KWIL

Long story short, my 80 was sitting for years, had a built 406 put in, then sat again for about a year. I finally got around to re-restoring it (I restored it initially around 2003 or so.) Most everything is sorted out now, except for electrical. My engine builder left a bunch of wires dangling throughout the car and many of the electrical components don't work (pdl, pw, defroster, radio, headlights, turn signals, courtesy lights, etc.)

I've only driven it once since I got it back from the builder, and it's sat since, mainly because it wouldn't pass inspection and wasn't legal to drive. But now it won't even start. Battery is good (took it out and had it tested), alternator is almost new. When the key turns to the ON position, my electric fans start, gauge lights turn on, everything seems right, but when the key is in RUN, immediately power is cut to everything. No gauge lights, fans, nothing. And it remains that way until I disconnect, then reconnect the battery. Then everything works in ON, but goes dead again in RUN. I unplugged the +batt wire on my Accel coil and plugged back in, thinking it was a bad connection. Then the starter clicks and engine sounds like its turning over, but won't fire. So I'm thinking it's got to be coil related? Or maybe a ground? Or???

Any help would be greatly appreciated. I've driven this car once in the past 6 or 7 years, and would love to be able to finish the restoration, get it inspected, and drive.

Doug1

What do you mean, "the engine sounds like it's turning over."?? If the engine is cranking but no start, check for spark, if no spark, could very well be the coil.
Also check condition of distributor cap and rotor and wires.

KWIL

Sorry, my post was unclear. Yes, it was cranking, but no start. I'm sure there is no spark, but I believe it's due to an intermittent short somewhere, because as I wrote, all power was lost when turning key to RUN position. Then after removing and reinserting the +batt connector into the Accel, power was restored. Now, I can't recreate the no power condition, but it just cranks with no start. Does this sound like a fusible link issue? Coil, cap, rotor, wires are all new.

Big2Bird

More questions than answers here, but I would have to say look/test/replace the ignition switch as a start. I would also unplug the alarm if equipped.

KWIL

I pulled the alarm fuse, but no change. Any idea if it's possible to test the ignition switch without pulling the wheel and dropping the column?

Big2Bird

I don't know. On a 40 year old car, I would just drop it and change it anyhow. Test it while it's down. Turn signals too.

I needed a cheap car years ago. My boss said if I started their Lincoln I could have it. Same symptoms. $25 for a switch, and I brought home a Lincoln Mark VII.

BTW, GM still has it at the dealer.

Big2Bird

And if memory serves me right, the switch has slots to adjust it. That may be the issue.

Doug1

Tough pill to swallow, all that work, but I agree with this.
Great story about the Lincoln!

Doug1

I think this is the key, Big2Bird is right on.

trz1000

An easy way to test for spark by yourself is to hook up a timing light, squeeze the trigger (or button) and tape it in the activated position. Set the light somewhere you can see it from the drivers seat and crank the motor. Light will flash everytime the spark plug fires.

Keep in mind how slow the motor is turning over when cranking with the starter. Meaning, you won't see a bunch of flashing like when timing a running motor.

To test coil hook timing light to coil wire between coil and distributor cap if it's not a cap mount. If coil is a cap mount, do a quick Google search on testing HEI coil. Very easy if you have a multimeter I just don't remember all the details off hand.

Make sure you keep timing light leads safely away from moving parts.

You can test everything on the distributor at home with a multi meter except the module. It's pretty easy other than you do have to remove it. May be able to do in can and crank the engine to spin the shaft, I've never tried. Anyway, auto parts store can test module but have them do it several times as sometimes a bad one will pass when cold. Failed modules are not uncommon.

KWIL

Thanks for the suggestions. I've already swapped the coil and module with known good units and there's no change. I'm certain it's somewhere in the wiring.

Doug1

So it was fine the last time you drove it, how do you know this isn't a gas/carb issue? How long did it sit?
Are you absolutely positive that there is no spark when you crank it? If you don't want to the the timing light thing, pull a boot off and stick a screwdriver in it. Then place screwdriver near the block, small gap between the two, have someone crank engine.

KWIL

Anyone know if the + wire to the coil comes directly from the ignition switch? If so, I guess it makes sense that pulling and reinserting the wire into the coil allowed the car to crank but not start. Maybe a loose connection at the switch? Not sure how the switch could cause loss of all power in the Run position until the battery is disconnected then reconnected though. Unless the switch goes directly to the starter also. Then it all makes sense and it must be the ignition switch.

Just thinking out loud trying to make sense of it.

KWIL

Been about a year since actually driven any distance. I started it a few times since and backed it into the driveway to bring it up to temperature and to make sure there were no flat spots on the tires. Also used Stabil in the fuel tank. It has fresh 93 octane and the carb is getting fuel.
I think it's spark, but haven't tested yet. I don't own a timing light. I'll try the old screwdriver trick.

With the symptoms though it has to be an electrical issue, right?

general ike

I know it simple but have you checked your battery connections? Could it be when there is enough draw a poor or loose connection comes into effect? Way out of my league but isn't there a way to bypass the switch and jump the starter remotely?

I had cars with both of these situations in the past. Ike

Doug1

It's cranking, just not starting.
The answer to your question is yes btw. lol

Doug1

With the additional info of stabil in the tank and starting a few times, it does tend to make me think electrical. Gas, spark, compression is what's needed to start and run. Checking for spark is an easy and fast way to eliminate one of the three, you obviously have compression. So it's between the first two.

Doug1

Some of this is really weird sounding. Part of it is your wording, the car cranks from ignition switch sending power to starter. Coil provides juice for spark in distributor.

KWIL

just trying to figure out how both scenarios could indicate a bad ignition switch: car loses power when turning key to the start position and won't crank/ and no loss of power when key turn to start position but car only cranks and will not start.
I hope to avoid pulling the wheel and dropping the column unless absolutely necessary. I've done it before many years ago and it wasn't fun.

Doug1

I hope you have a battery charger for all this stuff, lol. I still want to know what happened with the spark test. Just to be sure before tearing the column apart. It's a 3 minute long test with someone else cranking, if no one else is around try and rig it so you see that small gap while you crank the engine.

But also, here you go again with the wording. I took your term on RUN for the key position as the spot where the key comes back after letting off of it to start....? But then you say no start in RUN. See why it's confusing?