Solid LT1

My wife finds it very easy to dump both accelerator pumps of a Holley into a motor and crank it until the battery is completley DEAD! EFI will save my marriage!

msb184

There is no doubt the EFI engine is easier to start, tune etc. On the other hand carbs are much better than just a few yrs. ago.

shafrs3

I was going to use this line of reasoning but use a wagon wheel as the example instead, I guess your more diplomatic than I am.

shafrs3

If your engine needed to last 100K miles and meet emission requirements you might not find it so easy to out run a LS7.

One more benifit, I'm not intimidated by todays OEM EFI.

OzzyTom

come on...

Everyone KNOWS that red is the best !!!

MotorHead

The new LS7 motors in the C6 Z06 are dropping valves into the motor more or less blowing them up on a semi regular basis, check it out on their Z06 forum. It is debatable they will get to 100K with any regularity.

Slap a pair of high flow cats on the 427ci I am building and it would meet emmissions standards in most places.

Tuning a OEM EFI is childs play compared to properly tuning a carb ( I am not talking about changing jets and idle mixure here ) with a wideband, now that really gets complicated

Bullshark

Now you are talking Wayne I knew we would agree eventually

Bullshark

tt 383

i like old school as well. not worth the money. check out c&s billet aerosol carb. i would like to see an engine tuned with this carb and then with efi and see what the real differences are. plus, when you start looking at fuel mpg, it has come down more to cumbustion chamber design/timing and the overdrive trans. efi helps but is a small role. newer shallower chambers have made the engine more effiecent!

WRC7732

...That is friggin hilarious.....!!...

cardo0

Holley models 4010 and 4011 i believe were modern performance carbs. Good boosters, 2 piece with a top hat eliminated the bowl leaks, manual or vacuum sec, square or spreadbore too. Most were shiny alumium bodies but no-one wanted to buy them. They no longer looked like a Holley and it just turned buyers off. Kind'a had the advantages of Carter AFB and Holleys combined - and the Qjet spreadbore too.
I still see them for sale used at swapmeets only but don't know if Holley even supports them with parts at all.

Yea Holley made an improved carb and no-one wanted to change - even with Holleys name on it. Carb lovers wanted a Holley because they understood how they worked and recognized Holleys as they were - not a shiny bastard with a top hat instead of fuel bowls. It takes more than good ideas and a brand name to sell something to hotrod enthusiests and racers too. Well maybe it looked too much like a FORD Autolite carb.

Anyone run a 4010 or 4011?
cardo0

Budman68

Lets see.

24 mpg, idles nice and smooth, starts on the first crank after 3 months, and runs a 12 second quarter mile. This is my second FI conversion and will not be my last. Do I hate carbs, nope they just remind me of old tube radios. They actually work good once they warm up.

jackson

that's right there w/ zwede's bias-tire quip

MotorHead

I actually thought exactly what you guys do about carbs all my life untill I got a LM-1 and met a guy who actually forgot more about carbs than I ever knew. Without his help I would still be trying to figure out how to tune my Race Demon.

If you buy a carb and bolt it on make a few adjustments to the float level, idle mixture screws and jets you are just getting it in the ballpark so the motor will run. You will never get the carb properly dialed in unless you can "see" what is going on with a A/F meter.

What you need to do is monitor the A/F at idle, light load, part throttle, WOT etc. From there you will find yourself drilling power valve channel restrictors ( if needed ) , changing emulsion bleeds, drilling and changing high speed air bleeds, idle air bleeds, jets , power valves etc etc depending on what you are seeing on the A/F meter. It is a very time consuming process but the benefits of a properly tuned carb in the end are worth it. You get the nice idle ( not on mine though with the cam) good off idle response, nice clean crisp throttle response when you get on it and like I have already stated good gas mileage, as I posted above I get over 24mpg with my 550HP 406ci.

SO to sum up for the last time, EFI is hands down better across the board than a non tuned carb, but a properly tuned carb will give up nothing to EFI

Guru_4_hire

You guys make me want to run webers/dellortos.

Now where did I put those.....

chevymans 77

Dead on MotorHead, trying to tune a carb without the correct tools is tuning blindfolded. But with the right tools it can be done correctly and the carb will perform flawlessly. BullShark didn't mean to raise your flag but I would suggest you spend a little time over at the LM-1 web site and do a little reading, very knowledgable tuners over there, alot to learn about carbs and tuning them.

Z-man

I'm with Zwede. My house doesn't have single pane windows, an outhouse, or use coal, although many houses used to. Often times, newer things are better.

One thing that most folks have failed to mention is that the aftermarket EFI systems usually come with a great computer and software. Several of us are running the Holley C950 system. At any time, all sorts of parameters in the engine can be measured and/or adjusted - not just the fuel but the ignition, fans, water temp, system voltage, etc. With a system like this, you know exactly what's happening in the engine at all times if you want. It makes it much easier to tune and trouble shoot when something goes wrong...

noonie

That be the 4010 and 4011 a spreadbore. One of my favorites. Copied from the old Ford Autolite 4100. They do still have power valves.

Billysvette

Yes

Bullshark

Sorry chevyman. I didn't mean to pick you out for the flag. :o It was my general response to the topic and you happened to be convenient. I definitely do appreciate the points that some of you knowledgeable carb guys make, but I have "been there done that" over the years. I am sure I am more of an old timer (but not old school) than almost all of you. I think it is human nature to avoid things we are not knowledgeable or comfortable with, in favor of those things we know. I am sure my background causes me some bias toward electronic FI, because that is what I know best.
One good example of what I am talking about is a problem I am dealing with right now. I just purchased a "brand new" Holley original, correct replacement, List 4555 carb for the 70 LT-1. $600 by the way Everything setup per factory right out of the box....I checked all the accessible stuff I installed it per original configuration replacing a perfectly good after market Holley 3310. I now have an off idle hesitation and an even more touchy startup. It's not timing, distributor, vacuum, accel pump/nozzle etc. cause I checked all the easy stuff and it all worked fine with the 3310. I know I will be able to eventually figure it out, but if I had EFI, It would have been solved in a heartbeat. I have pigeon holed it in favor of finishing the installation of a sequential Accel DFI system on RamJet. I know some of you guys won't agree, but when I am done, it will out perform anything I (or anyone else) could have done with a carb. It's been fun, but you guys finally wore me out

Peace
Bullshark

shafrs3

EFI has been a huge improvement over carburetor, I have been around long enough to remember the carbureted vehicles myself and family/friends have owned in the past and the drivability problems carburetors have caused. I can remember buying my first EFI equipped truck, a 1990 Chevy extended cab, and enjoying the way it performed and it's unbelievable 18 mpg highway economy. At the time I couldn't believe that much improvement was possible. The prior truck was a 1980 K10 that was getting 11 mpg hwy. I like EFI's ability to enable a engine to start right up from a cold start and run perfectly until the time it's shut off, and if something go awry, it's ability to help pinpoint the problem, I would never want to return to a carb. Sorry if this offends anyone but this has been the observations of myself and nearly anyone I've talked to on this subject over the years. EFI, along with the modern overdrive transmission and the catalytic converter have done more to clean up the air, improve the fuel mileage and the longevity of our cars than anything else.