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Old Aug 9, 2013 | 06:22 PM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by bigvette1
Super points and very good explaination. I have been running a 10-30w Castrol for the last oil change. I have not added a separate ZDDP additive but and I do run a flat tappet cam. Probably already am well on the way to a wiped lobe. Saw a post on in the General section on oils with the ZDDP that protect.
I need to pay closer attention to the engine rpm's and the pressure as I see too much pressure does not equate to better lubing. thx
Read a recent thread on this forum, by a member who seems to make a bunch of sense, that ZDDP additive is not required for modern oils. Because ZDDP contaminates the catalytic converters, the additive package in the motor oil has been adjusted away from ZDDP. The new oils get their extreme pressure lubrication qualities via different compounds. The film strength and wear resistance of the new oils will not cause any problems with old engines.
Not only that, but this engineer's testing found that adding a ZDDP additive to modern "SN" oils makes them perform worse, not better.

Last edited by gcusmano74; Aug 9, 2013 at 06:24 PM.
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Old Aug 9, 2013 | 07:17 PM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by Belgian1979vette
how do you calibrate an oil gauge ?
The process I used was this:
  • Removed the gauge from the car
  • Charged an air tank to 35 PSI. Checked it with 2 tire pressure gauges to make sure it was 35 PSI
  • Hooked the tank to the gauge using a rubber hose and clamp.
  • Adjusted gauge by bending the little U-shaped brass part that connects to the needle movement
  • Repeated with other pressures, like 15 PSI, 50, 70. It was fine there.
  • Made sure it went to zero with pressure removed.

My experience was that the range was fine, meaning once I had it reading right at one pressure, other pressures were correct also. My problem was it was off about 30 PSI across the range. YMMV.
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Old Aug 9, 2013 | 09:09 PM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by Belgian1979vette
I'll probably get scrutinized over this, but a couple observations on my part about oil bypass in the pump :
- its a progressive valve meaning that the pressure at which it opens depends largely on the oil viscosity.
- a bypass helps to prevent pump cavitation since it puts the inlet pressure above vacuum preventing vapor bubbles in the pump that will implode in the pressure side of the pump.

Never, ever have a pump bypass to the pan or you will loose that effect.
FWIW, my submerged pump setup (recently discussed elsewhere) came with anti-cavitation slots, per Bill Jenkins' "pressure balance" mod, and an enlarged bypass area, both of which can be examined here. These aren't exactly new ideas, but are apparently less than common knowledge. No flames, just food for thought...



Oh, and a filter bypass will open more often with unnecessarily high pressures, circulating unfiltered oil thru the lubricating system. So, definitely watch out for over-filtration at the cost of restriction in truly high-perf applications. There's more to proper filtering than just the micron ratings.

Last edited by TheSkunkWorks; Aug 9, 2013 at 09:15 PM.
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Old Aug 10, 2013 | 06:08 AM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by bigvette1
I have a 454 with a Melling High Volumn oil pump. When you start the beast it has between 60-70psi on the gauge at 1500 rpm. When it is totally warm and been running for a while it reads maybe <20 psi at idle. If you rev the engine to say 2500 - 3000 the pressure goes to 35 psi. Is this normal for a very low reading at idle? Or am I looking at big time trouble coming? Thanks
Melling makes several HV pumps. In the Select Series, they have !0% or 25% volume increase.
Oil viscosity will alter pressure slightly.
Off hand, it sounds like you have a bit of wear in the engine, but nothing to worry about.
Your running coolant temps will also affect the pressure slightly.
Don't know the history of the engine, but for as easy and inexpensive as it is, you may want to pull the pan, check a couple of caps and clean the pan and pump screen if nothing else, especially if the car is new to you.

Originally Posted by zwede
One of the posts above seems to say that if you run high pressure you run unfiltered oil through the engine. That is not correct. There are two things here:

1) The oil pump has a spring loaded valve that limits max pressure the pump can produce.

2) The block has a bypass so that if the pressure differential across the filter is more than a certain amount, it opens. This is so that a clogged filter doesn't stop all oil flow. Better to circulate dirty oil than none.

Just because you run a high pressure does not mean the filter bypass opens! The bypass only opens if the filter is clogged.

As for the pressures: first thing to do is to calibrate the gauge. Mine was off quite a bit. After I calibrated it I get the following on my 454:

Cold engine: Idle - 60 PSI. 2000 rpm - 70 PSI (oil pump maxed)
Warm engine: Idle - 50 PSI. 2000 rpm - 70 PSI (oil pump maxed)
Hot engine: Idle - 35 PSI. 2000 rpm - 60 PSI

Warm engine = Has just reached operating temp, thermostat open. Oil not fully warm yet.
Hot engine = Hot day, driven for a while, AC on. Guesstimating oil temp in the 200-220F range.

Oil is Mobil 1 10W-30. Next oil change I'll probably try 0W-40.
Those are pretty normal pressures for a healthy engine using an HV pump same as what I get.
The Melling HV pumps, as well as most others, come with a 70psi relief spring, so any pressure reading of 70psi, pretty well assures that the pump is relieving, which creates an extreme amount of heat.
As long as it stays under 70psi hot, it's golden.
I've been using 0w40 for about a year now in everything and have only noticed a very slight lower psi idling cold in one vehicle.

Originally Posted by TheSkunkWorks
FWIW, my submerged pump setup (recently discussed elsewhere) came with anti-cavitation slots, per Bill Jenkins' "pressure balance" mod, and an enlarged bypass area, both of which can be examined here. These aren't exactly new ideas, but are apparently less than common knowledge. No flames, just food for thought...



Oh, and a filter bypass will open more often with unnecessarily high pressures, circulating unfiltered oil thru the lubricating system. So, definitely watch out for over-filtration at the cost of restriction in truly high-perf applications. There's more to proper filtering than just the micron ratings.
Melling makes almost all those pumps for other branding and Melling's own anti cavitation pump is just labelled a race pump. Key is also to use as large a pickup tube as possible.

The filters that advertise as being best have a 10 or less micron rating and the race filters are up around 30 microns. If you're into high rpm, best to use a race filter and change the oil religiously, to prevent any filter bypass.
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