alski444

I had my rear trailing arms rebuilt with new brake shoes and hardware by a professional shop..I thought that the primary brake shoes (short lining) should be facing forward.And the star wheel should be on the secondary shoe (pictures enclosed).Is it different for the rear brakes,does it make a difference?Any info would be appreciated and helpful.Thanks,Alan

Frankie the Fink

This is my '63 left rear brake after I did the rebuild - about 13,000 miles since the photo - no issues....so judge for yourself.
Then a picture from the Service Manual.
Front vs Rear doesn't matter..

A professional shop huh ?
I see you're in Bradenton, FL; I hope this wasn't Van Steel out of Tampa..

After this I would confirm all hardware is attached correctly and that the self adjusters are correct for each side (they are NOT reversible); most will have an L or R on the bottom of the threaded shaft indicating Left or Right application.

alski444

Thanks for the correct info,I am going to correct it and no,not from Tampa,but from WI.Thanks again,Alan

63 340HP

The forward shoe, should always be the short lining shoe with one top mount stud & wheel cylinder.

The rear shoe is "self energizing" from friction forcing it into the top mount stud & wheel cylinder under the braking torque on a forward stop. The rear shoe needs more lining surface area to counter the additional force, the combined forces applied by the leading wheel cylinder and the opposing friction.

Brakes will work if the shoes are backwards, but not as well and the short lining shoe will wear out faster.

Nice photos.



I edited to correct terminology.

Frankie the Fink

There can be more serious consequences than just premature material wear - but - you get the idea...

Critter1

You may be surprised at how many experienced mechanics don't understand how the self adjuster works. Or why one shoe return spring is supposed to have more tension than the other.

And also surprising that someone installed the shoes incorrectly on the OP's unit. If the shoes are installed incorrectly, I have to wonder if the spindle bearing setup is correct.

wmf62

just curious... what would happen if you use 2 long shoes?
Bill

63 340HP

Not much better braking, and a rear shoe that wears faster than the front shoe.

There are dual leading shoe brake designs that have two leading stop pins and two wheel cylinders. They were popular on truck front axles to add extra stopping power. They used equal length shoe linings.

The was also a patent approved in the early 1990's for a dual leading shoe design that used one wheel cylinder, a wheel cylinder with two different bore diameters to balance the brake force on the two equal friction lining length shoes and rival disc's for performance. Disc brake systems proved cheaper in mass production.

alski444

Hopefully they just don't know brakes and thanks for the info.alan

Frankie the Fink

No kidding... And try to make one understand how they don't overadjust and burn up your brakes, my favorite treatise on the topic:

GTOguy

A lot of mechanics in the industry today weren't even born when brakes like these and other items like carburetors were still on cars. I've worked with some of them...they are as confused by a Rochester carburetor or a set of self-energizing drums as I was with electronic fuel injection 35 years ago. The OP's photo shows it: excellent attention to detail and a clean job, but the tech put the shoes on backwards....which would have flunked you out of auto shop in high school. Probably never even driven a car with drums. Such is progress.....

Frankie the Fink

At least the OP was wise enough to post the question here and not blindly accept that some 'professional shop' did things correctly. I've seen too much of that...with engine overhauls, carb rebuilds and body work... Too many of thee outfits have the journeymen do the critical work and the minimum-wage kid just starting out 'close up the patient' without going behind them for QA purposes and, hence, the resulting screw ups....

GTOguy

No kidding. Back in the early '80's, I was the engine diagnostic guy at a large shop with 14 techs. My job was to diagnose the tune up issue, and the 'gofer' would install the needed parts, as my time was deemed 'too valuable' to be spent doing the parts changing. This was a management decision, increased profits being their objective. That lasted about 2 months. Cars were coming back with crossed ignition wires, cracked spark plugs, loose distributors, and guess who had to fix them? Not the gofer! Sometimes old age and experience do count!

Frankie the Fink

Ha! Never time to do it right; always time to do it over....
That was the saying in the aircraft industry (a joke of course)....

63 340HP

Quality and attention to detail.

Some of the General Foreman loved watching me close out a project with a new Foreman. My position is that the last guy walking the job before turn over owns it. I would call out bad workmanship, from little issues like random screws on the floor, to more serious concerns like unsecured seismic restraint. The new Foreman's protests of concern over the labor budget and cost to do the work correctly would start. I would have to remind the Foreman that he was paid by the hour and I was paid by the remaining profit. It is my decision to cut corners, not his, and the resulting cut in profit and pay was my burden, not his. I enjoyed loyal thirty year customers. Some of the more prickly Foreman enjoyed a new employer every year. Some people never learn values, and value added economic success.

wmf62

unfortunately, not always a 'joke' in other industries/endeavors....
Bill

Critter1

That's a good explanation of how the adjusters work.

There's still one more item that hasn't been discussed.

The return springs that hold the shoes against the upper anchor pin. One spring is stronger by design. (even though the primary and secondary springs are different lengths for 63 and later)

Those two springs for non self adjusting 53-62 brakes look identical but are definitely different tension and different part numbers and can easily be mixed up primary/secondary if the original spring color is gone.

That means one shoe moves off the anchor pin before the other.

Can anyone explain why this is designed this way?