CE Block ???
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2004
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Likes: 105
From: State of Confusion!!!
2018 C2 of Year Winner
CE Block ???
What kind of $$$ difference can I expect to pay for a car that has a CE replacement block, instead of the original?
Here is the deal, I am looking at a '70 LT-1, but it has a CE block. There is no paperwork from the warranty, and really not much paperwork at all. This is an original LT-1, but having a replacement block, how does affect the current price as well as the future market value??
I know these cars are out there, just finding a good one is becoming difficult!!!!!
Here is the deal, I am looking at a '70 LT-1, but it has a CE block. There is no paperwork from the warranty, and really not much paperwork at all. This is an original LT-1, but having a replacement block, how does affect the current price as well as the future market value??
I know these cars are out there, just finding a good one is becoming difficult!!!!!
Just another Corvette guy
Joined: Feb 1999
Posts: 8,518
Likes: 3,865
From: Palm Springs, CA.
Hey Chuck,
What kind of documentation comes with the car to show it was an original LT-1 car? If you have, say the tank sticker, the CE will lower the price a bit but not kill it, It's still a true LT-1 car and there were only about 1,200 of them in '70. If there is nothing to show it was ever a true LT-1 car, except the story that goes with it, most buyers may look at the car as just another NOM Vette.
Either way, the actual amount of $$$ it will drop with the CE block is academic. In other words, it will make a lot of difference to some buyers while it may not make any difference to others.
Best,
Greg
What kind of documentation comes with the car to show it was an original LT-1 car? If you have, say the tank sticker, the CE will lower the price a bit but not kill it, It's still a true LT-1 car and there were only about 1,200 of them in '70. If there is nothing to show it was ever a true LT-1 car, except the story that goes with it, most buyers may look at the car as just another NOM Vette.
Either way, the actual amount of $$$ it will drop with the CE block is academic. In other words, it will make a lot of difference to some buyers while it may not make any difference to others.
Best,
Greg
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,039
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From: State of Confusion!!!
2018 C2 of Year Winner
I haven't inspected the car yet, but the tank sticker is supposed to be intact. I'm not real sure how legible it is. It has the proper single fuel line, big block side yokes, copper/brass radiator, plastic shroud and M-21 transmission. I will be doing quite a bit more research on this car, just wondering about the CE block.
Just another Corvette guy
Joined: Feb 1999
Posts: 8,518
Likes: 3,865
From: Palm Springs, CA.
Well, if the car is in very nice condition, needing nothing, I would say missing an original LT-1 engine could be a $5k hit.
If the car is in need of some resto work and could be bought right, it would be an excellent candidate for a correct numbers block to be re-installed.
You will certainly get two camps of thought on this issue but for the rarity of the car I would do it.
Best,
Greg
If the car is in need of some resto work and could be bought right, it would be an excellent candidate for a correct numbers block to be re-installed.
You will certainly get two camps of thought on this issue but for the rarity of the car I would do it.
Best,
Greg
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,672
Likes: 6
From: Nevada City California
Dip51,
The model you have selected is the most desireable of the three years, '70 to '72 as far as small block optioned 'vettes. The LT-1 engine IS the heart of that option, with out it intact, you lose a lot of the cars appeal and value monetarily wise. If some of the unique components that make up the LT-1 engine package are still there, such as 800 cfm carburetor (GM's rating), aluminum high rise intake manifold, unique heads with larger valves, push rod guide plates, screw in rocker arm studs, magnetic pulse transistorized ignition system...then you still have some value, otherwise my guess would be 50% of the value is lost in comparison to a correct, original car.
The model you have selected is the most desireable of the three years, '70 to '72 as far as small block optioned 'vettes. The LT-1 engine IS the heart of that option, with out it intact, you lose a lot of the cars appeal and value monetarily wise. If some of the unique components that make up the LT-1 engine package are still there, such as 800 cfm carburetor (GM's rating), aluminum high rise intake manifold, unique heads with larger valves, push rod guide plates, screw in rocker arm studs, magnetic pulse transistorized ignition system...then you still have some value, otherwise my guess would be 50% of the value is lost in comparison to a correct, original car.
Racer
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 331
Likes: 1
Wouldnt the Vin number be traceable to indicate it was an LT1 car? I have a 70 LT1 that I am the 3rd owner of and I grew up 3 houses down from the Original owner in the 70's so I know the car is an original.
The tank sticker was so deteriorated I could not read anything off of it.
How would someone authenticate such a car?
The tank sticker was so deteriorated I could not read anything off of it.
How would someone authenticate such a car?
Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,581
Likes: 28
From: Spring, Texas
Please explain why. I picked '72 because it's the only year LT-1 that can be verified by the VIN number. The LT-1 engine in 71 and 72 were almost identical and production numbers were lower in 72. Remember, the horsepower number in 72 was lower only because the standard rating changed from SAE gross (330 for LT-1) to SAE net (255 for LT-1).
Last edited by SharkAttack; Apr 12, 2007 at 10:24 PM.
Just another Corvette guy
Joined: Feb 1999
Posts: 8,518
Likes: 3,865
From: Palm Springs, CA.
Because '70 is also a short run model year which makes it rarer and there were only about 1,200 LT-1's that year. Simple arithmetic dictates the '70 as the most desirable LT-1.
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Race Director
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From: YANKEES UNIVERSE 70 454-LS5 500 ft-lbs Torque
If you look at the prices the 70 LT-1 is always higher and sought after by collectors.The 71-72 are also great LT-1's,but the fact is the 70 is more desirable mainly for the 370 hp rating.
Race Director
Joined: Feb 2003
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From: YANKEES UNIVERSE 70 454-LS5 500 ft-lbs Torque
Dip51,
The model you have selected is the most desireable of the three years, '70 to '72 as far as small block optioned 'vettes. The LT-1 engine IS the heart of that option, with out it intact, you lose a lot of the cars appeal and value monetarily wise. If some of the unique components that make up the LT-1 engine package are still there, such as 800 cfm carburetor (GM's rating), aluminum high rise intake manifold, unique heads with larger valves, push rod guide plates, screw in rocker arm studs, magnetic pulse transistorized ignition system...then you still have some value, otherwise my guess would be 50% of the value is lost in comparison to a correct, original car.
The model you have selected is the most desireable of the three years, '70 to '72 as far as small block optioned 'vettes. The LT-1 engine IS the heart of that option, with out it intact, you lose a lot of the cars appeal and value monetarily wise. If some of the unique components that make up the LT-1 engine package are still there, such as 800 cfm carburetor (GM's rating), aluminum high rise intake manifold, unique heads with larger valves, push rod guide plates, screw in rocker arm studs, magnetic pulse transistorized ignition system...then you still have some value, otherwise my guess would be 50% of the value is lost in comparison to a correct, original car.
Race Director
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 15,892
Likes: 42
Even if this car proves to be a bona fide LT-1, the CE block adds nothing over any other NOM possibility.
Anybody could have installed this engine, no telling when or what's inside it. Could have been a warranty replacement for a low HP pickup truck.........
Anybody could have installed this engine, no telling when or what's inside it. Could have been a warranty replacement for a low HP pickup truck.........
Team Owner
Joined: Jun 2000
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From: Southbound
Cruise-In II Veteran
... There is no paperwork from the warranty, and really not much paperwork at all...
...This is an original LT-1...
Team Owner
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From: Southbound
Cruise-In II Veteran
Heel & Toe
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
From: MA
Documents go a long way in the muscle car world. I’m not sure why a documented Vette would take a 50% hit that seems excessive. If you go by the book and recent sales these cars have values of mid 20s to 50k plus. Wow a 50% hit of those numbers, It wouldn’t take a fraction of those big dollars to make it correct. (or maybe a fake) I believe a correct repair (CE block) casting numbers etc is acceptable in judging.
Heel & Toe
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 24
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From: MA
Tank stickers are not the only way to validate a Vette. Canadian cars have an archive of records that are available for a fee. Can’t fake that!
Check out this link
http://www.proteam-corvette.com/about.html
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,672
Likes: 6
From: Nevada City California
Please explain why. I picked '72 because it's the only year LT-1 that can be verified by the VIN number. The LT-1 engine in 71 and 72 were almost identical and production numbers were lower in 72. Remember, the horsepower number in 72 was lower only because the standard rating changed from SAE gross (330 for LT-1) to SAE net (255 for LT-1).
From the standpoint that all 1972 Corvettes can be identified from the vin plate as to what engine was installed at the factory, that indeed would make this year very desireable. However, any '70 or '71 that has it's original window invoice, protect-o-plate warranty pamphlet, dealer sales invoice would have proof of this engine option as well. Most '71's would also have this proof with the Corvette Order Copy sheet also, however this sheet would not be proof for '70.
Actually the '72 LT-1 engine is not as strong as the '71. The timing specs were re-adjusted again to 4 BTDC, the carburetor was recalibrated and the loss of magnetic pulse transistorized ignition giving it 255hp net as opposed to 275hp net for '71.
Race Director
Joined: Jul 2001
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Not necessarily! The original engine might have been removed for any number of reasons at any time. There's no proof that the CE engine in the car now was a direct replacement under GM warranty. Could have been swapped last week for all we know.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2004
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From: State of Confusion!!!
2018 C2 of Year Winner
)Does anyone know what the problem was with these engines back in the day?? There are an awful lot of replacement blocks out there!!!
