2004R Shift points
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 159
Likes: 0
From: American Canyon Ca
2004R Shift points
I have a level 2 Bowtie 2004r transmission. It shifts at 3000rpm. My Comp cam HR288 just starts kicking in then. Can I change the governor from a Grand National or Monty SS 2004r, Or just grind some weight off the governor thats in there. Thanks
Team Owner
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 37,637
Likes: 3,114
From: Crossville TN
You should be asking this question to the supplier of the transmission. You should have been able to specify the shift points at WOT when you bought it. Shifting at 3000 with WOT is ridiculous and the transmission shop should be asked to make good. On the other hand, if you did the work yourself, you will have to learn the correct way to set the shift points. I don't believe the changing or modifying the governor [alone] will fix your problem.
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 65,492
Likes: 230
From: Orange Park Florida
Under what kind of throttle is that 3k upshift?? WOT or part...
my tranny I rebuilt myself upshifts at 2500-3000 rpm in everyday street driving, with heavy throttle being higher of course....I have not pulled any WOT runs with it yet....traffic and no room...
I suspect I need grind weight off the governor also...but hate to pull the pan for that again....maybe later this summer....
my tranny I rebuilt myself upshifts at 2500-3000 rpm in everyday street driving, with heavy throttle being higher of course....I have not pulled any WOT runs with it yet....traffic and no room...
I suspect I need grind weight off the governor also...but hate to pull the pan for that again....maybe later this summer....
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 182,997
Likes: 88
From: Lakeland, FL
Cruise-In IV-V-VI-VII-VIII Veteran
St. Jude Donor '03, '06, '17
you can change the governor spring.. There are many different springs available. Order a few different springs and play with it. A GN governor with the GN spring will shift at about 4500 - 5000 RPM depending how much power your engine has..
I modified my governor to shift at 6200 RPM..
HOWEVER, modifying or changing the governor WILL AFFECT PART THROTTLE SHIFT POINTS TOO!!!
BTW - non GN governors have 2 springs and GN governors have 1 spring only!!
I'd also recommend welding a little pin at the spring mount so that the spring can't pop out.. That's a common problem with TH200R4's.. I had this problem and had a pin welded in to prevent the governor spring from popping out..
If your shift points are at 3500 RPM, your TV cable might not be adjusted correctly.. Make sure that the cable is FULLY pulled out (or at least within 1/8 inch of fully pulled out ) at WOT!! The farther the cable is pulled out at WOT, the higher your shift points!
I modified my governor to shift at 6200 RPM..
HOWEVER, modifying or changing the governor WILL AFFECT PART THROTTLE SHIFT POINTS TOO!!!
BTW - non GN governors have 2 springs and GN governors have 1 spring only!!
I'd also recommend welding a little pin at the spring mount so that the spring can't pop out.. That's a common problem with TH200R4's.. I had this problem and had a pin welded in to prevent the governor spring from popping out..
If your shift points are at 3500 RPM, your TV cable might not be adjusted correctly.. Make sure that the cable is FULLY pulled out (or at least within 1/8 inch of fully pulled out ) at WOT!! The farther the cable is pulled out at WOT, the higher your shift points!
Last edited by GrandSportC3; May 14, 2007 at 02:27 PM.
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 212
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From: Woodland Park Colorado
My question is did you call in all the stuff they want to know about the transmission for the warrenty. I read that you have to record all those shift points at wot for there warrenty to take effect along with all the pressure reading. At that point you would know if thats normal for there transmission or not. I also ordered there level 2 transmission and should receive this week. I want it to shift early at part throttle for gas milage and given the amount of torq my motor has it wont be a problem but at wot 5000-5500 would be nice. Not sure what to expect myself. Hope you get it sorted out I would call them and ask to see if its all adjusted right. My understanding is your warrenty is void if you drive it before calling in the pressure readings on the 1st part of there tests they want you to perform ,no exceptions so they say.
Goos luck
Goos luck
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 212
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From: Woodland Park Colorado
Also can you tell me are you happy with how the rest of the transmission performs like shift quality,kick down,overdrive any other info would be great its driving me nuts not being able to drive my car with all the nice weather we have been having. Its been a long wait getting a transmission from them, going on 3 weeks now. Had I known that I might have paid more and went with someone else there already taking longer then they said it would.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 159
Likes: 0
From: American Canyon Ca
As a daily driver,Transmission works great. The Bowtie transmission level 2 is a beefed up tranny but I dont think they upgrade the servo,governor, valvebody like a GN 200r4. Shift quality could be harder and at a higher rpm. 2100rpm at 70 mph, 3:70 rear end. Just would like it to shift at higher rpm. Thanks GrandSportC3, I'll fiddle with the springs or may just get the GN governor.
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Racer
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 457
Likes: 1
From: Royal Oak Michigan
1980 L48 2004R
Not sure if this is the same problem- but when I finished my 2004R install from a TH350 I had my little engine shifting way to high also. It turned out that I did not have my TV cable set up right at the carburator. Once I adjusted that it came down to where I wanted it for my car.
Darrel1
Not sure if this is the same problem- but when I finished my 2004R install from a TH350 I had my little engine shifting way to high also. It turned out that I did not have my TV cable set up right at the carburator. Once I adjusted that it came down to where I wanted it for my car.
Darrel1
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 212
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From: Woodland Park Colorado
Thanks for the more info. Ill have them on the phone this week and ask. There ad on the level 2 states reprogrammed for more aggressive shift timing so wot and shifting at 3000 rpm just dont sound right but like you I didnt ask, guess I have to plan on doing some of my own tuning. Maybe more will chime in that are ruuning the same transmission and stat what wot shift point they have. I installed there tv system and there is a adjustment on that do you have the same tv system and have you adjusted it and noticed any change in the shift points?
Best Regards
Best Regards
Racer
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 457
Likes: 1
From: Royal Oak Michigan
Thanks for the more info. Ill have them on the phone this week and ask. There ad on the level 2 states reprogrammed for more aggressive shift timing so wot and shifting at 3000 rpm just dont sound right but like you I didnt ask, guess I have to plan on doing some of my own tuning. Maybe more will chime in that are ruuning the same transmission and stat what wot shift point they have. I installed there tv system and there is a adjustment on that do you have the same tv system and have you adjusted it and noticed any change in the shift points?
Best Regards
Best Regards
Not sure of the formal names of the parts
1. Loosen the plate or cam (that you installed on the carb) to full clockwise position and tighten set screw.
2. Push in the black button on the TV cable retention bracket and push the rod all the way rearward into into its housing and release the button
3. By hand at the carb move the throttle to WOT- you should see the black rod snap out on its own.
This position is the least aggressive shift position. From here you can adjust the cam and re-do the steps to get the shift points where you want it.
Hope this helps
Darrel1
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,135
Likes: 2
From: Dayton Oh
I have the BTO TV and adjustment system. Here is what they told me to do.
Not sure of the formal names of the parts
1. Loosen the plate or cam (that you installed on the carb) to full clockwise position and tighten set screw.
2. Push in the black button on the TV cable retention bracket and push the rod all the way rearward into into its housing and release the button
3. By hand at the carb move the throttle to WOT- you should see the black rod snap out on its own.
This position is the least aggressive shift position. From here you can adjust the cam and re-do the steps to get the shift points where you want it.
Hope this helps
Darrel1
Not sure of the formal names of the parts
1. Loosen the plate or cam (that you installed on the carb) to full clockwise position and tighten set screw.
2. Push in the black button on the TV cable retention bracket and push the rod all the way rearward into into its housing and release the button
3. By hand at the carb move the throttle to WOT- you should see the black rod snap out on its own.
This position is the least aggressive shift position. From here you can adjust the cam and re-do the steps to get the shift points where you want it.
Hope this helps
Darrel1
except instead of moving the throttle by hand, make sure you're getting full WOT using the gas petal (engine off of course). Then use the gas petal for Darrel1's step 2).My BTO level 3 shifts at @ 6,200 RPM at WOT. I wouldn't think that there would be that big of a difference between level 2 & 3. My tranny shifts @3K under a moderate accelleration.
Racer
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 457
Likes: 1
From: Royal Oak Michigan
except instead of moving the throttle by hand, make sure you're getting full WOT using the gas petal (engine off of course). Then use the gas petal for Darrel1's step 2).My BTO level 3 shifts at @ 6,200 RPM at WOT. I wouldn't think that there would be that big of a difference between level 2 & 3. My tranny shifts @3K under a moderate accelleration.
Darrel1
Team Owner
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 37,637
Likes: 3,114
From: Crossville TN
Any auto transmission can be set to shift at WOT and at light throttle wherever you want it. The methods by which this is done is dependent on the design of the box. If it is not electronic, each range has a shift valve with a spring and/or an adjuster to set the pressure at which the valve shifts. That pressure is also variable with governor pressure and a vacuum modulator or a trottle valve system. Thus, the shift points are set by the governor (and its adjustments), the TV or VM system, and the individual shift valves. You can't simply adjust any one of those and get the system to work correctly. If you have an electronic tranny, the shift points are programmed with a computer system.
You need to call the transmission supplier, tell them about your problem, write down the questions they ask you so that you can test the how the unit behaves and give them that info. That is the only way to solve your problem...unless you have a transmission mechanic/engineer in you hip pocket.
You need to call the transmission supplier, tell them about your problem, write down the questions they ask you so that you can test the how the unit behaves and give them that info. That is the only way to solve your problem...unless you have a transmission mechanic/engineer in you hip pocket.
