Hey all i am looking to swap in a 2004R in place of my old TH350C.
What all is involved? what changes are necessary to the drive shaft? How about the cross member?

I was looking at Bow-tie overdrives but other then their home page a lot of it is down including their catalog. Are they still in business?

What other makes out there are good? I have heard to avoid TCI but other then that i dont know. What about torque converters? what is a good brand?

Specs Engine around 450 at the crank, rear end 3.55:1.

 

Basically, it's a plug in swap, and being a 350c tranny you already have the lockup command, but the tranny can be wired to lockup in 4th only and not worry about computer control....

I rebuilt my own maybe 6 years ago, in the car fine....336 rear....

when you buy a converter, you will find the typical converter has what is known as 'paper clutches' ....now the EARLY 700 and the 200 used to share the same converter, but ~87 up 700 went to more splines and KEVLAR clutches in the converter,.....the 200 stayed the same....

NOW, I am told by my tranny supply shop they can get me a 200/early 700 converter, rebuilt with the heavy duty Kevlar clutches...

I am now facing a intermittant lockup problem, hot on the freeway and it will not lock up, cold it will....went the easy fix stuff, no go...so converter time when my lazy/cheep *** gets to it....yawn....

 

It's not a complete straight swap, but it's not terribly difficult either. Do a search and you'll find many threads on this with comprehensive information....

 

The website is down. I just gave them a call and they said the site should be back up later on today.

The swap is straight forward; no driveshaft mods. You need to consider how you will lock up the converter, There are kits available, but it's really not hard to wire up something on your own. Same goes with the TV cable. you'll need the correct brackets to interface to your carb.

Your stock crossmember will work, but it is a tight fit around the exhaust. The BTO crossmember lets you route the pipes easier.

 

Mr Vette...

Might the lockup problems you now have be due to not having a lockup controller (resulting in L/U clutch damage)? I'm not trying to be "testy" here, but advising others to not use a lockup controller is questionable, IMO...for the very reason you are now discovering.

 

We're not doing this again I promise. And I really don't mind differing opinions (you and I seem to agree far more than disagree )If you look at how this actually works inside the transmission, it's really not a problem, I swear!! I've been running this way for a couple years now, as have others with no issues, none. You simply do not NEED a controller. It's a nice, but a little expensive OPTION. BTW, I first got the idea of using a switch from a guy in NY who has a very strong reputation for building these things, for both street and race use. It's his lively hood, not a hobby like it is for you and I and it works for him. Gene's problem has nothing to do with a controller, really.

 

450 hp you want to call Chris at CK performance in NY. You are going to need some billet pieces and Chris manufactures them. He also has an excellant manual that he has written for a standard rebuild to hi performance. He has catered to the Buick GN crowd for years but thats not his only nitch.
The lockup can be controlled very easily with a relay and brake switch with a two pin 4th clutch pressure switch. It's not rocket science

 

I have just completed this swap a couple of weeks ago. For me it was pretty much a remove and install project. I did use the kit to wire up the lock up and adapt my Holley to the TV cable. There are tons of opinions on the site and while I think they are all right for the most part, the guys at Bow Tie Overdrive were very helpful in getting me the kits to make the install even easier. You will love the 200 4r. If you are going to put big hp against it make sure it is built up to handle it. I had mine built to handle it.

 

Oh and BTW, the stock 81 crossmember will NOT work with the 2004r trans. The trans mounting pad is welded on the 81 piece and the 200's mount is about seven inches further back than the TH350. As a result, it won't work without modification. Also, I've used all CK Performance parts in my trans and others I've built. They're high quality and I keep going back every time I need something. Plus Chris is VERY knowledgable about these and 700's too.

 

Dave, you forgot to mention my UBER electrical/tronic knowledge, and so I have FI on my car, and the lockup is tranny controlled OR able to engage in any gear except first via a switch on the console, which is totally custom BTW...nothing stock, nothing, except the trim....

the brake control consists of a separate switch in the +12 line, obviously ignition controled and routed through the BWD S870 switch that is a plug in for our units but has a extra switch to OPEN the 12 volt feed to lockup when we press the brakes/light the lights....

you CAN do the same with a relay if you know how....

The local tranny supply house I deal with is where I got the converter from, and so I went through the logic on the vette, and so it seems the converter OR the O ring on the tranny input shaft is defective....funny in that it only locks when COLD, but soon as it makes it to the freeway about 3 miles through heavy traffic, it's not locking up at all.....

I"m told by the tranny supply that the 200 and EARLY 700 had the same converter, but long about '87 or so they upgraded the 700 to a KEVLAR clutch converter, and changed the spline count....
the 200 converter remained a 'paper' clutch ....BUT they can s/order me one with Kevlar....

money/taxes/springtime bad news time of year now, be a few more weeks, and other plans take precedence anyway....

 

 

200rs use the mount location as a th400 and a 700 uses the mount location as a 350 im doing a 700 swap now on a 75 nova that had a 350 mounts bolt up great but 3 in longer so u need the drive shaft shortend were u can use a stock drive shaft on a 200r i actually like a 700 r better the 200 r have a closer ratio though tv cable is very im portant to have adjusted correctly as far as lock up there many arguments about it heres my opinion it works great on flat land or a light car with decent power im in west virginia very hilly windy roads i do the non lock up conversion on a ll 700 r trucks and vans here they run better drive better