Another starter problem
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2016
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From: McMinnville Oregon
Another starter problem
It's the starter on my 'Hemi/Vette' but shouldn't be unique.
Turn the starter on and I can't shut it off. Turn the ignition switch to all positions, it still turns.
So, I pulled the starter and had it rebuilt, same problem. I put in a new solenoid, same problem. I have to pull the cable off the battery to stop the silly thing.
I replaced the ignition, key lock as sometimes I had to jiggle the key to turn it. The switch itself felt good and crisp for each turn/position.
I guess the ignition switch is the next thing in line??? Has anyone had an issue with the ignition switch?????
Ok then where would you find one? I'm in Oregon if that makes any difference.
Turn the starter on and I can't shut it off. Turn the ignition switch to all positions, it still turns.
So, I pulled the starter and had it rebuilt, same problem. I put in a new solenoid, same problem. I have to pull the cable off the battery to stop the silly thing.
I replaced the ignition, key lock as sometimes I had to jiggle the key to turn it. The switch itself felt good and crisp for each turn/position.
I guess the ignition switch is the next thing in line??? Has anyone had an issue with the ignition switch?????
Ok then where would you find one? I'm in Oregon if that makes any difference.
Race Director
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If disconnecting the cable makes it stop, and it does not turn on again when you reconnect the cable, it isn't the switch.
it sounds liek you ahve latching relay in there somewhere, or you are getting feedback from 'something" that was energized once the switch was turned on. Maybe your solenoid wiring to the solenoid is incorrect?
Did this magically start happening, or did you do "something" to the car prior to the problem?
Doug
it sounds liek you ahve latching relay in there somewhere, or you are getting feedback from 'something" that was energized once the switch was turned on. Maybe your solenoid wiring to the solenoid is incorrect?
Did this magically start happening, or did you do "something" to the car prior to the problem?
Doug
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2016
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From: McMinnville Oregon
Doug
No it started out of the blue. The weird thing and maybe this is a Chrysler thing, is there are two solenoids. One piggyback on the starter, typical Chevy and another on the frame close by. I'm on the BangShift forum asking about it as there are some Chrysler guys there.
Two possibility's on the solenoid. Something Chysler did with the big block starters back in the old days (engine is a 57) or a light weight starter for drag racing that needs some more umph. Or it could be a small starter to fit in the tight confines of the Chevy chassis.
No it started out of the blue. The weird thing and maybe this is a Chrysler thing, is there are two solenoids. One piggyback on the starter, typical Chevy and another on the frame close by. I'm on the BangShift forum asking about it as there are some Chrysler guys there.
Two possibility's on the solenoid. Something Chysler did with the big block starters back in the old days (engine is a 57) or a light weight starter for drag racing that needs some more umph. Or it could be a small starter to fit in the tight confines of the Chevy chassis.
Le Mans Master
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Doug
No it started out of the blue. The weird thing and maybe this is a Chrysler thing, is there are two solenoids. One piggyback on the starter, typical Chevy and another on the frame close by. I'm on the BangShift forum asking about it as there are some Chrysler guys there.
Two possibility's on the solenoid. Something Chysler did with the big block starters back in the old days (engine is a 57) or a light weight starter for drag racing that needs some more umph. Or it could be a small starter to fit in the tight confines of the Chevy chassis.
No it started out of the blue. The weird thing and maybe this is a Chrysler thing, is there are two solenoids. One piggyback on the starter, typical Chevy and another on the frame close by. I'm on the BangShift forum asking about it as there are some Chrysler guys there.
Two possibility's on the solenoid. Something Chysler did with the big block starters back in the old days (engine is a 57) or a light weight starter for drag racing that needs some more umph. Or it could be a small starter to fit in the tight confines of the Chevy chassis.
Dan
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2005
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From: Fort Wayne IN
On my '66 I had a problem where the starter would occasionally keep running after the key was released. resulting in a nasty grinding noise. Replaced the ignition assembly (not the part with the key - I kept that) and all is well. The vendor was either Corvette Central or Corvette America 
Regards,
Greg
Regards,
Greg
Last edited by Tigershark3; Aug 7, 2019 at 09:14 PM.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2016
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From: McMinnville Oregon
Thanks, I like the idea to remove the battery heavy wire from the starter and chase the wires with a test light or voltmeter.
I know this old Vette just needs someone to give her some attention after sitting for so many years. My old Porsche and Mini have been gettin all the driving attention.
I know this old Vette just needs someone to give her some attention after sitting for so many years. My old Porsche and Mini have been gettin all the driving attention.
Le Mans Master
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Dan
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Also, be advised that a lot of times, checking the resistance of a wire with an ohm meter will give a passing result on a bad wire that carries a lot of current. This is due to only a few strands of wire out of many that are still good enough to give a low resistance reading, but many of the strands have high resistance and cannot carry an actual load (like a starter draw). Very common on battery cables and other heavy wires that flow a lot of current. A voltage drop test is the one to use to verify that the wire can carry the load effectively.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2016
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From: McMinnville Oregon
Ok I sat under the car and made a wiring diagram as I pulled wires. Then checked each terminal to ground. Still not sure I understand the reason for the Chrysler/Ford using another relay in the circuit.. After that then what is causing the starter to continue running with the switch in the run position.
The ignition switch looked ok and the connector looked good but I still think if the switch is not returning to the run position, that could be my issue. The 65 switch is about $55 so more troubleshooting before I jump for that.
The ignition switch looked ok and the connector looked good but I still think if the switch is not returning to the run position, that could be my issue. The 65 switch is about $55 so more troubleshooting before I jump for that.
Team Owner
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I have had this problem occur when the starter gear had insufficient clearance when it meshed with the flywheel gear. A starter shim fixed the problem. Have you checked that?
Le Mans Master
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Problem helping this Gent is that he has a Chrysler Hemi in a Corvette, I think, and none of us have any idea how it is wired or with what.
To the OP: A GM starter heavy wire is switched at the starter, Autolite starters used on Ford & Mopars, including Mopar's 1962 introduced gear reduction starter use a relay mounted on a inner fender apron activated by the ignition switch. How about a few photos?
Dan
To the OP: A GM starter heavy wire is switched at the starter, Autolite starters used on Ford & Mopars, including Mopar's 1962 introduced gear reduction starter use a relay mounted on a inner fender apron activated by the ignition switch. How about a few photos?
Dan
Le Mans Master
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Problem helping this Gent is that he has a Chrysler Hemi in a Corvette, I think, and none of us have any idea how it is wired or with what.
To the OP: A GM starter heavy wire is switched at the starter, Autolite starters used on Ford & Mopars, including Mopar's 1962 introduced gear reduction starter use a relay mounted on a inner fender apron activated by the ignition switch. How about a few photos?
Dan
To the OP: A GM starter heavy wire is switched at the starter, Autolite starters used on Ford & Mopars, including Mopar's 1962 introduced gear reduction starter use a relay mounted on a inner fender apron activated by the ignition switch. How about a few photos?
Dan
Live well,
SJW
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Yup. That Autolite starter's gotta have a relay somewhere in series with the battery cable. That amount of current's not being switched directly by the ignition switch. It sounds as though the relay is sticking closed. Possibly has arc-welded its contacts together internally.
Live well,
SJW
Live well,
SJW
Doug
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2016
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From: McMinnville Oregon
Ok pics worth a thousand words. Top pic is the starter solenoid. Top brass contact brings in the heavy wire straight from the Batt. Also takes a red, can't be seen, wire to the coil, and a third wire comes out to the right contact on the relay, that's the wire pointing right.
Also top pic, the wire on the silver terminal comes down to the left brass terminal on the relay, pointing left.
On the relay the left small wire goes to ground and the right one, I'm pretty sure goes to the ignition switch.
So today I'm going to play with the Ignition switch and see if by chance it is sticking in the start position and not releasing back to the run position.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
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From: McMinnville Oregon
Oh also, the starter/solenoid have been rebuilt but I've had 3-4 times I couldn't turn it off and it ran until I could pull the Batt wire, it got hot.
The relay, or whatever it's called in brand new and only experienced one instance where the starter continued to run.
The relay, or whatever it's called in brand new and only experienced one instance where the starter continued to run.
Le Mans Master
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Well, its enough to demonstrate roughly what the dude did. Now you need to identify each conductor from your ignition switch in terms of to what each are now connected. The harness is likely butchered up where they adapted the Autolite starter to the GM wiring. If this mess worked once before the trouble is likely in the wiring. What is this a 66? use a 66shop manual wiring diagram to help you understand the adaptation the PO made.
A clue: The trouble is between those wires connected to the two small posts on the relay and wherever they go....
Dan
A clue: The trouble is between those wires connected to the two small posts on the relay and wherever they go....
Dan
Last edited by dplotkin; Aug 9, 2019 at 09:26 PM.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
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From: McMinnville Oregon
It's a 65 chassis and I have the 63-65 shop manual. Today I'm getting my 1993 Mini Cooper manual and my 1972 Porsche 911 shop manuals to compare the typical starter wiring. The Chevy manual shows the two heavy connectors. One from the batt and one going into the starter. Then two more small connectors where this starter/solenoid only has one small connector. Curious!!
Le Mans Master
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93 Mini Cooper manual? Let me loan you my 77 Tatra manual. You read Yugoslavian?
Dan
Dan