High-Torque Starter Question
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 2,569
Likes: 126
From: San Diego California
High-Torque Starter Question
The high compression 383 (w/HEI distributor) is taking a toll on the NOS starter/solenoid, and I'm considering one of the new lighter starters out there.
Gear Reduction Ratios: What exactly are these numbers comparing, and what ratios might be considered "better" for higher torque and lower amperage draw?
TIA.
Steve
Gear Reduction Ratios: What exactly are these numbers comparing, and what ratios might be considered "better" for higher torque and lower amperage draw?
TIA.
Steve
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,524
Likes: 61
From: Medina Ohio
In the Summit Racing catalog they have a chart for starters based on compression. Online some of them have a "maximum compression ratio" recommendation.
So, while I don't have an explanation on the technical aspect of the gear reduction, I would use the above method for choosing a new one.
So, while I don't have an explanation on the technical aspect of the gear reduction, I would use the above method for choosing a new one.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 2,569
Likes: 126
From: San Diego California
Thanks ib,
I took a chance, ordered a Powermaster from Summit. Had to get the staggered bolt mount, because this 383 has a '76 C-10 4-bolt main block. Reviews mentioned it worked well with stroker applications. Guess we'll find out.
Steve
I took a chance, ordered a Powermaster from Summit. Had to get the staggered bolt mount, because this 383 has a '76 C-10 4-bolt main block. Reviews mentioned it worked well with stroker applications. Guess we'll find out.
Steve
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 2,569
Likes: 126
From: San Diego California
Race Director
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 13,013
Likes: 2,253
From: Corsicana, Tx
2020 C2 of the Year - Modified Winner
2020 Corvette of the Year (performance mods)
C2 of Year Winner (performance mods) 2019
2017 C2 of Year Finalist
Take advantage of the multipe mounting options to clock it away from header heat etc.
JIM
JIM
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 2,802
Likes: 241
From: Niles, MI
The starter you got is based on the Hitachi Super-Lite starter and is rated at 160 ft.-lbs. of torque. Summit's notes state, "Not for use with high compression engines. This starter is designed for engines using stock timing advance curves."
Might be a little weak for your high compression 383.
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Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 2,569
Likes: 126
From: San Diego California
Powermaster is the only manufacturer to rate all their starters by output torque specs which is what you really care about. Everybody else uses mumbo jumbo like kW, HP, amps, gear reduction ratio, etc.
The starter you got is based on the Hitachi Super-Lite starter and is rated at 160 ft.-lbs. of torque. Summit's notes state, "Not for use with high compression engines. This starter is designed for engines using stock timing advance curves."
Might be a little weak for your high compression 383.
The starter you got is based on the Hitachi Super-Lite starter and is rated at 160 ft.-lbs. of torque. Summit's notes state, "Not for use with high compression engines. This starter is designed for engines using stock timing advance curves."
Might be a little weak for your high compression 383.
Ya know, I did read that Kid,
Which gave me an urge to pause some.
I also thought it wise to look at the reviews from the product's previous buyers, and a few who had 383s said it turned them alright.
I do think it's a test of time though. For in the beginning, a starter right out of the box will never be stronger. Right? And depending on piston and cylinder head design, compressions between 383s can vary too. Mine's calculated to be around 11:1, so....... we'll find out how strong this guy is and how it holds up to my stroker.
Steve
Dr. Detroit
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 10,093
Likes: 4,019
From: New Braunfels Texas
I just thought I would pop in and say that myself and a few of my friends run this starter.....
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cvs-5323/overview/
Never had a problem....spins it like it has no plugs in it.....
I have owned three myself.
Jebby
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cvs-5323/overview/
Never had a problem....spins it like it has no plugs in it.....
I have owned three myself.
Jebby
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 2,802
Likes: 241
From: Niles, MI
Good article on starters here. It explains why torque ratings are the best for starters as opposed to HP and Kw rating.
From the article, "Kilowatt rating is how all electric motors are measured. The higher the kW output, the more power the motor has. That doesn't always mean that the higher the kilowatt rating, the more powerful the starter is since gear reduction is going to manipulate the end result. For instance, Powermaster's UltraTorque High Speed starter is designed for alcohol engines or engines running magnetos that need faster cranking. It has a 2.2kw rating and 3.0 hp, but is only recommend for engines with up to 15:1 compression. By comparison, the Powermaster XS Torque uses a 1.4kw, 1.8hp motor…but can crank engines with up to 18:1 compression. The different gear ratios (3.75:1 for the High Speed and 4.4:1 for the XS Torque) manipulate the power produced through the drive gear."
From the article, "Kilowatt rating is how all electric motors are measured. The higher the kW output, the more power the motor has. That doesn't always mean that the higher the kilowatt rating, the more powerful the starter is since gear reduction is going to manipulate the end result. For instance, Powermaster's UltraTorque High Speed starter is designed for alcohol engines or engines running magnetos that need faster cranking. It has a 2.2kw rating and 3.0 hp, but is only recommend for engines with up to 15:1 compression. By comparison, the Powermaster XS Torque uses a 1.4kw, 1.8hp motor…but can crank engines with up to 18:1 compression. The different gear ratios (3.75:1 for the High Speed and 4.4:1 for the XS Torque) manipulate the power produced through the drive gear."
Last edited by Kid Vette; Dec 15, 2015 at 06:30 PM.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 2,569
Likes: 126
From: San Diego California
Good article on starters here. It explains why torque ratings are the best for starters as opposed to HP and Kw rating.
From the article, "Kilowatt rating is how all electric motors are measured. The higher the kW output, the more power the motor has. That doesn't always mean that the higher the kilowatt rating, the more powerful the starter is since gear reduction is going to manipulate the end result. For instance, Powermaster's UltraTorque High Speed starter is designed for alcohol engines or engines running magnetos that need faster cranking. It has a 2.2kw rating and 3.0 hp, but is only recommend for engines with up to 15:1 compression. By comparison, the Powermaster XS Torque uses a 1.4kw, 1.8hp motor…but can crank engines with up to 18:1 compression. The different gear ratios (3.75:1 for the High Speed and 4.4:1 for the XS Torque) manipulate the power produced through the drive gear."
From the article, "Kilowatt rating is how all electric motors are measured. The higher the kW output, the more power the motor has. That doesn't always mean that the higher the kilowatt rating, the more powerful the starter is since gear reduction is going to manipulate the end result. For instance, Powermaster's UltraTorque High Speed starter is designed for alcohol engines or engines running magnetos that need faster cranking. It has a 2.2kw rating and 3.0 hp, but is only recommend for engines with up to 15:1 compression. By comparison, the Powermaster XS Torque uses a 1.4kw, 1.8hp motor…but can crank engines with up to 18:1 compression. The different gear ratios (3.75:1 for the High Speed and 4.4:1 for the XS Torque) manipulate the power produced through the drive gear."
Now I'm taking a close inspection of BOTH Battery Cables too.
Steve
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 878
Likes: 55
From: Deep South Denmark
Is the battery new?
My old battery (cheap version, but with a high cranking amp spec.) would start it but if I cranked it for a long time, like when filling up the carb bowls after changing jets, the voltage would drop below where the MSD ignition box cuts out.
I replaced the battery with an expensive, good quality one and it made a huge difference in cranking speed.
/Karsten