HP Tuning on E85
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Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2022
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HP Tuning on E85
If you don't feel like wasting 10 minutes, the car has Eventuri intake, Ligenfelter PTR carbon intake w/throttle body, Paragon headers & Paragon exhaust. No tune, it put down a pitiful 437whp on 91. Tuned for 91 it put down 451. Tuned with 93 it put down 465. E85 tuned put down 500. Kinda......disappointing to be honest. The startling number is the tuned 93 number of 465 with all those bolt ons. That seriously sucks. I'd be expecting that number or better with no tuning at all. What they neglected to get was just the number on 93 with stock tuning, which would've been interesting. Until I see something revolutionary, I think that tuning is a waste of time until you are into a cam and/or headwork.
I'd estimate that to replicate that build you'd be looking at $13,000-$14,000 at retail prices. Um, that's a hard 'no' from me, dawg.
Last edited by combatninja; Jul 19, 2023 at 05:48 PM.
Safety Car
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 4,079
Likes: 2,413
From: Florida
They did not report the 93 numbers they dynod at the last session either. Be nice to see just to see how the variance is since they don't use SAE temp correction but instead Standard on this one and uncertain on the last one.
Regardless it's exactly what we see already in the top 1/4 mile folks.
Those running top bolt on times are trapping 128 to 131mph in great air.
They would be running 123mph-124mph or so absolutely bone stock in great air.
In order to pick up 6- 7mph in trap speed they run
drag packs = 1.5mph
200lb weight loss = 1.5mph
E30 to e85 = 2mph
The bolt ons = 1.5mph-2mph
Not a ton of power from them. Cams is what you'd need for that.
Regardless it's exactly what we see already in the top 1/4 mile folks.
Those running top bolt on times are trapping 128 to 131mph in great air.
They would be running 123mph-124mph or so absolutely bone stock in great air.
In order to pick up 6- 7mph in trap speed they run
drag packs = 1.5mph
200lb weight loss = 1.5mph
E30 to e85 = 2mph
The bolt ons = 1.5mph-2mph
Not a ton of power from them. Cams is what you'd need for that.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2022
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I'm waiting until I see what the tuned results are from cams and headwork. Katech is 'claiming' 565hp, so if the numbers are there I might take the plunge. That 565 crank should be right around that 500whp mark and then if you could have an E85 tune to go with it, you might see 550whp? Maybe? I'll see how it shakes out but the gearing is so miserable in these cars that it almost makes no difference unless the TCU encryption is cracked and we can do something with the gearing.
Safety Car
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 4,079
Likes: 2,413
From: Florida
I'm waiting until I see what the tuned results are from cams and headwork. Katech is 'claiming' 565hp, so if the numbers are there I might take the plunge. That 565 crank should be right around that 500whp mark and then if you could have an E85 tune to go with it, you might see 550whp? Maybe? I'll see how it shakes out but the gearing is so miserable in these cars that it almost makes no difference unless the TCU encryption is cracked and we can do something with the gearing.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2022
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I just don't see it as a worthwhile endeavor to muck around with warranty to gain 50hp that is only going to make gears 1-3 that much harder to manage from a traction perspective and then have it still fall on its face in 4th. It is pretty much down to giving this car +100hp or it really makes no practical difference in the real world.
Dig
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,455
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From: Port Saint Lucie FLORIDA & HONDURAS
I'm waiting until I see what the tuned results are from cams and headwork. Katech is 'claiming' 565hp, so if the numbers are there I might take the plunge. That 565 crank should be right around that 500whp mark and then if you could have an E85 tune to go with it, you might see 550whp? Maybe? I'll see how it shakes out but the gearing is so miserable in these cars that it almost makes no difference unless the TCU encryption is cracked and we can do something with the gearing.
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Le Mans Master
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Yes a, because it voids the warranty. I’ve modified all of my previous 9 Corvettes, but it’s just not worth it on the C8 with the trans failures. I don’t think the failure rate is really as bad as many make it out to be, but even if it’s 1%, that’s still a decent risk as opposed to previous manual transmission cars.
Le Mans Master
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I dunno, 60hp from a tune and some fuel is a pretty good gain... especially considering all these folks claimed the factory maxed out the tune and there was no power to be had. This clearly isn't for anyone that cares about a warranty, I get that... but most of the people who are going to do this dont care about a warranty... if its not for you its not for you but hard to say its not impressive. Also their just getting started on these things... I expect we'll be seeing alot more things as people get them figured out. Once they get the DCT tuning unlocked ittl really change the game.
Safety Car
Joined: Jul 2019
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From: Florida
It should be clarified the tune doesn't give 60hp.
On the same 91 octane fuel it supposedly gave them about 15hp... which I'd take with a grain of salt because you could reset the ECU that had defaulted to safety timing tables due to crap fuel and pick up that same 15hp.
But tuning for e85 is worth around 25hp to 35hp over 93 octane with no tune. It could be worth a ton more over some of the crap west coast 91 but that's irrelevant as that fuel is junk
93 octane and zero tune will get you 22 degrees of timing.
E85 with tune may very well be in the 28 to 32 degree range
That's a solid and real gain of 25 to 30hp
On the same 91 octane fuel it supposedly gave them about 15hp... which I'd take with a grain of salt because you could reset the ECU that had defaulted to safety timing tables due to crap fuel and pick up that same 15hp.
But tuning for e85 is worth around 25hp to 35hp over 93 octane with no tune. It could be worth a ton more over some of the crap west coast 91 but that's irrelevant as that fuel is junk
93 octane and zero tune will get you 22 degrees of timing.
E85 with tune may very well be in the 28 to 32 degree range
That's a solid and real gain of 25 to 30hp
Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 827
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From: Colorado Springs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FeEi...5jZSBjOA%3D%3D
If you don't feel like wasting 10 minutes, the car has Eventuri intake, Ligenfelter PTR carbon intake w/throttle body, Paragon headers & Paragon exhaust. No tune, it put down a pitiful 437whp on 91. Tuned for 91 it put down 451. Tuned with 93 it put down 465. E85 tuned put down 500. Kinda......disappointing to be honest. The startling number is the tuned 93 number of 465 with all those bolt ons. That seriously sucks. I'd be expecting that number or better with no tuning at all. What they neglected to get was just the number on 93 with stock tuning, which would've been interesting. Until I see something revolutionary, I think that tuning is a waste of time until you are into a cam and/or headwork.
I'd estimate that to replicate that build you'd be looking at $13,000-$14,000 at retail prices. Um, that's a hard 'no' from me, dawg.
If you don't feel like wasting 10 minutes, the car has Eventuri intake, Ligenfelter PTR carbon intake w/throttle body, Paragon headers & Paragon exhaust. No tune, it put down a pitiful 437whp on 91. Tuned for 91 it put down 451. Tuned with 93 it put down 465. E85 tuned put down 500. Kinda......disappointing to be honest. The startling number is the tuned 93 number of 465 with all those bolt ons. That seriously sucks. I'd be expecting that number or better with no tuning at all. What they neglected to get was just the number on 93 with stock tuning, which would've been interesting. Until I see something revolutionary, I think that tuning is a waste of time until you are into a cam and/or headwork.
I'd estimate that to replicate that build you'd be looking at $13,000-$14,000 at retail prices. Um, that's a hard 'no' from me, dawg.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2022
Posts: 2,784
Likes: 3,566
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2022
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Likes: 3,566
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2005
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From: Tampa Florida
Let's subtract at least 25 rwhp from the initial bolt-ons going back to bonestock supposedly.......seems like it would be around 90 rwhp total instead of 60. Does that make sense? Head and cam with a tune alone makes between 40 and 70 rwhp from my own experience. So a c8 head and cam with tune would cost a little more than the complete bolt-ons with matching rwhp. I have had head/cam cars. And if you select a right cam, the car could be a beast.
You could save tons of money by DIY. Then all you are left with is tuning if preferable. Just my. 02
You could save tons of money by DIY. Then all you are left with is tuning if preferable. Just my. 02
Last edited by Fore58; Jul 21, 2023 at 08:21 AM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2000
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From: new orleans
HCI 6-gen camaros' with the right combo will put down 680 RWHP with the right combination. It kinda depends on how far you want to go. If you are concerned about the warranty don't do anything that would void it.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 827
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From: Colorado Springs
The prices I quoted absolutely presuppose a DIY install. Those are straight retail prices for the bits before tax or install. The build is the build. I'm not going to sit here and cherry pick the cheapest analogous part available for each and quote some low number. That is what they had on their dyno. Not my build, just reporting the facts.
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Melting Slicks
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At those kind of prices, I'd sooner go with a real NA build. Something like the heads/cam pack that Katech is advertising. Claimed 565hp with a tune for $14,995. That thing might do 600crank with E85? We've all been buying $5,000 exhausts for so long waiting for tuning that we've lost our minds when it comes to pricing for go-fast parts. They got us.
2nd Gear
Joined: Nov 2022
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From: Colorado
Why don't they use a bone stock C8 for the comparison? I couldn't help thinking of the claimed HP increases from each of the vendors selling the expensive individual bolt-ons listed only to get to 437 rwhp on 91 octane.