BoostManiac

Anyone that has seen how the ACR has mopped the floor with basically every car out there on the road course due to that downforce should understand the obvious benefit (obviously at the cost of top speed bragging rights, which are very important at your local Starbucks). The Z06, no slouch, wasn't even a threat on the road course.

Top speed discussions among people that drive their sports cars to work only are basically "length" measuring contests.

Racer

I'm sorry did anyboy say anything about street racing?

Slowgoin

Soft running surface that day, wind. Many reasons why that could have happened. But It will go faster than 165, if you don't think so, you are not at all into cars and the vette your driving around is the first for you.

Racer

Always drive the posted speed limit George? You better, if not your a hypocrite.

32valves

while the ACRs top end is knocked down quite abit by the aero bits as opposed to the regular viper you guys also have to remember that there is considerable elevation at the salt flats which is why cars never achieve their true top speed there.

vetteship

nuf said

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WqQ-bSr8hg

vetteship

Oops, posted previously

wickedness

08 Viper coupe has a 200plus mph top speed.

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=122304

While the ACR spanks the rest on the road course.

Viper SS

You need to consider Bonneville is at a really high elavation....Like 5000ft. I am sure it really chokes a NA engine at that altitude. I bet a 1990 Zr1 would be hard pressed to hit 160.

1320jon

LOL, it appears no one has been to the salt. Besides the elevation, tire spin on salt is also an issue.

At the the 0-200-0 contest in northern nv the first year(close to bonniville but on pavement) no one could actually even get to 200. The supercharged viper managed 181......and was the fastest. That was a standing mile though, admittedly, but hopefully you ll get the point.

On the salt, you need just enough down force to get traction.

bb62

I don't agree. The ZR-1 was hardly stressed in its long distance record running at 5500RPM (ilo peak power at 6000). Second, there was a 1983 308 Ferrari with 300HP (240RWHP at sea level) that ran 170 mph. The 1990+ ZR-1s had much better aerodynamics than the 308 with a 30+% boost in power.

Sure the Virer is a fast car, and would have gone significantly faster if not for the wing, but still, for 600HP is fairly slow - for Bonneville.

scottycards

I'd recommend you don't place that bet. I followed a 90's ZR-1 down Highway 93A from Wendover to where the road meets Highway 50 at the Bonneville 100 Open Road Race earlier this year.

Many miles over 165 mph.

I'm a bit surprised at the low ACR number, but traction is an issue on the flats, and that wing creates a huge amount of drag. Lose the wing, and pick up a bunch of speed.

1320jon is right. You need just enough downforce to get traction.

NytmereZ

That is very simple, until last year, I only owned corvettes, this is my 1st Viper. Even though I'm only 33 years old, on this forum, I'm a dinosaur(old timer) Ive been here since just about the very beginning, so as far as car forums this is pretty much my home. Now as far as both Viper forums, I am on them but dont post, the VCA are a bunch of pompous ***'s, and the Alley, bunch of little men with serious little man complex, I would love to strangle some of the people on there, they are all "Internet tough guys". I don't even want to waste my time posting on those boards, but what I do see here, is very similar behavior, people make statements about a car they don't even know etc... you can always tell a non owner, they are the most critical., I hope Ive answered your questions. I enjoy all fast cars. Funny thing is, its a beautiful day in Chicago today, I spent the whole day having fun in a nice 07 C6Z instead of my Viper, I have access to quite a variety of cars, have allot of seat time in pretty much all the sports cars discussed on this site, with the exception of the Ford GT. It just gets to me when people here start acting like the people on the Viper boards, speaking of boards, every time I hop into the 07 Z I have access to, I almost put my foot through the floorboard when pushing in the clutch, being so used to the Vipers clutch. Then when driving the Viper after the Z, it feels like I'm doing weighed leg presses when clutching. I just appreciate all fast cars, but I do give my honest opinion, and that throws people off. I dont give reviews on the other cars Ive driven, because I dont want to come off as a know it all, cause honestly I dont, but I do know Corvettes and now Vipers.(havent had my hands on an 08 STR yet)

NytmereZ

I totally agree, and I'm sorry to ZR1 fans and owners, the Z06 is MUCH better looking, the ZR1's panels are butt ugly. As far as ride, I have driven both C6Z06 and C6coupe with mag suspension, there really isn't much difference in the riding comfort, handling huge difference, hitting bumps little, but comfort zero. Cabon room and seats are all the same, so I don't see the comfort factor, being an issue. There is a brand new Yellow Z at a local dealership, they are asking only 66k. Making the ZR1's case very weak.

ZeeOSix

True ... but there is also less aero drag due to the thinner air. But overall, any NA vehicle will go slower on the top end due to the altitude, even when factoring in the reduced aero drag.

Also, on the salt there will always be some wheels spin at top speed due to traction issues. All these factors will hurt the top end. Put the Viper on the same oval track where the ZR1 went 205, and I'm sure it would do much better than it did on the salt.

The supercharged ZR1 would probably due better on the salt since the supercharger would enhance the power even at 5000 ft. But if you put the ZR1 on the salt I guarantee it will do much less than the 205 it did on the paved test track.

Kzof

Ive never driven on the salt but wouldnt there be alot more rolling resistance than on pavement?

03QuicksilverZ06

Hey ZeeOSix, I always enjoy your posts, always informative and backed by scientific fact< >

A guy that shot some photos had this to say

" ZR1 topped out at 194 or 184(sorry about my memory, didn't plan on posting a report) on the long course.
"

Bronzevette85

With all the discussions about downforce. I was wondering of how much dowforce does the new ZR1 makes at 100 MPH or greater?

Verrückt

Probably very little, if any. It may make lift (but less so) than the Z06.

Jaxian

Some of these threads are truely silly as hell. Cast your minds back to the magazine shootout almost 20 years ago between Tim Richmonds 3500lb, 650hp Folger's NASCAR Monte vs a Porsche 962 that clocked in at the same horsepower and was almost 1000lb's lighter. It was the Al Holbert Lowenbrau car if I recall correctly so no slouches on either side.

The expected, 'I know nothing of physics' people figured the Porsche would win easily. It didn't. It got it's *** handed to it. Why? Because the very same things that made the 962 the most brutal road race car of its time killed its top speed. Even with the longtail on it. Top speed has nothing to do with weight or power/weight ratios, its all about the slippery. Tim Richmonds big ugly monte was one slippery brick hitting 240mph.

Could it outhandle the Porsche? Please, not in it's dreams. Could it out accelerate the Porsche, again, no chance. My guess would be that at their respective top speeds the Porsche probably felt a lot more glued to the road because of all that downforce too.

This is simple physics, you don't get something for nothing. With advanced underbody air management being very difficult for street cars with real world ground clearance issues to deal with, if you want more downforce to increase you car's handling in the sub 150mph territory you are going to have to put something on it that the wind can press down against. That will cause you to get better traction...and also go slower at higher speeds. This isn't magic, it's just plain physics. Take that same Viper that ran 165mph or whatever it did and unbolt the wing and canards and zero the front splitter and I bet it pickus up 25mph. I bet it's also not nearly as stable as it was. It's all about tradeoffs.

I can't belive people are actually having a discussion about this. It like discussing whether water is wet or the sun is hot. Just silly as hell.

P.S. On an interesting side note for those who do get the whole point of drag vs downforce. Modern F1 cars had underbody aero aids restricted to the point of being near non existant. To get their downforce back they had to jack up the wings for downforce. (all efforts to slow the cars down by the FIA btw). A modern sports car with good brakes will stop at 1.25 to 1.5g on a full to the floor panic stop. An F1 car will stop from it's top speed at 1.5gs IF YOU JUST LIFT OFF THE ACCELERATOR! No brakes being applied at all. That should be an extreme enough case to illustrate my point.

Nobody who has passed high school physics should have expected anything different from what happened. That simple.