Whose yer Daddy :D
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 17,673
Likes: 199
From: Who says "Nothing is impossible" ? I've been doing nothing for years.
I suppose that's one reason a 427 block sells for 5 grand on ebay ? Wasn't even a Corvette block just had the right date code, and we thought the buyer was an idiot 
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 239
Likes: 0
From: Waterford MI
I'm not sure what is more disturbing.
The fact that someone got jobbed for 140 large.
Or that the NCRS actually condones block restamping.
With "original" cars optioned correctly pulling well over $100K, isn't this simply enabling the counterfeiters to repop any car they want?
Even a car like this one with a (ahem) questionable history selling for that number, doesn't this just reinforce a truly documented and historied vehicle selling for even MORE?
Is this endorsement simply self serving for the NCRS in the end?
I gotta go get me some of those NCRS stickers.....
The fact that someone got jobbed for 140 large.
Or that the NCRS actually condones block restamping.
With "original" cars optioned correctly pulling well over $100K, isn't this simply enabling the counterfeiters to repop any car they want?
Even a car like this one with a (ahem) questionable history selling for that number, doesn't this just reinforce a truly documented and historied vehicle selling for even MORE?
Is this endorsement simply self serving for the NCRS in the end?
I gotta go get me some of those NCRS stickers.....
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 26,545
Likes: 46
From: Huntersville NC
We all know that 427/435 cars are manufactured. We joke about it all the time. It is just interesting and unusual to catch one so openly that was sold on national TV! 
Similarly 1 or 2 years ago a bigblock vette went for large $$ at BJ auction and based on the vin it was clearly too early to be a real 1965 (I think) 425 hp car. Even the Proteam website had a comment about that one.
The only truly fraudulent thing I see about this totally fake car is the tank sticker. If a restoration means taking a car entirely apart and putting it back together and it is permissible to use reproduction parts, why stop at using new bumpers, and wheels, and tires, and glass, and trim, and emblems..... hey let's use 427 emblems, and carpet (hey, let's use a different color) and paint (I prefer black vs yellow). I am very nearly to the point that I don't care anymore. Any restored car is a restored car to me. It doesn't matter what it used to be. It is what it is.... and I dont trust ANY of them!!
Similarly 1 or 2 years ago a bigblock vette went for large $$ at BJ auction and based on the vin it was clearly too early to be a real 1965 (I think) 425 hp car. Even the Proteam website had a comment about that one. The only truly fraudulent thing I see about this totally fake car is the tank sticker. If a restoration means taking a car entirely apart and putting it back together and it is permissible to use reproduction parts, why stop at using new bumpers, and wheels, and tires, and glass, and trim, and emblems..... hey let's use 427 emblems, and carpet (hey, let's use a different color) and paint (I prefer black vs yellow). I am very nearly to the point that I don't care anymore. Any restored car is a restored car to me. It doesn't matter what it used to be. It is what it is.... and I dont trust ANY of them!!
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 40,338
Likes: 786
From: Redondo Beach, California
Another thought:
In Nov-Dec 2003 we read that VIN...802 was a body damaged small block with an incorrect engine. In Nov 2004 the barrett-jackson auction offer VIN....802 appearing as an immaculate seemingly correct and very rare 427/435.
That's not much time to create such a make-over expecially when the 427/435 is going to require a lot of hard to find parts and once found there's a lot of time required to restore them...and so many other consumers of time.
Is it possible that the "427/435" really was in existance as another car and the VIN tag of the real VIN...802 was simply exchanged
???? That would help understand how such a dramatic transformation could appear to have happened in less than a year.
In Nov-Dec 2003 we read that VIN...802 was a body damaged small block with an incorrect engine. In Nov 2004 the barrett-jackson auction offer VIN....802 appearing as an immaculate seemingly correct and very rare 427/435.
That's not much time to create such a make-over expecially when the 427/435 is going to require a lot of hard to find parts and once found there's a lot of time required to restore them...and so many other consumers of time.
Is it possible that the "427/435" really was in existance as another car and the VIN tag of the real VIN...802 was simply exchanged
???? That would help understand how such a dramatic transformation could appear to have happened in less than a year.
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Instructor
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 162
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by paul67
I wonder how a reproduction tank sticker can be aged to appear real.
Or, maybe I'm just too trusting?
Instructor
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 162
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by paul67
Rick,
That was the genesis of my question: the possibility of a typo leading to the current fuss.
That was the genesis of my question: the possibility of a typo leading to the current fuss.
You're also right in that it sure has caused quite a fuss...assuming it was just a typo.
I like the fact that my block, trans, tank sticker, etc. all have numbers that match (well, at least I think), but I'm starting to think it's kinda silly after watching this thread.
...ok, no I don't, I still like my matching numbers.
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 26,545
Likes: 46
From: Huntersville NC
Originally Posted by kens 80
Don't you watch overhaulin, they do a whole car over in a week. But I agree it sounds like either a VIN swap or an error in posting the correct VIN'S
And if you want Kevin's cell phone number, I have that issue of the Driveline. It is a Colorado number.... maybe Lars knows him. It would be interesting to know who he sold it to...
Here is the picture from the BJ auction website.... something about that background looks familiar.... I wonder who the seller was??
Last edited by PRNDL; Feb 8, 2005 at 03:08 PM.
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,547
Likes: 12
From: Carbondale Pa.
Wanna Buy A Bridge
Hey, anyone here want to buy a bridge, for sale cheap, it connects Brooklyn to Manhatten. A typo in the vin. #, possible, not probable. Peace, Craig
P.S. Hey Doc, what hockey season, maybe club hockey , sure wasnt NHL.
P.S. Hey Doc, what hockey season, maybe club hockey , sure wasnt NHL.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 21,440
Likes: 459
From: Massillon,Ohio USA
2020 C3 of the Year Finalist - Unmodified
Cruise-In VI Veteran
St. Jude Donor '08-'09-'10-'11-'12
Originally Posted by NHvette
"Numbers Matching" is allowed to use a correct date-coded block and re-stamp the VIN.
This is acceptable to NCRS rules.
This is acceptable to NCRS rules.
per NCRS rules. 
Race Director
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 15,892
Likes: 42
Originally Posted by mongo6901
I'm not sure what is more disturbing.
The fact that someone got jobbed for 140 large.
Or that the NCRS actually condones block restamping.
With "original" cars optioned correctly pulling well over $100K, isn't this simply enabling the counterfeiters to repop any car they want?
Even a car like this one with a (ahem) questionable history selling for that number, doesn't this just reinforce a truly documented and historied vehicle selling for even MORE?
Is this endorsement simply self serving for the NCRS in the end?
I gotta go get me some of those NCRS stickers.....
The fact that someone got jobbed for 140 large.
Or that the NCRS actually condones block restamping.
With "original" cars optioned correctly pulling well over $100K, isn't this simply enabling the counterfeiters to repop any car they want?
Even a car like this one with a (ahem) questionable history selling for that number, doesn't this just reinforce a truly documented and historied vehicle selling for even MORE?
Is this endorsement simply self serving for the NCRS in the end?
I gotta go get me some of those NCRS stickers.....
It was a prominent NCRS member that brought the information forward that this car is a forgery.
This car has not been judged at an NCRS event since it's 'magical' transformation and I doubt it would do well given the extent of the forgery.
While NCRS does not penalize restoration motors (ie restamping a correct big block - for a big block car) It is very much against forgeries like this one. Read up on the subject a little please.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 7,831
Likes: 5
From: Austin TX
Originally Posted by PRND21
Here is the picture from the BJ auction website.... something about that background looks familiar.... I wonder who the seller was??
I really hope that the GM records come out at some point.
I wonder what that would do to the price of real 425s and 435s at BJ?
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 21,440
Likes: 459
From: Massillon,Ohio USA
2020 C3 of the Year Finalist - Unmodified
Cruise-In VI Veteran
St. Jude Donor '08-'09-'10-'11-'12
"...complete restoration photo album included"
Hmmmmmnnnnnnnnnn...wonder if this includes pics of teh smallblock coming "out"
Hmmmmmnnnnnnnnnn...wonder if this includes pics of teh smallblock coming "out"
Drifting
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,987
Likes: 3
From: Manchester, Dead Center in the Middle of TN 25 miles to Jack Daniels,10 miles to Geo Dickle, and .8 mile from the Liquor Store at I-24 Exit 114
St. Jude Donor '05
Originally Posted by paul67
I wonder how a reproduction tank sticker can be aged to appear real.
I mentioned this scenerio sometime back during a Not Correctly Restored Corvette thread. I must have been onto something.....j
