clemsondave

We have a kid at the track that loves to play games at the lights. I don't like the bs, but it doesn't effect my run. However, I am curious about the rules on the subject.

Almost every time (even time trials), he rushes to pre-stage first. Then lets his competitor pre-stage. He will then sit there forever, rev, etc trying to get the competitor to go ahead and stage. If the competitor does stage, the kid will take his time to stage.

Since the kid pre-stages first, is there a time limit for him to stage? Can the guy in the other lane just wait it out before staging?

Fuzzy Dice

If Autostart is in use then, yes, there is a time limit for him to fully stage...the way it works is you light your pre stage bulbs and then he lights his...then you light your full stage bulbs...at that point three bulbs are lit (two on your side and one on his) which activates the Autostart system...he then has 10 seconds to fully stage or the tree will automatically foul him out with a red light...

If the Autostart system is in use your best bet is to light your top bulbs and as soon as he light his top bulbs you quickly fully stage..this puts him on the clock to get fully staged..your other option is to get into a "burn down" with him...this is when you light your pre stage bulbs and he lights his and then neither of you goes any further... one other trick is to get into a burn down with him for a couple of minutes...then, all of a sudden quickly fully stage so he is now on the clock but caught off guard...

If your track does not use the Autostart system then he can wait as long as the starter allows before fully staging...I just re-read your post and it sounds like Autostart is not in use...you only have two choices then...burn him down by not staging for a good while and then quick stage him or wait till the starter forces both of you to fully stage..good luck..

Randy G.

Games can only be played if the guy in charge lets it happen. If this guy has a history of doing this, get some of the respected racers together and approach the starter and express your concerns. He has the power to flip the switch. One or two red lights with no time on the time slip with bring this guy back to earth.

NHRA's autostart system gives you 7 seconds to stage once any combination of three prestage/stage lights are on. The time slip will say "Auto start ON" if the track has it and it's activated.

If all else fails, get several racers with no concern for their reputations together to go have a friendly "chat" with this guy. Sometimes all it takes is the personal touch.

Glensgages

We had a similar situation to this when I served as Staging Lane Director at an 1/8-mile track in W. Va., years-before Autostart came-along:
we had a guy in an alcohol-injected dragster who refused to stage first, and because he ran alky, his car never heated-up, no-matter how-long you tried to burn him down.

We had a young fellow who operated the tree and maintained the starting-line, and he asked me what to do, because several racers were complaining about having to stage first, and what should he do if somebody decided to wait him out:
we had very-few other cars that were powered by alcohol at the track in the early-'90s.

A few weeks later, the dragster was paired-up with an alky-powered altered, and after doing their burnouts, I realized they were having a full-fledged burn-down (my back was towards the pad ):
the Chief Starter looked-like he didn't know what to-do, and the Track Operator/Announcer was on my headset, yelling at me to get between the cars, and motion them towards the beam, but I had other-ideas.....

I instructed the drivers at the head of the staging-lanes to shut-off their cars, then from behind, I walked between the cars that were sitting with the Pre-Stage bulbs lit to where our starter stood, holding the trigger/switch box:
we had several industrial-grade 5-gallon pails, containing clean-up supplies & brooms, so I took a broom and walked half-way to the Christmas Tree, and 'swept-off' a portion of the asphalt, far-enough ahead of each driver, so they could see what I was doing.....

next, I picked-up a pail that had several White towels, walked to the cleaned-off asphalt, set the bucket upside-down, and placed a White cloth over the bottom off the bucket, like a table-cloth in a fine Italian restaurant, in a very animated-fashion:
I then 'walked' the Starter to the bucket, placed my hands on his shoulder and 'sat' him down on the bucket, placing the trigger/switch box on the ground between his feet
(the Track Operator/Announcer was screaming in my ear the entire time, saying "WTF are you DOING?" , so I eventually took-off the head-set, and left it around my neck ).

I then walked to a cooler he had, filled with bottles of Gatorade, and brought him a bottle, setting it on the ground next to the trigger/switch box:
I leaned-forward to our Starter, pointed my finger in his face, smiled, and said over the idling race-cars

"WE run the starting-line, not the racers!!!!!

You just sit-here with your arms folded across your chest until both of these guys stage..... when they do, I want you to count to 10, very-slowly, then stand-up, tunr-around, fold-up the White cloth, put it in the bucket, and return the bucket to it's place, leaving the trigger/switch box on the ground.

Then, casually walk-forward and pick-up the trigger/switch box, and casually walk-back to your usually position where the drivers can't see you:
when, and only-when, YOU are ready, fire the tree, OK?"

He winked, smiled and replied, "OK!"

We shook hands, then I returned to my work-position, and after another minute of playing-around, both cars staged, then the Chief Starter decided when the race began:
we never had problems again that season.


If Autostart isn't engaged, it is the Chief Starter's responsibility to determine what-is, and what-isn't, enough time to properly stage.

clemsondave

Ah the stories. Sounds like fun!

I am aware of the Autostart system. But, if three bulbs are not lit, there is no timer? In other words, can both cars sit indefinately at pre-stage? ....or until the starter gets p!ssed?

He wants to pre-stage first and have his competitor pre-stage and stage before he stages.

I am in my own world so games dont seam to effect me, but he certainly gets others frustrated.

Glensgages

If you watch the National Events on TV, sometimes Rick Stewart will just let 'em go, and other-times, he'll animatedly motion them to get into the Stage-beams:
ultimately, it is HIS decision.

jpee

If I were racing him & I was in my Vette... I would light the Top bulb.. then he'd light his top bulb.. and he would WAIT until I fully staged.. well I'd just shut OFF my car and wait until he FULLY staged then start mine and go right in.. I might lose the race.. but it would be fun to see how long he would sit there with both of us PRE STAGED.. he would NEVER know I shut off my car because of the noise his car was making... I could sit there for 20 min.. with my engine OFF,. and once he fully staged I know I could start my car and get it in in less than 10 sec !!

Glensgages

I had an opponent who never Staged first, and liked to hang people out-to-dry..... my ex and crew-member/buddy said he liked to look-over at me, deep-staged and leanin' on the converter, focusing at the Tree, while he tried burnin' me down, and chuckle to himself:
I began giving him the one-finger-salute with my Right-hand after I got-in deep, and my ex caught it on-video.....

Fuzzy Dice

That is correct...it takes three bulbs for the autostart to activate the 10 second timer..btw, it is 7 seconds for Super Pro and 10 seconds for the Sportsman class...I just assumed you are in Sportsman...everyone here is right...it is ultimately the starters job to take action if he won't go in...I like the shut the car off idea...

stampede3

I don't like games and fortunatly we don't have anyone here (Regulars) that play games but if it happened to me I'd go in.

I always courtesy stage but in this case,
He pre, I pre, if I look over and he isn't even inching up to stage I'm going in.
I run a certain fuel load,down here it is hot as hell sitting in a black fire suit and if I'm over 120deg (Little bitty radiator) off the light it probably won't run the number so it is not in my favor to play games.

If he starts to play games I forget about courtesy and stage and hope autostart catches him at his own game.

REDC4CORVETTE

NHRA rules if the car stalls on the burn out or the engine shuts off you are done.
I was told I was burning down the other racer last night.Sorry if that is the way you saw it.The racer in front of me which I always seem to end up behind in Summit Pro every month first round flows about 2 gallons of water on the track every time he launches.It is amazing how no one watches,I said you wanted me to run over the starter or what?
I guess you did not see the starter mopping up the water.
Last 4 months it has been the same thing.The one thing no one has figured out is, I run a corvette and it always overheats but I fake it good and just run past the et booth and pick up my slip later.
The thing about my car is, I am the only one that knows how fast it goes and I call on the extra power by bagging when these type of things happen.If you know you have to race another driver that,who likes to play games, I would dial the same as him and put him out every time