Your leather chair above is beautiful, but it is likely NOT the type of leathers used in the auto industry. It's possible some of these products protect the polymer coating like the Adam's Graphene.

I could also take pictures of my car seats treated with nothing but a damp microfiber, and they would look the same years later. The coating will last as long as the dyes in the leather, unless chemically stripped away.

My main point here was to say those products labeled "leather conditioner" are not "conditioning" leather. What I've said here comes from published articles by leather experts, many of which have been published on this and other car forums over many years.

 

I have used Lexol on my 45 year old Vanson Leather motorcycle jackets, exotic boots, leather furniture and interiors. Good stuff.

 

I guess we can just agree to disagree.

However I would like to see photos of your Porsche seats condition 31 years from now with your just using a damp microfiber all that time.

 

That's correct. Corvette leather surfaces do not benefit in any way from additives, or conditioners of any type being lathered on them. The leather in your Corvettes are already sealed, from the factory. A damp with WATER microfiber cloth is perfect for maintaining the Corvette leather surfaces... For cleaning, a mild neutral Ph detergent concentrate with lots of water to dilute, is your best bet.

 

To the OP, since you are asking about cleaning, warm water with a mild detergent or a leather cleaner = same same. You won’t hurt anything with either one UNLESS you haven’t vac’ed or brushed off loose dirt first and/or are rubbing excessively, don’t cross that line!

To everyone else in the “polymer coatings need no protection except water and cloth” camp I DARE you to never use a protectant on your urethane paint polymer clear coat more than “cloth and water”. Your argument can’t be upheld for one and not the other.

A bottle of conditioner is a few bucks and seems to last years. Zero downside. 10years of rubbing your seats down with ‘cloth and water’ for cleaning/protection and HOPING the coating hasn’t worn through somewhere is…..🤦🏽‍♂️🤦🏽‍♂️🤦🏽‍♂️

 

I have said this in past posts and am more than happy to say it again. All of the the leather used in the C8 is the same as the C7, and both are coated. Up in Monterey a few years ago I met and spoke to the chief designer of the C7 interior. We spoke about leather cleaning and conditioning, which are two completely different processes. There are deep cleaning products such as Leatherique, and many other products that just clean the surface of the leather. Then there are the conditioning products that seep into and sometimes soften the surface of the leather. NONE of these products are recommended for C7 and C8 leather because, as I stated, the leather has a clear coating on it. I was told by the chief interior designer that all that is needed to clean the leather is a dampened microfiber towel, and for a hard-to-clean spot, just a touch, and I mean touch of Simple Green on the dampened towel. When I sold my C7 convertible with 58K miles on it, the 3LT black leather looked like new. My C8 HTC with 6K top-down miles has the 3LT natural dipped interior,, and it gets quite dirty. Not only does a damp microfiber towel with a touch of Simple green clean the leather, it also works great on the suede covered pillars that get filthy being exposed to the outside elements. So forget all of the great products that are for uncoated leather, and get some quality micro fiber towels and a bottle of Simple Green.

 

Info how to care for your leather seats, dashboard and door panels.

The three most common types of automotive leather are:

Aniline: Leather that has been dyed and coated with a pigment (colored urethane paint) to yield uniform color and then clear coated. This type of leather does not reveal scars, pores and blemishes and has an artificial uniform grain pattern embossed. It is typically the only real leather in the seat and located only in the center inserts of the seat. The sides, bolsters, etc., are vinyl painted with the same colored urethane paint so it matches the leather inserts perfectly giving the entire seat a "leather" look. This is what 99% of cars have including Corvette, Escalade, newer Ferrari and Lamborghini. To demonstrate this just put a drop of water on your seat and see if it soaks in. It will not soak in as the leather has a painted on urethane coating on it. If water can't penetrate the coating how can "conditioners" and "protectants?" Read on.....

Semi-Aniline: Leather that has been dyed and coated with a semi-transparent pigment then clear coated This type of leather may reveal some of the underlying scars and blemishes of the hide as well as some color and grain changes. Almost never seen in the past twenty years.

Synthetic (aka vinyl): Much of the leather, and in some, all of the leather in many of today's vehicles is entirely synthetic or engineered leather. It looks like real leather but is really entirely synthetic. This is in use in some high ticket brands like Lexus, MB and Infinity for example. It is often difficult to tell what is real leather and what is engineered leather.

The bottom line is 99.9% of cars sold today have leather only on the middle insert of the seat bottom and back. The sides are completely 100% vinyl. The color and texture of the vinyl matches the leather inserts perfectly as they are all sprayed with a colored urethane coating. A perfect way to demonstrate they are vinyl is the water drop test outlined above. Another way is pull some of the seat siding out from underneath the seat. Notice there is a very thin foam or cloth backing? Real leather (from real cows) doesn't have foam backing on it.

Have you noticed the change in new car window stickers when referring to the seats? They now call the interior "leather lined," or "leather trim." Just take a look at a new C7 Corvette window sticker. They don't say "leather seats" like they used to. Now the C7 window sticker says, "Trim, Leather." This is because only the center inserts are actually leather! The remainder of the seat is vinyl. Remember, vinyl has a thin foam or cloth backing on it.

Everyone seems to like the term "conditioner," but just what is conditioning? When leather professionals speak of “conditioning leather” they are usually speaking about leather hydration. Properly hydrated leather will be soft, plump and flexible making it resistant to creasing and cracking. Most traditional conditioners are typically oily or contain silicone, wax or things like Aloe or Neat's-foot or Mink oil. No protected, urethane coated, leather needs or benefits from these things. Conditioning products were initially designed for a much different type of leather like car seat who were 100% uncoated leather back in the 60's and 70's. Remember, none of these conditioners can absorb through the urethane coating making them useless.

Most conditioners leave a film on protected leather that can hasten the accumulation of soil. Dirt is attracted to the oil as it sits on top of the urethane coating and in the stitching. Your butt rubbing back and forth across this dirt acts like sandpaper and actually buffs the colored urethane coating off. This is frequently the cause of early bolster wear!

Conditioners do not penetrate the urethane painted top coat to condition the leather. True, some of the H2o in these conditioners evaporates and raises the relative humidity in the car cockpit which is beneficial as the leather will pick up the molecular H2o through the process of transpiration. Transpiration is the process by which moisture is carried through humidity to small pores on the underside of the leather/vinyl, where it changes to vapor and is released to the atmosphere. The leather/vinyl can absorb this through the untreated, underside of the material. However, a damp wipe down with a towel will do this as well and not leave that soil grabbing film.

Keep in mind that the colored urethane topcoat was added to the leather for the purpose of preventing spills and liquids from getting to the leather, as well as hiding the leather’s underlying scars, and blemishes, while making the leather more abrasion resistant. The urethane topcoat is colored so all of the surfaces of the seat match the door panels, dashboard, etc. If they did not contain coloring, every single piece of "leather" in your car would not match.

Leather conditioners do nothing to prevent stains or dye transfer. If your leather has developed cracks, using an oily conditioner may further degrade the adhesion of the painted topcoat around the crack and make the damage worse. Doesn't wet paper tear much easier than dry paper?

So how does this painted on protective urethane coating work and still allow the leather to stay hydrated? Much the same way as a rain coat would protect you from a driving rain. At the same time the rain is being repelled, you will begin to notice that your clothing is becoming damp due to the 100% humidity level. That's basically how your leather stays hydrated, at the molecular level. If you want to test this put a drop of water on your protected leather in an inconspicuous place and leave for 15-20 minutes and you will see that it does not soak in. That is the urethane top coat preventing the absorption of the liquid as it was designed to do. H2o is a small molecule when compared to an oily conditioner so if water is not being absorbed by the leather, the larger molecules of a conditioner certainly are not.

Ok, so for those who insist that their leather feels softer after using a conditioner I can suggest three reasons for this. The first is that the conditioner has left an oily film on the leather and it altered the "hand" or feel of the leather. It has not really done anything to the leather, as it can't get to the leather, but it makes the hand feel nice for a short time until it is rubbed off or evaporates.

The other reason is that the conditioner likely contains a good deal of water and that it is raising the humidity level in the proximity of the leather. If this happens, the leather may absorb the water molecules and plump up and feel softer. The thing about this is that a wipe down with a wrung out watered cotton towel would accomplish the exact same thing.

The third reason is that the term conditioner has no defined meaning. Who knows what is in the bottle labeled Leather Conditioner? What one company calls a conditioner another might call a protectant. Whatever your "conditioner" is will just give you the impression the leather is softer when you touch it since it is slick. It is certainly not "conditioned" since it cannot absorb into the leather or vinyl portion of your seats. Bottom line is the industry has too many vague definitions as to exactly what "conditioning" is.

Leather is made soft in the tanning process and then sealed. You cannot add oils back through the urethane topcoat of protected leather. Leather becomes hard if it loses its needed hydration. Dry leather shrinks and feels hard. Much the same way a chamois gets hard when it is dry. Rehydrate the chamois and it becomes soft again. Rehydrate unprotected leather seats and they should soften to the degree designed in the original tanning process. Think about it.

I never use products that contain neat's-foot, mink, or other oils, silicone, aloe, or any other odd, useless item, but often the labels doesn't tell you what is in the bottle. This includes Leatherique, Lexol, 303 Protectant, Armor All, Zaino, etc., etc. In my experience, these products do nothing but sit on top of the urethane top coating until your clothing wipes them off. In the meantime, they collect dust and dirt which is then ground into your seats and stitching as you slide across the seat getting in and out much like sandpaper. 90% of your seat damage comes from this!

In fact, the C7 Corvette owner's manual makes it clear that the only way to clean and treat the seats or other "leather" areas is with water and a mild soap - no cleaners or conditioners! This includes dashboard, door inserts, etc. More specifically, the manual states, "Use a soft microfiber cloth dampened with water to remove dust and loose dirt. For a more thorough cleaning, use a soft microfiber cloth dampened with a mild soap solution. Wipe excess moisture from these surfaces after cleaning and allow them to dry naturally. Never use heat, steam, or spot removers. Do not use cleaners that contain silicone or wax-based products. Cleaners containing solvents can permanently change the appearance and feel of leather or soft trim, and are not recommended. Soaking or saturating leather, especially perforated leather, as well as other interior surfaces, may cause permanent damage."

Don't you think GM would recommend leather cleaners and conditioners if the material was in fact all leather?

The only real, non-coated leather I have seen in a non-exotic car in the past 20 years is a Ford "Big Ranch" Truck. That is it! Take a look at one someday that is a year or more old. The seats will be a complete mess! Being uncoated everything soaks into them such as beer, soda, spew, jizz, body oil, urine, grease, dirt, etc. You will be happy the leather in your car is "coated" after seeing this. Remember, the reason this stuff doesn't soak into your seat is the same reason "conditioners" will not soak in so don't use them!

I vacuum the leather in my C6, Ferrari 360 and Lambo Gallardo and wipe it down with a wrung out watered (damp) towel weekly. This includes dashboard, door inserts, etc. When they get dirty, I clean them with delicate soap like Woolite (20 to 1 ratio) or a highly diluted all-purpose cleaner, A very nice, gentle product is Leathermasters Foam Cleaner. You can buy it at AutoGeek, Amazon, EBay, etc. Leather Master Foam Cleaner is suitable for all leather types including Aniline, Protected, Synthetic (vinyl), Nubuck and Suede Leather.

After cleaning, and before the seats dry, get the cleaning product out/off the seats with a wet towel. Not a damp towel, a wet, but not dripping wet, towel. Finish by wiping off and sucking up the moisture from the wet towel with a dry towel. Use several dry towels if necessary. The key is to absorb as much of the cleaner as possible. This ensures all of the cleaner was removed. Just a damp towel for normal maintenance and cleaning. That is it! Your leather will look like brand new for many years to come! My C6 is ten years old and the seats still look like brand new!

You are going to read a lot of people who make comments disagreeing with me. Just conduct the two above tests and make your own decisions. Does a drop of water soak into the seat or just sit on top until it evaporates? Does the backing of your seat material on the side pieces (bolster) have foam or cloth on the back? Remember, your seats may feel softer after applying a "conditioner," but go back in a day or two and see if they still feel that way. Once the conditioner dries on the seats and on your hands, this softness is gone!

If Corvette seats are 100% leather, why has GM changed their description on MSRP window sticker as "Trim, Leather" and why do they recommend against use of leather cleaners and conditioners? Always keep in mind that you’re dealing with the finished coating on the leather and not with the leather hide itself.

To go support the above, here is a link to the latest TSB from GM on how to care for the car interior:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/20...76647-9999.pdf (https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/20...76647-9999.pdf)

Last example how leather needs nothing more than a simple wipe with a damp cloth. You know that fine leather and recliner couch you own? When was the last time you conditioned it with Lexol, Leatherique, Zaino, etc.? Never! And I bet it still looks like brand new. How could this be if you need to smear leather conditioner and cleaners all over it all the time? Truth be known....do nothing and it will last forever!!!! Enuf said!

For any liquid to absorb into something porous such as leather that has not been coated with urethane, whether it be water, conditioners, soda pop, sweat, etc., the thickness of the liquid determines absorption. This is the principle of liquid "fluid dynamic," absorption and viscosity.

The study of liquid flow is called hydrodynamics. While liquids include all sorts of substances, hydrodynamics involve managing the flow of water.

The term viscosity is a measure of resistance to flow. It can be measured by observing the time required for a given volume of liquid to flow through an object. Thicker the liquid, higher the viscosity. Motor oil usually has two measurements. As an example, most cars not use something like 10w-40 oil viscosity. This means the oil is very thin when cold (10w) and thicker when hot (40).

The viscosity of a substance is related to the strength of the forces acting between its molecular units. In the case of water, these forces are primarily due to hydrogen bonding. As an example, honey is much more viscous because the sugars they contain are studded with hydroxyl groups (–OH) which can form multiple hydrogen bonds with water thus having much more viscosity.

In other words, the lower viscosity of a substance will flow and absorb much quicker than one with higher viscosity. Silicone leather conditioners have much, much higher viscosity than water. Water will absorb much quicker. If water will not absorb through the urethane protectant on treated leather and vinyl in your car, a thick, higher viscosity leather conditioner will not absorb either!

Again, place a drop of water on your leather seat. If it absorbs, go ahead and use all the leather conditioner you want and I will admit I am wrong. If the water drop does not absorb, do nothing more than keep your seats clean with an occasional mild leather cleaner and frequently wipe them down with a damp towel. They will last for years!

 

Hi Kevin,

See posts 26 and 27.

Obviously, using "leather conditioning" products make a lot of folks feel good because they think they are taking better care of their car. As long as you're doing no damage, and if it makes you feel better, keep doing it. The problem is some of these products are damaging to coated "leather" over time, and thus, GM, or any other manufacturer I'm aware of, does not recommend them.

Some folks like the shinier or satiny patina on their "leather" seats. But, it's just polishing the protective coating The leather is getting no additional hydration, and as post #27 explains, it is the OEM coating keeping the moisture in the leather.

I guess if the product one uses strips that coating off eventually, one better use some sort of "conditioner."

 

Hi Foosh, I'm not disputing the protecting coating, I'm disputing the longevity of it. Try this test by lightly rubbing seat with a soft white cloth and then notice at the dye transfer on the white cloth from the seat.
I notice this with my adrenaline red seats however similar result with other colors. IF this leather protectant that GM applies is so good wouldn't it seal the dye in just as it supposedly seals liquards/conditioners out?

My point is that these factory applied leather coating only lasts a few years, even less if you frequently wear abrasive clothing (new jeans for example) so if you plan on keeping your car for many years you have better treat the leather at some point.

And as I stated earlier, this isn't just my hunch, but comes from a guy who has been maintaining and repairing fineleather seating /furnishings in high end hotels, restaurants, retail shops and autos all over the US for over 40 years.

 

I've never noticed any dye transfer in any of my vehicles but never had adrenaline red. I have heard of opposite direction dye transfer (e.g. blue jeans to seats). But, if a soft white cloth does that, just imagine what those leather products are going to do. If anything, that argues more strongly for following the GM guidance and sticking with a slightly damp microfiber towel.

I'm not dissing your "fine leather seating" guy, but that's not what you get in mass produced vehicles and haven't for a long time. Even the so-called "premium" leathers like Nappa/3LT are not "fine leather."

Nonetheless, "folks gonna do what they gonna do."

 

Four years, almost 60,000 miles in my daily driver C7 3LT convertible, top down almost all of the time in the So Cal sunshine. Factory leather coating was like new. All I wear is jeans and shorts. Nothing but water and sometimes a touch of simple green touched the leather.

 

@Robb4092XX,

Excellent input. You've got a lot of information stored in your head. You know the subject matter quite well!👍

One piece of nomanclature that I would change, however.

"The C7 Corvette owner's manual makes it clear that the only way to clean and treat the seats or other "leather" areas is with water and a mild soap - no cleaners or conditioners! This includes dashboard, door inserts, etc. More specifically, the manual states, "Use a soft microfiber cloth dampened with water to remove dust and loose dirt. For a more thorough cleaning, use a soft microfiber cloth dampened with a mild soap solution. Wipe excess moisture from these surfaces after cleaning and allow them to dry naturally. Never use heat, steam, or spot removers. Do not use cleaners that........."

People use the word "soap," when they should use the word "detergent." Soap, contains any number of oils, whereas detergent, doesn’t customarily contain oil. Detergent is; synthetic soap, if you will.....without the oil/s. An oversight on their part, yet nonetheless extremely cogent to point out.

I also notice that rarely anyone here vacuums their surfaces first. If they don’t vacuum, they're just moving around the dirt/dust with the water damp microfiber towel. I rarely don't vacuum all surfaces first, for this reason. However, a very light detergent solution in the damp watered microfiber towel will attract and assist in holding this dirt/dust.

 

Both the owner's manual and link I posted above specifically call out a mild soap and caution not to use a detergent with degreaser. Dawn dishwashing liquid may be OK but I think even that has a degreaser.

 

FWIW, Blue jeans aren't permitted in one large nation health club chain's franchisee in the DFW Area, (Planet Fitness) because of their abrasivity in wearing out the vinyl seating surfaces of the exercise machines, and weight benches. Something to be aware of here in discussion.

 

Well, you've got a point to be aware of what some detergents contain. A neutral Ph detergent may very well not contain the higher Ph degreaser.....

You want a neutral Ph detergent....

 

Dawn is anything but a "mild detergent," it's an industrial strength greater cutter. There is a reason auto detailers use it to strip a vehicle's paint of wax and other crud before starting a paint correction. Mild means something like Ivory Soap.

 

And Dawn is about as mild as they come as far as household detergents go.

 

I will say it again. Hold on for it. Get ready....SIMPLE GREEN! Enough said.

 

Water and micro fiber... even on the suede interior coverings. This is from first hand knowledge on my 21 HTC Natural Dipped.

I was showing off the car for some friends and when I got home I saw 4 black streaks on the B pillar Suede. The shape matches fingers gripping around the B pillar. Just damped a microfiber with water and it all came out... Whew.

 

It's all dependent on the Ph. What is Dawn's Ph?