Dead transmission
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,550
Likes: 652
From: Richmond VA
Dead transmission
I have a 327 300HP with a 3.08 rear and Muncie Transmission, I beleive it's a M20 2.56:1 first, 1.91:1 second and 1.48: third. I calucuate the ratios by checking speed at 2000 RPMs, I got 20 in first 27 in second 34in third and 51 in forth with P215/70R15 tires.
The car is great on the hi-way with the 3.08 rear but it's hard to turn the tires off the line. I like to drive the back roads in the mountains and starting out on a hill with these gears is rough on a cluch.
First off I really don't want to change the rear ratio because I like it for highway driving and I get over 20MPH. I am also resisting purchasing a 5speed because of the cost.
So with all that said, what other options do I have that will liven her up and not break the bank? Are there gear sets available for my transmission? What ratios would you suggest?
The car is great on the hi-way with the 3.08 rear but it's hard to turn the tires off the line. I like to drive the back roads in the mountains and starting out on a hill with these gears is rough on a cluch.
First off I really don't want to change the rear ratio because I like it for highway driving and I get over 20MPH. I am also resisting purchasing a 5speed because of the cost.
So with all that said, what other options do I have that will liven her up and not break the bank? Are there gear sets available for my transmission? What ratios would you suggest?
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 26,118
Likes: 1,874
From: Greenville, Indiana
Since you mentioned you like the 20 mph(mpg?), I assume you like to save money on gas. The cost of any gear change you could possibly make would wipe out any savings in gas for the next 100 years on a week-end driver.
Deal with it. Lot's of cars the same vintage as yours came factory equipped with the same gear combination.
Now if money is not a consideration, you have a lot of options. A cheap way out is to use a Saginaw four speed out of a Vega. Lot lower first gear and dirt cheap but they won't take a lot of abuse. Or, get a five speed Tremac for $$$$$$$. I wouldn't change the gears in the transmission in the car. It has core value just the way it is.
Deal with it. Lot's of cars the same vintage as yours came factory equipped with the same gear combination.
Now if money is not a consideration, you have a lot of options. A cheap way out is to use a Saginaw four speed out of a Vega. Lot lower first gear and dirt cheap but they won't take a lot of abuse. Or, get a five speed Tremac for $$$$$$$. I wouldn't change the gears in the transmission in the car. It has core value just the way it is.
Last edited by MikeM; Oct 3, 2009 at 08:21 AM.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 58,061
Likes: 7,146
Army
I have a Borg-Warner T-10 in the '61 and a 3.70 gear and its sort of 'the worst of both worlds'. I can't smoke tires much off the line and have to baby the car away from up-hill stoplights AND the RPMs are annoyingly high at interstate speeds. As Mike says I'm living with it for now but I'm looking hard at 5-speeds. Point is...I think you would have to bump your rear end pretty high to get the bottom end where you want it and then you can kiss the 20MPG good bye.
Drifting
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,973
Likes: 5
From: Valrico Florida
A complete second rear with the ratio you like might be the cheapest swap you could make and not that difficult to do. Just save the original for reinstallation later. Of course your mileage is out the window.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,550
Likes: 652
From: Richmond VA
What ratio first and second gear do you have in the Borg Warner T10? I checked out a web site on them and they have a wide range of choices from a first gear of 2.23:1 to 3.44:1. Will the T10 fit my car without any mods? I would think a 3.44:1 first gear would make a big difference that's almost 1 point over what I have. As long as 4th remains 1:1 I wouldn't think I would see any affect to hi-way mileage.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 7,246
Likes: 21
From: Going too fast over the hill. Iowa
I have a 327 300HP with a 3.08 rear and Muncie Transmission, I beleive it's a M20 2.56:1 first, 1.91:1 second and 1.48: third. I calucuate the ratios by checking speed at 2000 RPMs, I got 20 in first 27 in second 34in third and 51 in forth with P215/70R15 tires.
The car is great on the hi-way with the 3.08 rear but it's hard to turn the tires off the line. I like to drive the back roads in the mountains and starting out on a hill with these gears is rough on a cluch.
First off I really don't want to change the rear ratio because I like it for highway driving and I get over 20MPH. I am also resisting purchasing a 5speed because of the cost.
So with all that said, what other options do I have that will liven her up and not break the bank? Are there gear sets available for my transmission? What ratios would you suggest?
The car is great on the hi-way with the 3.08 rear but it's hard to turn the tires off the line. I like to drive the back roads in the mountains and starting out on a hill with these gears is rough on a cluch.
First off I really don't want to change the rear ratio because I like it for highway driving and I get over 20MPH. I am also resisting purchasing a 5speed because of the cost.
So with all that said, what other options do I have that will liven her up and not break the bank? Are there gear sets available for my transmission? What ratios would you suggest?
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Team Owner
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 29,065
Likes: 1,839
From: cookeville tennessee
I have a 3.08:1 dif in my 66, and my Muncie definitely has a 2.5 low gear. I have an 11 inch clutch in the car and have no trouble starting out on inclines, even in the Rocky Mountains. If you are sure your Muncie has a 2.5:1 low gear, my only question is how old is the engine rebuild? You may not have enough low end torque to handle uphill starts. A 300hp engine does not come with a cam that pushes the torque curve up the rpm range.
Dont touch it are look at this set up. And doing a bigger cam and head work.
Pro
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 622
Likes: 24
From: Clermont Florida
The 2nd design T10s used in the late 70s early 80s corvettes were available with a first gear around 3.04-3.09, with a 1-1 fourth gear. Other than a different clutch disk and driveshaft yoke, they fall right in, though speedo cable positioning may change on 64 and earlier cars.
Team Owner
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 38,897
Likes: 1,926
From: Washington Michigan
As I recall, the Corvette wide-ratio Super T-10's (and the short-lived Muncie-built copy) had a 2.64:1 1st gear from '75-'77, and it changed to 2.88:1 from '78-'81. Aftermarket Super T-10's, however, were available with three different gearsets.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,550
Likes: 652
From: Richmond VA
I can buy an M22 with 2.99 Auto Gear first gears. This transmission would be built by Ed Hartnett in Lansdown Pa. The cost would be
$1550. Does this sound like a good ratio and price?
$1550. Does this sound like a good ratio and price?
Race Director
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 17,901
Likes: 751
From: Inverness FL
St. Jude Donor '07
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,073
Likes: 414
From: Maine
Can you change 4th gear?
Race Director
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 17,901
Likes: 751
From: Inverness FL
St. Jude Donor '07
there are new gear sets available to do this on a Muncie nowadays; BUT they're not cheap.
Bill
Race Director
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,984
Likes: 185
From: CT
If he is using all new parts - case included. You can buy from Autogear also. autogear.net
Heel & Toe
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 21
Likes: 0
From: Belmont Ca
M-22
Auto Gear has a new M-22 with a lower (2.9) first gear. Hope this works for u and am thinking of changing my m-20 for this. I've been warned about the "whine". Describe it more in detail with those that have a M-22.
Thanks!!!!
Gary
Thanks!!!!
Gary
Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,837
Likes: 498
From: Florida
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gA6T1eVOiT0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJb67ljCkws
Last edited by 6T7L71CPE; Oct 8, 2009 at 07:02 AM.