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Old Sep 14, 2020 | 04:50 PM
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Default C3 Purchase Suggestions

Hi! I live in Wisconsin and wanted a fun daily driver summer car. My commute is literally 1.5 miles to work and 1.5 miles home so this would be a very low mileage situation. I wanted something capable of being a daily driver and then stored throughout the winter. I originally wanted a Mercedes SL from 72-89, but those seem like more hassle than I am prepared for. I cannot work on a car myself, however there are several mechanics in Milwaukee that appear capable of working on Corvette's including one that only does Corvette's of all years.

My experience with old cars is that if you drive them, they stay in pretty good shape. I had a '65 mustang in high school, driven everyday to go to school (about 40 miles a day, school was in downtown and I lived in suburbs) and I never had a mechanical breakdown during that time (car wouldn't start, broke on the side of the road, etc). I obviously had mechanical & mainteance things that I addressed each year, but the car always started and never had any major issues while driving. When my dad kept the car and only drove it once a week, the car started to have a lot more issues.

I really like the C3 Corvette's and think that they would be a great summer daily driver. I am looking for cheap, $20K or less, and I do not care as much about performance as I do avoiding years that have known mechanical issues that are hard to fix. While I would love to get one that still has some chrome on it (even if that is just the back bumper), I know those can get a little up there in price. Again, I do not care about horsepower, although, having a Corvette with under 200 horses (as some years in the later 70s did) just does not seem right! I started focusing on a 1982 mostly because that is my birth year and I think that would be really cool. I have read that '82 have become slightly more collectible then some of the immediate previous few years because production was down and collectors have come to appreciate that HP got back up above 200. However, I do not like that it is the first year of that cross fire injection engine and I am not sure if that causes any issues.

Overall, my question to all of you, if I am interested in a C3 Corvette $20K or less, are there any years to absolutely avoid from a mechanical/maintenance perspective? If I move forward, I will have a mechanic do a once over on the car before purchase.

Thanks!
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Old Sep 15, 2020 | 12:40 PM
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Rubber bumper years will give you the most car for the money, 1974 - 1982. I think you should be able to find one within your budget.
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Old Sep 15, 2020 | 01:21 PM
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For $20k you can buy a nice C3- I see chrome bumper cars in that range. If you want a nice driving and comfortable car with loads of options, I would suggest a late C3 4-speed car. You can buy a nice one for much less than your max. budget. 1982s have exactly 200hp. They are all automatics. They have Crossfire fuel injection- I have had two that drove fine but do a search on this forum. Many people do not like the engine. I really like my LT-1 '72 for performance. For cruising, I like my '80-'81 4-Speed cars. They have comfortable seats, luggage space, A/C, power equipment etc. All C3s have their plusses and minuses.

Since you said you want chrome with a bit of power search '68-'73. Look for a '69-'70 L46 coupe. You can find one in your price range. Plenty of power.
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Old Sep 15, 2020 | 09:57 PM
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'74 is the first year with both "rubber" bumpers. It was the last year for big blocks (454) but it was an uncommon option. The big block still has lots of torque but both torque and power were way down for all compared to earlier ones with much higher compression, less emission control equipment and tuning away from performance towards fuel economy and lowered emissions.

'75-'77 were the "dog" years for performance due to restrictive catalytic converters and further turning/emissions components that robbed power.

'78 got the big "fastback" rear window that stayed for the rest of C3 production. The cabin is far less claustrophobic and for the first time there's a fair amount of storage space.

'79 and '80 have the most powerful engines (both base L48 and performance L82) of the "smog engine" years and high production means the are relatively easy to find and inexpensive when you do. That engine comment excludes the pathetic (for a Corvette) 305 used in all California cars. '79+ '78 "pace car" also gets the so-called "clam shell" seats first available only in the limited edition as standard equipment. They were almost universally acclaimed as being a GREAT improvement upon the previous seats which some called the worst part of the car. Not only are they more comfortable, supporting and far lighter in weight but the passenger seat fold down with the back level with the rear storage compartment which greatly increases storage space in a pinch and gives great access to the rear storage area. The driver seat folds the same way but the steering wheel prevents it from folding all the way down. Numerous earlier C3 owners not concerned with originality swap these seats into their cars as they are a direct fit.

'81 had only one available engine and it used an electro-mechanical carburetor and a primitive computer control system (including engine time) that didn't age well which finds most of them converted to a standard carburetor and distributor with vacuum advance.

'82 got the "cross fire" fuel injected engine. While better than the '81 it's still a primitive (compared to today) injection and control system that some like but many hate. Only automatic transmission.

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Provided the car doesn't face emission testing in your state all of the above (save the '82) can be significantly "woken up" relatively easily and inexpensively with true dual exhaust and more performance-oriented engine tuning

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The price for any of these tops out in the 15k - 20k range irregardless of mileage, condition, modifications, etc. with the price range largely dependent on options with the increasingly rare with age 4-speed manual transmission easily the most valuable, glass T-tops, non-base engines convenience features more and more of which became standard in the later years.

The problem with such pricing is that age alone requires extensive and expensive reworking of most of the major systems to include suspension, steering, braking, window mechanisms, A/C, etc. Nearly every not not every original rubber part is almost certain to need replacement due solely to age. Age and poor replacement/modification related electrical problems are also common. For a reliable and reasonably comfortable daily driver. While the cost of this if you DIY isn't too high, if you have it done in a shop labor alone can easily to the maximum value in labor alone. You really should use a shop with mechanics EXPERIENCED with C3s for any but the most basic maintenance as a lot of things are peculiar to them. The cost of a reasonable paint job alone begins at around 10k. The cost of the early steel bumper cars does not face this limitation so you're equally unlikely to find a really good condition car in your price range save examples with the base engine and few if any options to include things like power steering, power brakes, A/C, a tilt-telescope steering wheel (a near necessity unless you're about 5'8", 140#).

What all this means is that cars with all that needed age-only repair done within the reasonable past is rather difficult to find saving things like divorce, death or bankruptcy that essentially force the sale. Otherwise owners just won't sell them because they're greatly "under water" due to labor costs or have spent so much of their own time that they won't sell unless utterly required. The cost of the early steel bumper cars does not face this limitation so you're equally unlikely to find a really good condition car in your price range save examples with the base engine and few if any options to include things like power steering, power brakes, A/C, a tilt-telescope steering wheel (a near necessity unless you're very close to 5'8", 140#). Even then the driving position in the first few years of C3 production has been described as the "praying mantis".

The sort of rubber bumper cars you're likely to find:

1) There a surprising number available in the 4k-6k range. I suggest you completely forget about these as they are certain to require so much work that you'd wait for months and easily spend $15k+ in parts and labor just to have a reasonably reliable car in decent cosmetic shape.

2) Cars in the 7k-11k range should will be in increasing better mechanic and cosmetic condition but are certain to have lots of greatly deferred maintenance of the sort I've described, a "project car" that was given up on and likely sat for a few years or a "barn find" that likely sat for MANY years if not decades because a widow refused to sell her husband's toy. Worst still it could look and work surprising well to have a severe case of "birdcage rot"* that effectively turns it into a parts car. Buy any one of these and I can nearly guarantee you will immediately or soon face thousands in repair bills due to a relatively minor (at first) problem that entails the complete reworking of a major system in the vein of, "We really need to do all of this while we're in here and if you don't it will soon cost you even more." You're taking a real crap shoot buying one of these

3) Those in the 12k - 15k or so range should DEFINITELY be in fair to good mechanical and cosmetic shape. If you find one you seem to like and given your admitted limited mechanical experience I suggest that you drop a couple C-notes for an EXPERIENCED Corvette mechanic to take to their shop, thoroughly inspect and honestly inform you of current problems, those likely to arrive soon, systems in need of refurbishment and reasonable estimates of the cost to address such. Tell the seller what you intend to do. If they refuse, WALK! If it's a car well away from you do some checking to find someone in that area who can make that sort of inspection.

4) Those above 16k or so should look and drive VERY well. You should be rather amazed at the appearance, handling, braking and engine performance for such an old car to the point you consider it better than low-mileage mid-range rental. The interior, engine compartment and underbody should all be very clean with only surface rust underneath and no evidence that the engine compartment/frame were recently and poorly sprayed with black paint. In that vein do some searching about the appearance of an original engine compartment with the factory "black out." You cannot though be extremely picky about the paint job under close inspection. I still suggest a paid inspection like I mentioned above with the seller truly blessing such because they know it will no current and few likely to occur problems. In this price range ALL of the rubber suspension bushings and every every suspension/steering "wear" item MUST have been PROPERLY replaced and still be in very good to new condition!

*Regarding "birdcage rust/rot" I suggest you do some searching as this is the number one thing that will turn even an otherwise good C3 into a parts car! Proper inspection for such involves removing some interior trim pieces and any seller who refuses such is automatically suspect in the possible exception of a car so utterly clean that the underbody, engine compartment and interior look so amazing that you can understand why the owner would refuse removal of anything by any but an excellent mechanic known to them while they watch. In that vein I suspect that such a seller in that price range would have already removed those pieces for inspection by any prospective buyer or have photos with utterly nothing about them to suspect their authenticity.

Sorry for all of the "stream of consciousness" typos in the above. I had to stop for an important business matter and posted before making even a glancing proof. I've left as is.

Last edited by SwampeastMike; Sep 15, 2020 at 10:49 PM.
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Old Sep 15, 2020 | 10:25 PM
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VEry nice writeup above and damn accurate to my experience..
by op comments,,,
and a trusted mechanic with reasonable friend rates..

option 3..no structural birdcage or collision...spend with mechanic suspension brakes, duals, tuning..
stay 78-79 ( they made a lot and everything workable) 4 sp if possible..l82 if possible options...more importantly what you like and grabs you!

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Old Sep 15, 2020 | 11:25 PM
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Originally Posted by interpon
VEry nice writeup above and damn accurate to my experience..
by op comments,,,
and a trusted mechanic with reasonable friend rates..

option 3..no structural birdcage or collision...spend with mechanic suspension brakes, duals, tuning..
stay 78-79 ( they made a lot and everything workable) 4 sp if possible..l82 if possible options...more importantly what you like and grabs you!
Thanks for the kind words interpon.

I'm new to the C3 "hobby" and have only ever owned one--my present '79 that was given to me by the wife who bought it at an auction after the accidental death of the owner. It was at the border of the 3-6k and 7-11k ranges I described that cost a couple thousand to get inspected and licensed. It looked quite good, had low miles and was in mainly original condition save a true dual stainless steel exhaust obviously changed many years before. It's, automatic L82 Gymkhana suspension with all options save the bolt-on spoilers and trailer towing package. One-by-one nearly every system in the car has required overhaul which more than anything requires replacing ALL rubber or rubber like parts or assemblies that contain them. I did nearly all of the work myself (mainly enjoying it) save the suspension problem that resulted in over 8k of labor (not counting parts that I supplied) to rework the full suspension and steering systems save the trailing arm bushings and bearings that I had to let wait as that's yet another big bill for labor and there is no sign play (yet) but I'm sure it won't be too long in coming... I was not comfortable with and lack the proper tools and experience to do extensive suspension work myself. I now consider it firmly in the middle of that 12k-15k group but have zero desire or intent to sell until I get a lot more use as it is now truly fun to drive, handles/performs better than many new cars and even to my C3 Corvette fan mechanic handles, runs and sounds better than most he touches to include '69 the currently uses as his daily driver which of course has a new and flawless paint job of the sort I cannot afford unless I did all of the prep work myself. Things have improved amazingly with every system overhaul as I've reported here. Granted I wish I could get rid of the obnoxious pops and rattles from the glass T-tops but such is just the nature of the beast and they're rarely installed while I drive it. I hate to imagine the labor bills had I had everything done in a shop!
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Old Sep 16, 2020 | 12:06 AM
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To the OP:

I was interrupted for hours before having time to mention the last thing I consider important, modifications.

There are lots of significantly modified examples out there. The quality, tastefulness and utility of such modifications vary insanely!

Glitz like chrome engine accessories have zero bearing on anything that truly matters. '78 L82 and all '79 - '81 engines have a truly excellent dual snorkel air intake system that should be present and well maintained in any example intended for street use. If it has been removed and replaced with chrome things or a modern "cold air intake" that draws all of the air from the engine compartment you can be assured that whoever did such modification was clueless regarding air intake design and likely made other boneheaded modifications as well. Similarly the stock braking, suspension and steering systems in fully working and maintained condition were excellent in their day and still very good today. That said a fiberglass monospring in the rear will significantly increase ride comfort with the standard (not Gymkhana) suspension. (Sorry if I offend some with this but I stand by the words.) Headers are very much a love-hate thing. The cast-iron "ram's horn" exhaust manifolds are nearly everlasting and significantly better than what came on most cars of the era. The stainless steel exhaust manifolds in the '81+ are much lighter, similarly long lasting and even better flowing to boot.

While I don't do really deep engine or suspension work on any car I do most of the maintenance on all of our vehicles. Frankly I GREATLY appreciate being able to go to factory service/maintenance manuals to find things assembled exactly in that manner. My mechanic who did all of the suspension work said, "You've made my job easy!" when I gave him boxes of Delco "professional" parts for everyplace they were available and the best quality new (not remanufactured) "original fit" where they weren't.

Last edited by SwampeastMike; Sep 16, 2020 at 12:12 AM.
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Old Sep 16, 2020 | 12:48 AM
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Originally Posted by SwampeastMike

'75-'77 were the "dog" years for performance due to restrictive catalytic converters and further turning/emissions components that robbed power.
The original GM converter of '75 had the same flow rate as a box of frozen peas & the mufflers weren't much better.
One way to help this out is a 2 1/2" dual pipe system with a set of performance mufflers, like Magnaflows.
Do this alone on a '76 like mine & you'll be around the 200hp a base '72 had.
SwampeastMike did a great job covering about everything you need to know. Good luck!

Last edited by SEVNT6; Sep 16, 2020 at 12:50 AM.
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Old Sep 17, 2020 | 01:06 PM
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I personally know of an 80, one owner, never seen rain, low mileage, pristine, which sold for less than $20K. You're not going to find a chrome bumper in the same condition for that price, hence my suggestion the rubber bumper years offer more for the dollar in terms of condition.
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Old Sep 17, 2020 | 04:19 PM
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You can get a completely gone through one for 20k easy. Bushings, suspension brakes etc.
There is a gorgeous 2 tone 80-82? here white/blue for about half that, you may want to consider that one (has centerlines on it). Good buy imo

I bet the crossfire 2 tone cars make come back the next few yrs if they are in proper shape.The 84s which had xfire also have always been hated and couldnt be given away. A very clean maintained one is getting some $ now esp manual cars. Get em while they are cheap.

Last edited by cv67; Sep 17, 2020 at 04:20 PM.
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