body shiming question
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 860
Likes: 0
From: Stratford Ontario
body shiming question
I have been doing a frame off restoration on a 73 vert I purchased already apart.The doors were off the body when I got it so it made alignment even worse to do.My question is that I had to use at least an inch of shims on the rear #4 body mounts, the bolts barely started to thread.Is there something that can be holding the middle of the car up?I have the doors on shimed the car so that all seams are as close as I can get them but not sure if it is really right?Any suggestions would be appreciated.I am going to raise the car enough to get under it tommorrow to see if I can see anything,but it seems like thats where it wants to sit.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 860
Likes: 0
From: Stratford Ontario
I have no shims at position 2 or 3.I only have shims at 1 and 4. The shims at 1 are 3/16 on pass side and 5/16 on driver side then piles of 1/16 shims on #4 on both sides.
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 31,200
Likes: 4,287
From: Westminster Maryland
Hi Tim,
Are you sure this is a frame set up for the rubber mounts (73+) and not the solid mounts (72-)? You may have the body pulled down at the #1 mount which is making all the difference in the frame show up at the #4mount.
What ARE the door gaps like?
Regards,
Alan
Are you sure this is a frame set up for the rubber mounts (73+) and not the solid mounts (72-)? You may have the body pulled down at the #1 mount which is making all the difference in the frame show up at the #4mount.
What ARE the door gaps like?
Regards,
Alan
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 860
Likes: 0
From: Stratford Ontario
It did have the rubber still stuck on the passenger side #1 mount,of the body when I got the car.If I can't find anything under the car this morning I will try to poist pics.It is shimed like it wants to be like this doors and roof are aligned but the back body seems to be too high on the frame?
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 31,200
Likes: 4,287
From: Westminster Maryland
Hi Tim,
There's supposed to be a four sided formed metal plate that riveted to the fiberglass underbody, it is the upper part of the mount; it appears to be missing. I believe that's your answer!!!!
Regards,
Alan
There's supposed to be a four sided formed metal plate that riveted to the fiberglass underbody, it is the upper part of the mount; it appears to be missing. I believe that's your answer!!!!
Regards,
Alan
Last edited by Alan 71; Jan 3, 2010 at 05:08 PM.
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Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 860
Likes: 0
From: Stratford Ontario
The steel four sided plate is on there its just covered in what ever has been sprayed on the wheel wells.I haven't got to the wheel wells yet to try to scrape that stuff off.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,246
Likes: 114
From: Watkins Glen NY
That sure does look like too many shims back there, but I'd hate to mess with them..the gaps look good.
Couple thoughts:
It looks like the cushion below the frame mount is thicker than the one above it...if it is, maybe switch them to increase the bolts reach and lose a shim or two.
I wonder if someone had cut the old rear mounts off the frame, and rewelded new ones a little too low?
Is the rear spring new? Is it a 7 leaf or a 9 leaf? They will settle down after a while too, or you could buy longer outer spring bolts to help lower the rear.
Hope this helps, Joe
Couple thoughts:
It looks like the cushion below the frame mount is thicker than the one above it...if it is, maybe switch them to increase the bolts reach and lose a shim or two.
I wonder if someone had cut the old rear mounts off the frame, and rewelded new ones a little too low?
Is the rear spring new? Is it a 7 leaf or a 9 leaf? They will settle down after a while too, or you could buy longer outer spring bolts to help lower the rear.
Hope this helps, Joe
Racer
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 330
Likes: 44
From: Cincinnati Ohio
Make certain that the necked down part of the rubber mount is in the holes in the body. There is a metal sleeve inside that rubber neck and if the holes in the body are too small or the rubber mount is not 'plugged' into the body holes the body will sitting on top of the sleeve rather than on the larger rubber donut around the sleeve. Your should have been able to push the rubber sleeve end of the mount into the body mount holes for #2 and # 3 mounts.
You also may want to check the frame to see if it has a twist in it from a wreck. This will also cause the mounts to be so far apart.
Good Luck,
Unks 73
You also may want to check the frame to see if it has a twist in it from a wreck. This will also cause the mounts to be so far apart.
Good Luck,
Unks 73
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 31,200
Likes: 4,287
From: Westminster Maryland
Hi Tim,
I really think the body is high. On my 71 there's only about an inch, maybe less, between the top of the frame rail, where the fuel line mounts, and the fiberglass underbody.
What I don't understand is why the #3 body mount doesn't need some extra shims and the #2 body mount a couple of extra shims. If the body is normal height in front but too high in back I'd think #2, #3, and #4, would all be affected to some degree.
PUZZLED!!!!
Regards,
Alan
I really think the body is high. On my 71 there's only about an inch, maybe less, between the top of the frame rail, where the fuel line mounts, and the fiberglass underbody.
What I don't understand is why the #3 body mount doesn't need some extra shims and the #2 body mount a couple of extra shims. If the body is normal height in front but too high in back I'd think #2, #3, and #4, would all be affected to some degree.
PUZZLED!!!!
Regards,
Alan
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 860
Likes: 0
From: Stratford Ontario
Thats what is making me think something is not right. I have exactly two inches in that same spot between framerail and body.It looks O.K. the way it is asuming it lowers once all springs break in and puting interior and gas in tank lowers it,I just want the body to be sitting properly before going too much further.I may have to make a jig that will let me lift each side enough to get in and see if something is catching on door sill supports holding it up.From everywhere I look it appears to be sitting solid.Thanks for your help and I will try to keep anything I find posted.Timsride
Racer
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 330
Likes: 44
From: Cincinnati Ohio
After the latest information, wondered if there were any 'repairs' done to the body channel or the number 2 and 3 mount areas? If the bird cage had significant rust damage, maybe the previous owner had welded in repair pieces into this area.
There are 'repair' parts available to insert into both the hinge pillar and the lock pillar and a new channel that fits inside the old one. The insert repair parts along with a new channel could raise the overall body height above the frame.
Do you have any pictures of what the underside of the body and the mounts looked like before it went back on the frame? They might help identify the cause.
Hang with it, there is a reason!
There are 'repair' parts available to insert into both the hinge pillar and the lock pillar and a new channel that fits inside the old one. The insert repair parts along with a new channel could raise the overall body height above the frame.
Do you have any pictures of what the underside of the body and the mounts looked like before it went back on the frame? They might help identify the cause.
Hang with it, there is a reason!
