp and 485 lb-ft torque. A DCT transaxle is used in all C8 Corvettes, no exceptions. The R&D investment in the DCT is said to be equivalent to that of both the manual and automatic in the C7 - they knew they had one chance to get the DCT right. The interior will be somewhat higher quality than the C7, and GM’s stylists have attempted a more “upscale” design. I have not seen it but those who have say it’s impressive, but still not at Porsche or Ferrari levels, which seems fair given the price.
In 2021 GM will revolutionize the Corvette lineup. In addition to the base Corvette two different high-end models will be introduced: Corvette Grand Tour and Corvette Grand Sport. The GT is as luxurious as if Cadillac designed it, because a Cadillac team is in fact responsible for the GT. It’s a true GT and in addition to standard MRC it will deploy a full gamut of NVH countermeasures like acoustic glass, heavy sound deadening, and special wheels/tires, all for a cross country tourer that with a twist of the mode dial will handle any road or even a race track. The GT will be propelled by a version of Cadillac’s 4.2L twin turbo V8 with the turbos moved to the sides, and this engine is said to be the quietest V8 GM has ever developed. Word is that GM benchmarked the Corvette GT’s NVH against German luxury tourers from Mercedes Benz and BMW. Not sports cars, tourers.
The Grand Sport moniker will be used for the insane sports version and it will feature additional escalating packages with more and more track orientation. GM found that buyers liked the name “Grand Sport” better than their alphanumeric gibberish “ZO6” so they ran with it. MRC is standard and in later years there will be a track package with DSSV and a higher output engine. What engine, you say? Hold on to your butts because the GS will be powered by a beastly 5.5L twin turbo V8 that is said to be frighteningly powerful and in private track sessions has dominated both “the Germans and Italians.” That’s just the first year GS, not the track-oriented version. My description isn’t hyperbole - those who have driven the GS tell me that it is literally frightening to floor it. GM even had a team of lawyers in to advise on the legal perils of selling such a potent vehicle for street use.
How the Corvette is sold will change as radically as the engine mounting position. Any GM dealer will be able to sell the Corvette brand, but on the flip side, it will be far more difficult for dealers to qualify to sell Corvettes. You won’t have to worry about Joey the Chevy Cruze expert wrenching on your Corvette since dealers will require a minimum count of certified Corvette techs and only those techs will be permitted to work on Corvettes. Since “Corvette” will be a brand unto itself it implies more than just the GT and GS sub-models, doesn’t it? Make of this what you will.
Interestingly, a mid engine Corvette makes space for the 7th gen Camaro to slip into the C7’s current segment in 2021, at current Camaro prices. The 2021 Camaro will be as revolutionary as the C8 but that’s for another forum at another time.
So there you have it, GM’s bold and brash sports car strategy. These will be the last of GM’s gasoline powered sports cars, a bright nuclear flash before the onset of an EV future. I’m familiar with one of the upcoming EV sports cars as well. Suffice to say, performance gearheads have absolutely nothing to worry about because every one of the sports cars (and sports CUVs) in development at GM are poised to vastly exceed expectations.
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RedDropTop (12-05-2018)
12-04-2018, 08:25 PM
#70
Burning Brakes
OP is creative for sure. Sorry but no one knows anything and certainly the OP doesnt have a clue either. Cleverly written though i give you that. Its funny how worked up folks get over a car thats had its engine moved. Its a 60k car folks.
12-04-2018, 08:34 PM
#71
Banned Scam/Spammer
12-04-2018, 08:38 PM
#73
Melting Slicks
Good info with some new spin on the direction of the brand. I mean nothing revolutionary we haven’t heard before.
Thank G we don’t have to long to wait for the truth to get out. I was hoping 40 days but it looks like the NY show could be the reveal. Way to many C7 still to sell and way to quit for a Detroit reveal.
Thank G we don’t have to long to wait for the truth to get out. I was hoping 40 days but it looks like the NY show could be the reveal. Way to many C7 still to sell and way to quit for a Detroit reveal.
Last edited by fasttoys; 12-04-2018 at 08:39 PM.
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General_TSO (12-07-2018)
12-04-2018, 08:43 PM
#75
Melting Slicks
Look at your own post #72 for a quote. If max production of corvettes is 33k with max overtime how could they produce more cars above and beyond that? There would be no labor available or time to do it and still make 33k corvettes. You really are quite the mental giant aren't you? https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...-vietro-4.html
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DAC17 (12-05-2018)
12-04-2018, 08:54 PM
#77
Team Owner
The different means of measuring horsepower(Gross vs Net) has nothing to do with the relationship between horsepower, torque and displacement.
Lets take a look at an 6.2L engine then that is measured in "Net". Okay with you?.
2013 LS1 with 436 HP/428 TQ
2014 LT1 with 460HP/465TQ.
So that I'm not BSing you then why don't you please explain why the torque went up 37 lb-ft but the HP only went up 24 while both are the same 6.2L displacement(both having the same bore and stroke)?
2009 ZR1 with 638 HP/604 TQ
2015 Z06 with 650 HP/650 TQ
2019 ZR1 with 755HP/715 TQ
With the same displacement(same bore and stroke) why the different ratios between the horsepower and torque of each engine(LS9/LT4/LT5)?
Last edited by JoesC5; 12-04-2018 at 08:59 PM.
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CorvetteBrent (12-05-2018),
IronV (12-06-2018)
12-04-2018, 09:01 PM
#78
Melting Slicks
Really, I'm not trying to BS you.
The different means of measuring horsepower(Gross vs Net) has nothing to do with the relationship between horsepower, torque and displacement.
Lets take a look at an 6.2L engine then that is measured in "Net". Okay with you?.
2013 LS1 with 436 HP/428 TQ
2014 LT1 with 460HP/465TQ.
So that I'm not BSing you then why don't you lease explain why the torque went up 37 lb-ft but the HP only went up 24 while both are the same 6.2L displacement(both having the same bore and stroke)?
2009 ZR1 with 638 HP/604 TQ
2015 Z06 with 650 HP/650 TQ
2019 ZR1 with 755HP/715 TQ
With the same displacement(same bore and stroke) why the different ratios between the horsepower and torque of each engine(LS9/LT4/LT5)?
The different means of measuring horsepower(Gross vs Net) has nothing to do with the relationship between horsepower, torque and displacement.
Lets take a look at an 6.2L engine then that is measured in "Net". Okay with you?.
2013 LS1 with 436 HP/428 TQ
2014 LT1 with 460HP/465TQ.
So that I'm not BSing you then why don't you lease explain why the torque went up 37 lb-ft but the HP only went up 24 while both are the same 6.2L displacement(both having the same bore and stroke)?
2009 ZR1 with 638 HP/604 TQ
2015 Z06 with 650 HP/650 TQ
2019 ZR1 with 755HP/715 TQ
With the same displacement(same bore and stroke) why the different ratios between the horsepower and torque of each engine(LS9/LT4/LT5)?
The Z engines are all supercharged with different size blowers so obviously they vary. What's your point?
12-04-2018, 09:08 PM
#79
Race Director
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CorvetteBrent (12-05-2018)
12-04-2018, 09:10 PM
#80
This post is likely from GM
I believe this post is written by General Motors. First, there is enough detailed information provided to spark interest, conversations, and excitement. This post is absolutely, professionally written to send a clear message that GM has big plans for its sport and muscle market along with a lateral reach for the touring markets. The author has not posted anything prior to this. My hat is off to General Motors, as I believe this is part of a global strategy. The corvette is the most profitable vehicle GM makes and it’s smart to turn the ship in that direction.
I think it is very prudent to get rid of the sedans that nobody wants anymore. All of you remember Kodak. They absolutely refused to go away from print film into the digital revolution. Look what happened to that company. GM is making the right moves at the right time and they are starting the conversations that EV is the long range goal. GM CEO Mary Barra has made some tough decisions recently and I am looking forward to the GM future.
I think it is very prudent to get rid of the sedans that nobody wants anymore. All of you remember Kodak. They absolutely refused to go away from print film into the digital revolution. Look what happened to that company. GM is making the right moves at the right time and they are starting the conversations that EV is the long range goal. GM CEO Mary Barra has made some tough decisions recently and I am looking forward to the GM future.
Last edited by GS17Vette; 12-04-2018 at 09:17 PM. Reason: Edit a word
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desmophile (12-05-2018)