I'm starting a new thread because the last one was confusing, I didn't have all the right info and the car was a couple states away. I now have the car in my possession.

For those that remember the earlier thread, I have gone back and forth on whether this car may be an original Motion or a catalog clone. The previous owner believed it was an original Motion until a guy at a local car show told him that he built it. Mr. Rosen never ran any numbers because the previous owner didn't agree with his research fee. Evidently, the previous owner took the "builder's" word at a small town PA car show and that was the end of it. My father is good friends with the previous owner, has been for 30+ years, and up until the day I went to pay for the car, my father had never heard the story of the "found" builder. The previous owner is in his mid-late 60s, not senile but possibly not remembering things the same as he did when he was younger. There is also something screwey with the chain of custody, the car was sold to the previous owner via 3rd party proxy so the original owner's name would not be on the title. A search by the previous owner through PA DMV came to a dead end, the original owner has no paper trail connection to the car.

A couple of posters in the previous thread mentioned small details like the ignition system, fuel pump, and rear end linkages as changes Motion would have made but not the average catalog builder. When comparing the Haynes manual to the distributor in the car yesterday to diagnose a miss, I realized it's not factory distributor/igniton and that got me thinking again about the Motion connection...

Now that I have the car in my garage, I'd like to dig a little deeper into those Motion-specific changes, I want to find something (anything!) that tells me this couldn't possibly be an original Motion car, otherwise I'm going to send $2500 to Mr. Rosen and take my chances.


The car is a 1970 coupe with a 1969 427, high compression (240psi!), oval port heads, CE motor with a M22 transmission and 4.11 rear. No options at all from the factory, no power anything. Except for a cam/carb swap for driveability reasons and different tail lights (I think) by the previous owner , I believe the car has been basically the same for at least 20 years.

VIN 194370S405385
Engine CE062169
Trim Code 400
Paint Code 975 (not now)

I can and will take pictures of any part of the car that more knowledgeable folks would like to see. Again, I'm asking for help to prove it can't possibly be a Motion car, I'm hoping there is a way to prove it's not instead of just rolling the dice to see if it is.

Here we go!

 

I like it. i would suggest some 'real' tires though. Traction: F, Treadwear: F.

 

Nice Vette! Motion car or not.

I'd suggest getting that rubber fuel line out of there ASAP. One little leak and it won't make any difference if it's real Motion car or not.

 

The MSD ignition box is a newer add on,and the distributor looks like a old accell dizzy.I have several of the old dist. in single points,and dual point configurations,and have sold many.
I am not a knowledgeable Motion guy by any means....Just what I have seen on the internet,and here on this forum,but doing custom work on these cars was the craze back in the 70s,and the early 80s to make them different,and the shops doing the conversions weren't getting 60-100.00 per hour.They were car people....not money people.
In your last thread....parkerracing got in there....Listen to him.He knows his stuff,and will help you deciper this car.Keith knows alot about them.
You got a GREAT price on this car,and I really like it.Just enjoy having something different,and run the the dog pizz out of it.That IS what these cars are about,bud.Enjoy it,and drive it like you stole it.

 

Before you send a check to Joel Rosen, you should read the current issue of Corvette Enthusiast Magazine. It features a genuine Baldwin-Motion car and has a blurb about the original ten cars. If memory serves, Rosen was no longer making the cars by the time your '73-up front fenders became available.

Could save you $2500.

 

I do know this.
You could buy those rear window louvers from Ecklers back in the late 70s. I purchased a set from them way back when.
Not saying that Motion didn't buy or sell them too, just I do know about those louvers.
Gotta love the customs.
Couldn't tell from the pics, but post a pic of the valve covers if they have the motion emblem on them.
There are repros sold on ebay. The correct emblem looks different.
hope this helps.

 

Apparently Rosen used Lucas ignition components, believe it or not. Also, a friend of mine has a car that is probably a real motion car, he sent Rosen $2500+ (3 YEARS AGO) and Rosen is all set to authenticate it, but is requiring NCIC (?) documentation before he will do anything else.

And, almost no one can provide these since the Patriot Act.

Steve

 

That's exactly what I was after, something that says there is no way it could be an original 1970 Motion car. I wouldn't know a 1970 fender from a 1973 fender but I knew you guys would help. Thank you, now I can mod away and drive it like I stole it without worrying about its potential value.

 

Copied from the source.

In July, 2005, Joel Rosen and Marty Schorr, the people responsible for the ground-pounding, take-no-prisoners Baldwin-Motion 1967-1974 SS and Phase III 427 & 454 Chevrolet Camaro, Nova, Chevelle and Corvette specialty cars, formed an exclusive strategic business partnership with Joel Ehrenpreis and Larry Jaworske, MOTION, LLC, Sarasota, FL. The mission: Re-launch the Baldwin-Motion and Motion brands and create and market the Great American Supercar. In addition to coachbuilt-to-order, limited-edition Baldwin-Motion supercars, MOTION, LLC will develop a line of Motion-branded high-performance products. The Launch Edition of the Great American Supercar project is a new, highly sophisticated 1969 Baldwin-Motion Camaro SuperCoupe, powered by a 600-plus horsepower fuel-injected, all-aluminum 540-cubic-inch Merlin/Motion big-block built by Bill Mitchell.


The link to the history section.

http://www.officialbaldwinmotion.com/history.htm

 

Before i send Mr. Rosen my hard earned $2500, I would do more research. Best bet would be to find someone who actually HAS as motion car of the same year, and talk with them about the telling minusha that a real Motion car would have. The cars are out there, you just need to find an owner to talk to. That's your best bet, IMHO. C.

 

Would the original Motion cars have had CE designated engines? Those are normally limited to "over the counter" service spares sent to dealerships. If the original car builders procured the engine blocks through a dealership (or through GM Service Parts system), the blocks could have had a CE number. And, if that is the case, the CE number in your car should be in the same series of numbers as the other Motion cars. Surely, that info is available to compare to your car....

 

Those flares do not look like Motion flares. And I must agree about the 73 side panels.

 

From the first topic. "the previous owner says the car has more 69 parts than 70 parts."
BM, a dealer was using new cars.

From the first topic.The previous owner thought it was until he ran into the builder at a car show.

The builder would know enough about it to prove he built it. Plenty of customs were done w/ readily avail. parts.
Doesn't look like a real Motion to me either.

 

Awesome car real or not!