2004-R Swap
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 367
Likes: 7
From: Congupna Victoria
Sorry....just found it.
Was having a guys look
http://www.thepartsbin.com/catalog/?...hift%20control
But that link is for the TH350, 3 speed
I guess it needs to be transmission specific....little help please
Was having a guys look
http://www.thepartsbin.com/catalog/?...hift%20control
But that link is for the TH350, 3 speed
I guess it needs to be transmission specific....little help please
Last edited by puzzigully; Apr 18, 2011 at 11:59 PM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,417
Likes: 336
From: Texas
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 367
Likes: 7
From: Congupna Victoria
Guys,
had a bit more of a think about this and the B&M system is only marginally better than the Lock-up when you get to 4th.
It IS better in terms of unlocking based on speed rather than brake pedal and probably better in that it locks at a predetermined speed, rather than just when it gets to 4th.
BUT
no better in terms of lugging up a hill unless you drop below a certain speed.
The Vacuum switch is probably the best method, but would require a fair bit of trial and error to get right.
had a bit more of a think about this and the B&M system is only marginally better than the Lock-up when you get to 4th.
It IS better in terms of unlocking based on speed rather than brake pedal and probably better in that it locks at a predetermined speed, rather than just when it gets to 4th.
BUT
no better in terms of lugging up a hill unless you drop below a certain speed.
The Vacuum switch is probably the best method, but would require a fair bit of trial and error to get right.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 367
Likes: 7
From: Congupna Victoria
79L48,
I think you're right, I'll go the Brake switch option, then based on how well it does/does not go change to some other way or leave it alone!
GT's 78.
No reason it wouldn't, but you would need to remember to unlock it as you came to a stop. That's why most people suggest using the brake switch - as 99% of the time you need to hit the brakes to stop. (The other 1% involves you hitting something solid WITHOUT hitting the brakes - and the last thing you'd be worried about would be if your torque converter was locked or unlocked )
I think you're right, I'll go the Brake switch option, then based on how well it does/does not go change to some other way or leave it alone!
GT's 78.
No reason it wouldn't, but you would need to remember to unlock it as you came to a stop. That's why most people suggest using the brake switch - as 99% of the time you need to hit the brakes to stop. (The other 1% involves you hitting something solid WITHOUT hitting the brakes - and the last thing you'd be worried about would be if your torque converter was locked or unlocked
)
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Racer
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 259
Likes: 1
From: Mt Airy, NC
Puzzigully,
I guess I'm new to understanding this 200 trans. I was going to go with the manual 5spd but a I am thinking of staying with an automatic because thats what I have now. So help me understand the lock/unlock. Do you have to touch the brake to put the car in 4th gear and touch it again to take it out? How was this done on the cars these tranmissions came out of?
I guess I'm new to understanding this 200 trans. I was going to go with the manual 5spd but a I am thinking of staying with an automatic because thats what I have now. So help me understand the lock/unlock. Do you have to touch the brake to put the car in 4th gear and touch it again to take it out? How was this done on the cars these tranmissions came out of?
Last edited by GT's 78; Apr 20, 2011 at 07:09 AM.
Pro
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 528
Likes: 9
From: Grand Rapids Michigan
GT: No- the car shifts normally up through the gears all the way from a stop to top gear. There is a lockup function that then bypasses the torque converter to eek out a little more mpg when cruising in overdrive. We are talking about the various methods to getting out of lockup without having to floor the gas pedal when you encounter a hill or other high load condition to which overdrive is not suitable. There is a TV cable (which in this case operates like the electronics would in a modern automatic sensing the throttle position and selecting the proper gear) that when properly dialed in should kick the trans down into 3rd, but apparently from some of the feedback it isn't all the way effective.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 367
Likes: 7
From: Congupna Victoria
As far as I can learn, as soon as the 2004R hits 4th gear it goes into "lock up", unless there is some signal to tell it otherwise.
It will only come out of "lock up" under 2 conditions:
1. It gets a signal to tell it to not lock up anymore - it really loses the 12V signal that tells it to "lock", thus it then "un locks"
2. You press on the gas hard enough that it kicks down to 3rd (it knows this via the TV cable that attaches to the carby throttle on one end and the transmission at the other)
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,989
Likes: 198
From: Meriden CT
Yes, I was looking into that system, it seems not as straightforward as it sounds.
The big problem is getting the switch to activate at the right time - that is, at what vacuum pressure does it switch?
there are quite a few variables in that alone, even more complicated if you have camshafts that have increased overlap, thus reducing vacuum. (I don't)
It might be something to add on at a later date if it really does bother me I guess.
As a matter of interest, can you suggest a part number for that switch and where I would plumb it in the system if I was to go that route?
Thanks
The big problem is getting the switch to activate at the right time - that is, at what vacuum pressure does it switch?
there are quite a few variables in that alone, even more complicated if you have camshafts that have increased overlap, thus reducing vacuum. (I don't)
It might be something to add on at a later date if it really does bother me I guess.
As a matter of interest, can you suggest a part number for that switch and where I would plumb it in the system if I was to go that route?
Thanks
I neglected to mention that the TCI converter lockup kit I put in has a vacuum referenced switch that is pre-set, but can be adjusted to your liking. It even comes with the allen key for the adjustment screw. Sorry I failed to tell you that.:bb
Racer
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 259
Likes: 1
From: Mt Airy, NC
OK guys while your at it help me understand the stall on the converter. If you have a 2500rpm stall converter, does that mean when your at a complete stop the car will not move until the rpm's get to 2500?
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,116
Likes: 5
From: Middleburg Florida
Seriously, why not just wire the lock up to a manual switch? It's easy, efficient, cheap and effective. My switch is just above the mirror switch, and under the mirror joy stick on the console. It's easy to get to, and you don't really even notice it unless you're looking for it.
If you forget to unlock the converter, it'll let you know as you slow to a stop, just like a clutch would. As for re-engaging if you need it, well if you don't, it won't hurt anything, you just run a few hundred RPM higher than you have to. As for the TV cable, it has nothing to do with the lock up feature.
If you forget to unlock the converter, it'll let you know as you slow to a stop, just like a clutch would. As for re-engaging if you need it, well if you don't, it won't hurt anything, you just run a few hundred RPM higher than you have to. As for the TV cable, it has nothing to do with the lock up feature.
Pro
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 528
Likes: 9
From: Grand Rapids Michigan
stall speed is the engine RPM level at which the torque converter "locks" and overcomes whatever resistance is present to turn the wheels. This resistance is the weight of the vehicle, combined with any other factors (i.e. if you have the brakes on).
Torque converter stall is a commonly used term and is commonly misunderstood. Stall is the speed at which the converter will hold the engine speed and not allow further gain (i.e., the engine "stalls").
I believe the second one is more correct.
Racer
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 259
Likes: 1
From: Mt Airy, NC
I can understand why you would want to have the trans engage at a higher rpm if you were drag racing, but for street driving would'nt it kinda be like dumping the clutch at every red light?? Will you hurt the trans or the engine if you have a 400hp motor with a low stall converter?
Race Director
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 12,065
Likes: 2
From: Smalltownville Michigan
Cruise-In 5, 6 & 10 Veteran
St. Jude Donor '09
I went the 700r4 route. I used the TCI lockup kit for the harness. straight forward and easy to set up. Pay attention to Bowtie Overdrives! they know their stuff!
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 367
Likes: 7
From: Congupna Victoria
Right now they have a promotion where you get a "free"stall converter.
I opted for as complete a kit as possible including the bits to convert the console and shifter to 1-2-3-4 from 1-2-3.
As I'm keep the Engine stock I also went for the base (or Level 1) transmission.
The Quote was for the following:
- Transmission 2004R Level1
- Torque Converter (2,200rpm)
- Crossmember including transmission mount
- Shifter kit
- Inspection cover
- Dipstick
- TV System
- TCC Wiring kit
- Speedometer Gears
- Installation kit
- Crate fee
The freight to a colleague in California was going to be $120 - but I passed on that.
Their cost to ship to me here in Oz was silly $$, so I'm chasing up a quote from a company that does a lot of importing for my Company - should be at least reasonable.
I reckon I can get it landed here in Oz for about $2,500 after all the fees/taxes/duty etc.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 367
Likes: 7
From: Congupna Victoria
Guys,
just drove the Vette for a 4 hour round trip over easter (2 hours there, 2 hours back), almost all highway driving.
Set Cruise control for 70mph, tacho was reading a touch over 4,000rpm.
Total travel distance was 264miles and used 17.4gallons, which works out to 15.2 miles/gallon. (6.4km/litre for us Aussies)
Not a total disaster, but I'm sure with a 0.67 overdrive and the corresponding drop in rpm (probably just over 2,500rpm) the fuel economy would've been better.
But then, I'm not thinking about doing this for fuel economy - more to keep the revs to a reasonable level and preserve the engine.
just drove the Vette for a 4 hour round trip over easter (2 hours there, 2 hours back), almost all highway driving.
Set Cruise control for 70mph, tacho was reading a touch over 4,000rpm.
Total travel distance was 264miles and used 17.4gallons, which works out to 15.2 miles/gallon. (6.4km/litre for us Aussies)
Not a total disaster, but I'm sure with a 0.67 overdrive and the corresponding drop in rpm (probably just over 2,500rpm) the fuel economy would've been better.
But then, I'm not thinking about doing this for fuel economy - more to keep the revs to a reasonable level and preserve the engine.