I know anything is possible. But, how do you know when what you have just isn't worth the time or the money to fix up? I guess this is what separates the men from the boys...I'm just not sure what side of the fence I need to be on.

The reason I ask is, I bought a 1980 L48 - w/auto trans - has about 57,000 (been rebuilt at some point)...is drivable but...
...From a distance, she looks awesome. Up close...she has her issues. Up REAL close (the "up close" I am getting to know now that I have had time to remove panels, trace things down, etc.)...she has been abused and neglected.

When I bought this car (off ebay motors)...it was my first car ever bought off ebay. So, that was probably my first mistake. Not that buying from ebay is a mistake...it is just that I was very naive about the whole thing. Anyway, I wanted an "affordable" Corvette that was 1) a classic, 2) a reliable car I could drive around to/from work and just about anywhere else I wanted to go, 3) and when I've had my initial fun with it, I wanted to make it a project car for my wife and I to work on throughout the years. I bought the car off of a dealership in FL and had it shipped to me here in KY. I wasn't expecting a "mint" car. But, I must say, the photos they took made her look spectacular. In the weeks to come...I had a chance to REALLY look at her in person and see all the flaws she really had. Granted, some of the descriptions were a little off in the listing...but, for the most part, they described her accurately...they just left out a whole lot of info. Info that may have made a difference in whether or not I would have bid on/purchased the Vette.

Anyway, to make a getting long story shorter...I have found several details in and out of the whole car that are leaving me wondering is she really worth sinking that kind of money into to get her in a so-called 'mint' type condition? Basically, do I just go for it (when $$$ permits) and do things the right way from the ground up? OR, am I better off just patching the rough stuff to make her safe and sound and just enjoy driving her...sell her when I can and start with a clean slate? (Now that I am better informed on what to look for in the future)

I know there are a lot of hardcore restorers out there that love the challenge...and of course, the pride of seeing it finished. I'm just afraid that I have bitten off more than I can chew as a first-timer. Not to mention that we are like most Americans right now in these economic times....BROKE! I don't mind putting money into a car when I have the money to do so. And, I don't mind a challenge or two. I just don't want to get into something that I don't have the proper skills to do things the right way...the first (or second) time. I know I'll screw up along the way...trust me, I know "me" better than anyone...it's going to happen. I don't know...maybe I'm just a little overwhelmed with all the work that I KNOW is going to have to happen to make this car "right". It definitely turned out to be more than expected, that is for sure.

Anyway, what are some of your thoughts? What have some of you guys done throughout the years? Have you bought a Vette (or other car) and just decided to NOT put the money or time into fixing it up? Do I just need to suck it up and man up or what?

 

That's great question. As for myself: I live in Switzeland, but that doesn't make a difference when it comes to restoring or not - it's even worse here since parts are so much more expensive and harder to come by.

I'm 48 years old now and owned a few musclecars way back in my 20s and 30s. At that time, I bought cars on a tight budget and always planned to restore them. Truth being, I never did. I even started a project and dropped it after 2 years. Unfortunately I came to realize, that a restoration is a) for people with time AND money and b) I simply lacked the necessary skills.

What's next is the resale value of such a restored Corvette. If it's finished and you want to sell it, will you get your investment back? Hmmm... probably not. Then why do it at all? That's my way of thinking now.

I waited for more than 10 years before I bought my 69. It is not perfect but doesn't need a restoration to look good. I think most experts saying it's better to buy Corvette in good condition from the beginning are right. I paid WAY more than on my previous cars and I'm still spending money on it just to keep it preserved in it's current condition. If I would have to finance a restoration, I would be more than just broke.

Other opinions?

 

This has been hashed before and it's been determined by the group here that the restorer is almost bound to "lose money" and more so the more work he has to farm out.

It's always better (financially) to buy a "done" car at market value, than to restore it with your own time and money. This holds true even for a late 60's red big block bumper vert with AC - let alone an 80's car.

But it's about more than money... and if you don't get the satisfaction of doing something cool and correct - then restoration isn't for you.

I don't ever expect to recover the money put into my 68 vert - not because of resale value (that too) but because I plan to die with it. So I can do it my way... with no guilt... and no financial expectations. -W

 

Hi C3r,
I think the biggest decision to make is whether you're going to work on your car in a way that makes it undrivable for long periods of time ( even years) or are you going to figure out how to get things done while still driving and enjoying the car.
Many people choose each way, and each way is right for different cars and different people. I think you need to make a list of what you need to do to make your car car safe and reliable to drive, see how much time and money that list will entail and decide if you can take that on at this point.
If you can do the work to be able to drive it, that may give you the courage to take on the more difficult and time consuming work you'd like to do.
Good Luck!
Regards,
Alan

 

Great reply Alan.... Ed

 

I have to agree with what's already been said. While you can justify in your mind about spending the money do you REALLY have the time that it takes to complete a major restoration? In most cases for the average family guy who works full time (and in this economy how many hours a week are full time?) you either can't fit it in your schedule or you're too tired when you have the time. Then on top of that do you have the space to do this or is someone's car getting thrown out of the garage? How much skill do you have? I doubt you can paint it yourself. If you can't the paint and body work along can you put you up side down in the project. I know it's easy to say because it's not my money but buy the best car you can for the money and YES buy a done car if it fits in the budget. Good luck with what ever you decide.

 

Do you love this car enough to "marry" it and have it be a mamber of the family too? If yes, read on... if no, then bail before you get any deeper.

OK. There are no more 1980 Corvettes being produced, and you've acquired at least a fair basis for the car you envision having at the end. Having decided to push forward make a list of those things the car requires, starting with the most pressing mechanical repair first. Do not even consider any investment in paint, body work or interior restoration until the car is 100 percent mechanically correct. Please describe the car's current state of repair, your garage and tool facilities and your mechanical aptitude. This will be much easier if you have some previous automotive experience, but is not impossible. With the help of this forum you will likely be able to do more than you think possible by yourself; saving money and learning a new hobby.

 

There is really no reason to have a fully restored car unless that's what you have to have. You said you wanted an older classic car, and the vette fits that bill. The 80's C3's are a little while away from drawing the real collector money, so just the paint job will probably put you over the top as far as investment return. A full restore(or even good partial) will deffinatly cost more than it will be worth for quite a while.

I agree with Alan. Start small!!!! If the frame and motor are sound, there is no reason to go overboard. Everyone wants their cars to be show pieces, but for a driver like you want, it's not always the way to go.

Look for rainy weekend projects(assuming you have a garage). There are a ton of things you can do that don't cost much money, and will help you know the car better if you decide to go further.

First...clean everything you can reach. Take it to someone that does steam cleaning and have the engine and undercarrage done. It's much nicer to work on a clean car that one that's caked with gunk everywhere.

Check the brakes, change the fluids, just make sure all the major stuff is in good shape.

After that chose what you do very carfully if you want to keep driving it and stick to that one thing you choose....I'm know more than one of us has started a weekend project that grew out of control and turned into a year of weekends.

For now, just get it running well, and have fun, you'll figure out the rest as you go.

 

There can be tremendous satisfaction in seeing the fruits of your own labor. Look at the car as a hobby and learning experience, not as an investment. Given your financial situation, I would NOT recommend starting a restoration at this time. I was told to try and keep mine operable for a while, just clean and drive it to see if I really liked old vettes...and I found the answer was a big yes. My 15 year old Harley and my 24 year old boat have been sitting mostly idle for the last 6 years. When my clutch broke last year, I couldn't drive the car anymore. Then I decided to attack all the other mechanical issues at the same time. The "while I'm at its" are another story. In the future, I see many periods of driving fun ahead, followed by months of hard work and more money...lots of money. Mix it up so you don't become discouraged and lose interest.

 

C3Rocket...
I would propose that the biggest issue you are facing is the paradigm you have about "restoration". It appears that you equate restoration with the amount of money spent to return the car to 'like-new" status. That paradigm is borne out of the belief that to restore a vehicle properly, you have to buy brand new parts. That paradigm is not accurate; in fact, I believe that concept to be in error.
I bought my '71 coupe from a family that had the car in their possession for over 30 years, and 3 generation had their turn driving it. When I looked at it, the interior was "all original" but totally worn out. It still had the original carpeting in place. Many folks would have removed all of the interior and replaced it with new parts for several thousand dollars.
My view of the car was different. I saw a 'diamond in the rough'. A car that I could put my labor into for as little money as possible; yet bring it back to 'like new' condition by refurbishing everything possible. The interior was completely stripped. All parts were cleaned, patched, repaired as necessary and given a new coat of SEM vinyl dye. Several interior parts were only cleaned and left in the 35+ year-old condition because they were still in good [undamaged] condition. The dash cap, the dash panels, the lower console were all reinstalled after cleaning and receiving a coat of "Nu-Vinyl" polymer protectant. The seat covers were refurbished by taking them off, removing any residual dried up foam "dust" and re-stuffing the channels with new scrim foam. The door panels were damaged, but I reskinned them with new vinyl covering for about $60 and one helluva lot of trouble. The carpeting was replaced, of course; and the storage compartment door trims were replaced because of being broken. But other than that, the only part replaced was the e-brake housing...because I couldn't find all of the pieces from the top being broken out.
My total expenditure for refurbishing the interior is about $600, and nearly half of that was the carpeting. It took a lot of thinking about how to do this work, but it was well worth it. The interior looks new...but it still retains most of its original pieces. And that fact is a great subject to discuss with other Corvette folks that stop to see the car. When they hear that the car has over 200,000 miles on it, still has the original drivetrain and most of the interior parts are the original pieces, they really get interested.
The engine compartment is similar. I rebuilt every accessory device in the engine compartment rather than replace them. It was very inexpensive, I got to disassemble and learn how these devices worked, and rebuilt the original components back to new operating condition for the 'expense' of removal, cleaning [usually a PITA..but necessary], replacing only the wear-parts, painting, and reassembly.
My point: You don't have to spend enormous amounts of money to get your car looking good. You just have to enjoy the task of good research on what you intend to do, labor to do the work, and a little money for replacing only those things that actually wear out. A myriad of spray paints is one of the largest expenses I had; and that is important so that the parts will look correct and stay looking correct for a long time.
Think about what you are trying to achieve with your car and what parts of repair/refurbishing/restoring you really enjoy. Go with the stuff you enjoy. Put a plan together, dig in, and don't look back.

P.S. My car took top honors at the AACA Mid-Tennessee Regional meet last year with 19 competitors from '63 to present. It can be done!!

 

7T1vette makes a great point Look for the "elbow grease" solution rather than just throw money at it. Save the $$$ for things that must be replaced (tires, hoses,brakes..ect). For most serious collectors, a so-so original part is WAY more desirable than a non-original replacement that looks brand new.

 

Continue to follow your game plan and drive this car.

You must take care of the safety issues first.

Brakes are #1 priority! Followed by tires.

Any other breakdown issues can be dealt with as needed. After driving it for a period of time and evaluating what needs to be done; you will be in a good position to determine if a restoration is the way to go. In the mean time, enjoy the ride!

 

well heres my 2 cents. it all depends on how much you spent vs what is wrong with the vehicle. then what the vehicle is going to be worth. i would spend the money on a resto for a daily driver it would be a sunday car. but i am currently restoring a second 79 i just bought and its worht every penny, but i got the car for $2k with no major mechanical issues i needed to do a brake line and all the interriror was brand new all it needed is paint and that was quoted at another $2k for original white so i will be into the vehicle for a little over 4k and she is worth way more then $4k

 

Thank you ALL for the comments and inspiration. Although, a complete and full restoration would be a project I would love to do...I just don't think it is going to happen in my lifetime due to expense needed to retore my particular car back to it's original-like state when it drove out of the plant. It would be nice, but it's not going to happen. With that said, I am going to take it one day at a time...or rather, one project at a time. Piece-by-piece, I will create a head-turner that both my wife and I can enjoy for the years to come.

As for my skill level...I am very apt at auto mechanics. That's not an issue. Body work with steel, I'm "ok" at...but, fiberglass...somewhat clueless. What I don't know...I have no problem learning. I definitely have plenty of references to refer to...ALL of you As of right now, we live in a duplex and the Vette sits under a carport. When it's all you have...it's all you have. So, it isn't like I have a garage to let it set in while I tear everything apart. Weather is not my friend...especially since I don't have a cover for her yet.

Anyway, I think the biggest thing for me now is picking my projects in the proper order. There are so many that need attention. Some will require a bit of money...others, not so much. I know the first steps will be to get everything mechanically and electrically sound. As I said before, she was abused and neglected. You should see all the zip-ties holding things in place. There are parts missing, that until I started researching, didn't know they were supposed to be there in the first place. So yeah, I guess I have to sit down and make a plan and then go from there.

Again, Thank You...and be looking to hear from me a lot on here!

 

Ruh Roh! Zip Ties?

Sounds like Bubba might have owned that very car before you did. Check ALL the safety stuff twice over. Ol' Bubba is well known for unsafe "field repairs" that stay that way forever.

-W

 

Well, it did come from Florida (no disrespect to the fine citizens of FL) but I am with ya on the Bubba comment. There are a few "Bubba's" in FL...and in KY. And I sure they are in other parts of the country, as well. So yeah, I'll be checking everything.

Some fine examples of the Bubba'ness, the vacuum actuator relay valves are not mounted, they are zip tied together and hanging loose (sorta) in front of the radiator. They are zipped down to the frame so they down't fall out onto the road. I haven't been able to get up under there and check to see if mounting holes are stripped or if they were just too lazy to put them back where they belong. I'm sure there is something missing preventing their proper mounting...it wouldn't surprize me one bit. The car was repainted...but no body work was done prior. They just painted over chips, scratches, blemishes, etc. The paint looks good for the most part...except at the above mentioned areas. I have a big crack in the center of the hood where they left the stud for the aftermarket air cleaner too high then let the hood slam shut. Some body panels are a little loose due to removal at some point then mounting screws got stripped upon reinstallation. I was driving home one night after work and the headlights went completely dark (dash was still lit and lamps were still in up position). Needless to say, I freaked! So I shut the lights off and then turned them back on. Fortunately, they came back on. And fortunately, we were on a straight stretch of road when it happened. I still haven't figured out what caused that one to happen.

The list goes on and on. But, that's ok...e-v-e-n-t-u-a-l-l-y it will all get fixed It's just frustrating having to go in behind someone and fix all their stupid screw-ups. I get enough of that at work! I find a new hurdle every day I work on it. Regardless, she's a good car and with a little TLC, she'll be worth keeping around for awhile.

 

I have a 74 coupe and when I purchased the car had no real knowledge of mechanics or Corvettes for that matter. All I knew is that I loved them from very early in my childhood.

I purchased the car with little knowledge of what to look for. I got lucky that there were no rust issues, but it did have it's problems. It was very low milage but the gaskets were all dried up making the engine bay look like an oil spill. I drove the car and updated things as I went along, with help from forum members and good knowledgeable people around town.

I replaced the tires, then shocks, researched AC problems etc... With a little bit of research and some of my own time I have fixed many of the issues. I now have the engine pulled and doing a full rebuild replacing all the gaskets. I have a carport and sometimes my neighbors look at me like I'm crazy when I pop my head up out of the engine bay. I'm cleaning every part I can by hand and restoring it.

If you would have asked me years ago if I would ever pull an engine I would have said NO, but I'm doing it you can too!

Good luck!

 

Thank you for your post. I bought my 79 last year and like you once I started digging into the car I noticed a lot more "trouble" than I originally thought. I've come to the conclusion that I over paid for it. But now I realize it's just more learning opportunities. Plus the next Vette I buy, and I will buy one, I will know exactly what to look for.

I agree with a lot of the posters. I knew when I was buying a Vette it wasn't an investment financially. I bought it because they're my favortie style of car... ever!! And I also have always wanted to work on cars. So will I spend more money than what I could get by buying finished? yes. But now I'll be able to say, "yeah... I did that."

 

The first thing you need is space that can be taken up for however long it will take you. Figure it takes 3-4 spaces to do a frame off. Second you need the mechanical abilities. Third the tools. Fourth is desire/passion to see it through. Fifth - None of the first four things are applicable if you do not have the funds.

 

Is the car unique enough to warrant an expensive, and in most, if not almost all cases with few notable exceptions, a significant money losing proposition such as a full or partial restoration ?

It is a 1980 L48 automatic (no offence meant)........not a 1969 L88...........you can buy an equivalent 1980-81 NCRS Top Flight car for about half of what a full restoration will cost in time and/or money. A member here had one for sale a few months ago for $25K, white with black leather and <10K miles, it was NCRS "Top Flight" and virtually like new. So.....including the cost of your car and the planned expenditures, whatever they may be, including your time costed out, do you plan to reach the NCRS "Top Flight" level of completeness for $25K all in ? That is the scenario as I see it.......

If however you want to go thru the experience of performing a restoration yourself, and have lots of time and lots of money, then fill your boots.........and enjoy the ride, you'll be doing then next purchaser of your car a big favor and saving him 50 cents on the dollar when you sell it.