Dragon Fire Dizzy Timing?
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 436
Likes: 2
Dragon Fire Dizzy Timing?
I have a dragon fire dizzy on my zz454 and was trying with some help to get it set up correctly yesterday. Basically, it sounds ok at about 30* and 1000 RPM, but anything less than 25* it starts sounding very unstable and "not good." The spec for the ZZ454 says 4* BTDC and 26* total advance at 4000 RPM...the catch being "with GM P/N XXXXX HEI distributor." Obviously I'm not using that distributor, so how different will those numbers be? Does anyone have specific dragon fire numbers or is that not how it works?
Also, I'm guessing the initial timing has to be no more than 10-12*, but I can't even get close to that (I haven't even gone below 20* b/c it starts sounding really crappy). What would cause this?
Also, I'm guessing the initial timing has to be no more than 10-12*, but I can't even get close to that (I haven't even gone below 20* b/c it starts sounding really crappy). What would cause this?
Race Director
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 15,892
Likes: 42
BTW- does this unit have a vacuum advance and are you disconnecting it while doing the timing?
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,456
Likes: 102
From: Piedmont Va
St. Jude Donor '11-'12-'13,'19-'20
I have the dragon fire unit and have no such issues. As Mike Ward suggested make sure your Vac Adv is disconnected. Also if you have a dial back timing light make sure it is set properly for initial timing and that your inductor pick up is securely connected to #1. 
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 436
Likes: 2
Yep, vacuum is disconnected/plugged. I think I'm just going to have a local guy a friend knows do it for me...apparently he is very good/knowledgeable with this stuff. Probably better anyways so I'm not just stabbing in the dark. I'm still just curious as to what is going on.
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 7,739
Likes: 630
From: Unreconstructed, South Carolina
IF ... IF the timing marks & tab are correct & nothing has slipped & it shows TDC only when piston truly at TDC ... IF ... IF all that's AOK ...
Then crappy running anything below 20* initial leads me to suspect the cent advance springs are TOO STIFF ... OR ... the cent advance mechanism is not fully articulating, partially jammed, bound up etc etc.
I understand you disconnected vac advance ... but did you also plug it closed at the carb/intake source?
Then crappy running anything below 20* initial leads me to suspect the cent advance springs are TOO STIFF ... OR ... the cent advance mechanism is not fully articulating, partially jammed, bound up etc etc.
I understand you disconnected vac advance ... but did you also plug it closed at the carb/intake source?
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 5,691
Likes: 12
From: columbus oh
I have a dragon fire dizzy on my zz454 and was trying with some help to get it set up correctly yesterday. Basically, it sounds ok at about 30* and 1000 RPM, but anything less than 25* it starts sounding very unstable and "not good." The spec for the ZZ454 says 4* BTDC and 26* total advance at 4000 RPM...the catch being "with GM P/N XXXXX HEI distributor." Obviously I'm not using that distributor, so how different will those numbers be? Does anyone have specific dragon fire numbers or is that not how it works?
Also, I'm guessing the initial timing has to be no more than 10-12*, but I can't even get close to that (I haven't even gone below 20* b/c it starts sounding really crappy). What would cause this?
Also, I'm guessing the initial timing has to be no more than 10-12*, but I can't even get close to that (I haven't even gone below 20* b/c it starts sounding really crappy). What would cause this?
Tech Contributor
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 14,384
Likes: 6,409
From: At my Bar drinking and wrenching in Lafayette Colorado
The make, brand and type of ignition system is irrelevant to timing spec. Set total timing to 36 degrees and curve the distributor so you get about 18 degrees initial with the 36 total as outlined in the papers I've made available to Forum members for many years.
Lars
V8FastCars@msn.com
Lars
V8FastCars@msn.com
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 436
Likes: 2
that timing figure from gm has been a MISPRINT in the catalogue for many years! even so with the 454ho.......you want to shoot for 36-40 total....your initial will come in itself and weather you choose to run a vac adv or not is your call.....nice engine for the $$.....
Set total timing to 36 degrees and curve the distributor so you get about 18 degrees initial with the 36 total as outlined in the papers I've made available to Forum members for many years.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 436
Likes: 2
In case anyone sees this thread later through a search...my spark plug wires were off by 1 (doh!). We rotated them all one point and bam, worked fine. So for other new guys out there, you may think it's pointing at #1, but it might just be off a bit...at least that's one more thing to consider.
