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please define 'flipping'.
i've heard rumors that GM voids the warranty on vehicles sold within one year
It's folks who are mad that dealers sell over MSRP but see no issue with buying a C8 at MSRP and day one selling for $20,000 over. We have a number on the forum who brag about doing that. IMO even worse than a dealer as they have zero overhead, staff to pay, taxes on their building etc etc. Sure it's a free market and not illegal but IMO not very ethical. BUT that's just me.
As someone noted all GM did (and they can only do a few things, with dealers contracts defining what they can do) is deal with allocations. GM has sent out bulletins telling dealers that are not happy with C8s (and probably other thinks like some Trucks etc) being sold for over MSRP. Reflects poorly on the brand/model.
They have a tool called allocations. Typically the number of C8s (and all other cars and trucks) a dealer can buy when a "place your order window" opens one or more times/month a dealer can only place orders for what they are allocated. If the sold say 12 Vettes the prior year they may only be allowed to but 1/month. BUT GM has said, IF a dealer has NEW (not used) C8s in stock it's an indiscation they are selling for over MSRP and their allocation will be cut to zero. That warranty issue is only for Z06s as noted.
Lots of legal things dealers (and buyers) can do IF GM tries to get too restrictive.
please define 'flipping'.
i've heard rumors that GM voids the warranty on vehicles sold within one year
It's folks who are mad that dealers sell over MSRP but see no issue with buying a C8 at MSRP and day one selling for $20,000 over. We have a number on the forum who brag about doing that. IMO even worse than a dealer as they have zero overhead, staff to pay, taxes on their building etc etc. Sure it's a free market and not illegal but IMO not very ethical. BUT that's just me.
As someone noted all GM did (and they can only do a few things, with dealers contracts defining what they can do) is deal with allocations. GM has sent out bulletins telling dealers that are not happy with C8s (and probably other thinks like some Trucks etc) being sold for over MSRP. Reflects poorly on the brand/model.
They have a tool called allocations. Typically the number of C8s (and all other cars and trucks) a dealer can buy when a "place your order window" opens one or more times/month a dealer can only place orders for what they are allocated. If the sold say 12 Vettes the prior year they may only be allowed to but 1/month. BUT GM has said, IF a dealer has NEW (not used) C8s in stock it's an indiscation they are selling for over MSRP and their allocation will be cut to zero. That warranty issue is only for Z06s as noted.
Lots of legal things dealers (and buyers) can do IF GM tries to get too restrictive.
I would think that if GM wanted to restrict a private purchaser from reselling a car within X timeframe, GM would have to include that as part of the written sales contract - like Ford did with the GT.
It has been reduced to 6 months and ONLY applies to Z06 cars for now.
1 - has GM published this info? Where can i get it?
2 - my allocation number came up and i was working with a salesman to place my order.
i had a couple of questions about our ongoing transactions, and out of curiosity i asked the following... "Lastly, and maybe you guys aren't fond of people 'flipping' their corvettes, but i have to ask... what configurations are most sought after by dealers? seems like a 1 LT. Torch Red Coupe with black interior and little or no options might be the way to go if someone had 'flipping' in mind."
3 - They had initially seemed motivated to get my order in to GM ASAP, but after my comment i haven't heard from them in 12days.
4 - My order was NOT for a "1 LT. Torch Red Coupe with black interior and little or no options"... it was for a 'decked out' HTC.
A flipper is an opportunist and the definition of an opportunist is:
a person who exploits circumstances to gain immediate advantage rather than being guided by consistent principles or plans. See politician
So If used car prices skyrocketed because of the chip shortage, is someone selling their car at the going rate an 'unprincipled opportunist'?
If so, we've got a lot of 'unprincipled opportunists' on the forum here
That is the definition of a car salesman and if they are one and the same, a flipping car salesman, well that would be illegal in most states.
No...It's not illegal...
In the United States, car flipping can be a hobby for car enthusiasts, or a primary business in the form of state licensed car dealers. Flipping cars is legal if the vehicles are titled in the person's name or processed through a state licensed dealership. Many states have laws and regulation limiting the number of vehicles a person can flip within each year unless they are a dealer or associate. This number varies from state to state, from 2 to 10.
Flipping is buying something at MSRP with no intention of medium or long-term ownership, only short-term sale at a premium.
The Rolex, Patek and AP watch markets have numerous models for sale in the after-market at premiums, albeit off their highs. Some make the ~one-year MSRP C8 wait look small.
The dealership I got mine from (at MSRP) told me the tale of a guy that ordered a C8 from them with a sticker of $75K. The day he picked it up he put it on ebay for $95K and sold it in two days. A week later the flipper's dad wanted to order a C8 and the dealership said no, because all he was going to do was flip it. I told him the last thing I'd do is flip my car, as I was buying it to enjoy and drive the snot out of it. I probably (at the time) could have flipped it for +(-) $25K profit. She's still in my garage where she's going to stay.
I doubt anything gm would try to restrict a free market would stand up in court.
It’s funny how everyone calls flippers, and I am one, unethical etc. I wonder when prior models were selling at a 10k discount if they said to the seller no I want to make you whole I want to pay msrp?
Jerry did you always pay msrp or a market price since you’ve had lot of corvettes?
When you folks trade a car in do you take the initial offer or do you gouge the dealer and ask more? If so how dare you! After all if they give you more the new seller has to pay more.
The folks who I sold my cars to, via a dealer friend were thrilled to get the car. No one forced them to buy it.
Why people get their shorts in a wad in a free country when adults make a business deal is way beyond me!
Last edited by Greg00Coupe; Nov 13, 2022 at 08:04 PM.
Jerry did you always pay msrp or a market price since you’ve had lot of corvettes?
Why people get their shorts in a wad in a free country when adults make a business deal is way beyond me!
Big difference in negotiating for my first two Vettes (a 1988 and 1993.) Gave a spreadsheet to the sales manager with the items and part numbers I wanted in one column, MSRP for each in the next, dealer invoice in the third and knowing there are holdbacks reached a purchase price in 5 minutes.
All 6 of my Vettes have been built in BG for exactly what I wanted NOT what some sales manger thought I might like! Bought 3 from Kerbeck at the same discounts they offered for the 200+ new Vettes they typically had in stock (prior to the C8.) My 2017 was bought at what I called "their winter pricing" where they stocked up on new Vettes in the winter when many dealers did not buying Vettes. GM had dealer purchase incentives as they didn't want to layoff folks. Have you every had to lay folks off around Christmas? NOT fun! In this case also expensive with Union contract terms as well as a morale issue. Kerbeck took advantage of those extra discounts and built inventory for Spring AND gave larger discounts for cars in stock or purchased in that period. I got about a 15% discount, no negotiations needed. I call that smart.
Now folks complain (as do I) when a dealer changes $20,000 over MSRP. BUT what are they supposed to do sell at MSRP for the first guy who walks in the door, who with no overhead, payroll to meet, taxes to pay just flips it the day after it arrives. I have far less sympathy for them and don't consider it ethical. If in WWII when there was rationing they'd wind up in jail. That IMO is not selling it's taking advantage of a shortage! Similar to selling bottled water for a high price after a hurricane when there is a shortage.
I don't get my shorts in a wad as I don't about the fellow selling drugs in town! But I don't consider him an outstanding member of the business community with his buying and selling. It's also currently against the law and he rightfully deserves to go to jail!
I have my financial advisor buy and sell stocks for me. I expect him to buy low and sell high to increase the value of my portfolio. Is he a "flipper?" According to some of the responses here he is a flipper. Do any one of you who despise people who flip cars invest in the stock market? It's the same principle.
I sold my C6 when the market went nuts in March 2020 because I saw a chance to get all the money I had paid for it 14 months earlier back plus 1/2 of what I had added in mods. I sold my 2014 MB E350 Cabriolet AMG in July 2020 because I wasn't going to lose as much on resale than I would in a regular market. We sold a house we had lived in for seven years in July 2021 when the real estate market was peaking and made a lot of money on it. I guess I am of the same character in some eyes here as a flipper.
I have my financial advisor buy and sell stocks for me. I expect him to buy low and sell high to increase the value of my portfolio. Is he a "flipper?" According to some of the responses here he is a flipper. Do any one of you who despise people who flip cars invest in the stock market? It's the same principle.
I sold my C6 when the market went nuts in March 2020 because I saw a chance to get all the money I had paid for it 14 months earlier back plus 1/2 of what I had added in mods. I sold my 2014 MB E350 Cabriolet AMG in July 2020 because I wasn't going to lose as much on resale than I would in a regular market. We sold a house we had lived in for seven years in July 2021 when the real estate market was peaking and made a lot of money on it. I guess I am of the same character in some eyes here as a flipper.
You should be a shame Dawg! How dare you be smart enough to take advantage of market conditions! You did stuff apparently the rest of us or the common man is not capable of figuring out! Then they will hammer you cause you outsmarted us commoners!
Again it’s a corvette! Nothing we have to have, we’re all very fortunate to have one.
I know you and I saw the game being playing at Hendrick and made our decision based on their policies, no big deal. You did a great job helping out many of us in the que. thanks for that btw!
To compare flipping a stinking car to war rations is up there with one’s soul!
