I was told these are ready to bolt on,but have to clean up the flashing first around the oil return holes.
Since these come with screw in studs I expected them to be setup for guide plates. The place I got them from said they would have to be machined first. Is this true, and if so just what machining is necessary? I could probably set them up in a Bridgeport if it's only to mill the pads the thickness of the guideplates? Are they even needed at this point with these heads?
Thanks again
Gary


[Modified by gtr1999, 4:54 PM 6/25/2002]

 

I machined mine for guidplates last year on my bridgeport. You're correct. Just machine off the thickness of the guideplate. Set the head at 11 degrees for this and then countersink the stud holes to break the sharp edge when you are done. Also, don't forget to mill the pushrod slots bigger while you're at it. The guideplates and slots will not line up as it is now.

Tom

 

Thanks Tom, would it make much difference if I didn't use the plates and just used the comp cam push rods?
Gary

 

Guide plates are not needed for stock or close to stock lift, but it never hurts to have them either. Read this recent thread before you make up your mind http://forums.corvetteforum.com/zerothread?id=328188

If you decide not to bother, at least run some good quality chrome moly pushrods. As I talked about in the other thread, I have run the moly pushrods in a high lift/high spring pressure small block with out guide plates using only the stock slots and have had no problems.

FYI When I did mine, I spent a total of 3 hrs for tear down of heads, machining, thorough cleaning and re-assembly of heads. Not sure if you are an experienced machinist, but I thought I would give you an idea of time needed if you decide to do it your self.

 

I've been running SR Torquers for a few years now without guideplates and have had no problems. I went with a new cam, lifters, pushrods and full roller rockers when I did the rebuild. My cam has .454/.480 inch lift on the intake and exhaust. I don't race mine but I've gotten her excited on a few ocassions with no problem. I didn't do a thing to my Torquers except enlarge the holes for the temp sensors. When I bought mine they had the smaller holes. I'm not sure if that has been changed on the newer heads. Hope this helps.

 

Thanks guys something to think about. The hardest thing about milling the heads would be fixturing them. I'll ask more questions if I have a problem.
:cheers:
Gary

 

Fixturing is pretty straight forward. Since the common thread size for T slot nuts for the Bridgeport table is 1/2-13, you will need to make or buy some that are for 3/8-16. Then just use some threaded rod and nuts with the T slot nuts, using the threaded rod through the head bolt holes to clamp it to the table. Then just adjust the head of the bridgeport to a 11 degree angle. As far as indicating the heads to get them parallel to the table, the S/R's have a raised, machined lip that extends up from the valve cover rail. That is what I used to get them parallel. If you don't have an indicator, then just use a straight edge and a rule to get it close. Getting them parallel is not very important, but makes it easier to just move straight a cross without having to move the table in and out.

Good luck, Tom

 

Tom,
That's the way I was thinking of doing it. I have a newer 2hp 2-J head machine and an old round over-arm J head machine. AS you know the round over arm isn't going to work but the 2-J head will pivot at the knuckle. I would have to schedule use of the machine to do this-probably on the weekend or nights. The inside edge of the heads doesn't look machined-just cast so I was thinking of picking up off the intake surface where it's machined. Again, I may just clean up the flash and use Comp Cam hardened pushrods without the plates.
I really appreciate your input Tom. Other then intake port matching do you think that polishing or more porting is worth it? Most people have told me to just bolt them on for an engine that's going ot be used under 6k rpm.
:cheers:
Gary

 

I intend to do some porting at some point. My current goal is 300rwhp, but I honestly don't think it is possible without porting these heads. I thought this current setup(cam, heads, ect..) would be able to do it, but I think the heads are holding me back. Don't get me wrong, I like the heads and they seem to produce very good torque, but don't flow enough to make any top end power. If you are looking for a good street motor that will make up to 350hp gross and lots of low end torque, then I think you'll be happy with them as they are out of the box. If you will be wanting more than 350hp now or in the near future, then you may as well port them now.

Also, check out this fellow forum members web site. He(Allen) built a 383 with these heads(ported) and it is damn impressive. http://www.caspeed.com/488hp383.html

 

you really need to at least have the bowls blended and the pockets done. Mine were really crappy out of the box. The transition from the seat to the port was really bad. Might as well do it while they're off.

 

Why did you choose the S/R torquer heads over the El Performers? I have been wanting to change heads on mine ever since I got it but haven't had the guts to spend the money without anything to compare them to.

 

Good question. I'm also curious why others picked these heads. I did it for several reasons. First, the price was right. I was going to simply do some work to the 462's that I was running then. By the time I would have installed larger valves, did some minor porting, bought new springs and screw in studs, it would have cost the same or more as the new S/R T's and would most likely still not produce the same results.
Second, I had done a lot af reading and comparing of many of the aftermarket heads that were available at the time. Some of the heads had little choice in chamber size and I was trying to keep from losing much when going from the 64cc of the 462's . Also, most of these other heads have larger runners and easily outflow the S/R T's, but is more always better? From everything I had read and heard at the time, port velocity was more important than flow when building an engine for the street. The S/R T's have fairly small 171cc intake runners, but a larger exhaust port than any of the factory iron heads. The port velocity of the smaller runners builds torque, and while the Performer and AFR heads with the larger runners showed higher peak HP and TQ numbers on the dyno, I did not believe that peak power was as important as low and midrange torque. After running it a few times on the dyno, I'd have to say that it does exactly what I hoped for. It does not put up the peak numbers that I thought it would, but considering that I run a larger than average cam and a single plane, it produces a very flat torque curve and feels very strong. Perhaps with a little porting, I can have the best of both worlds. Good low end torque and more upper RPM power.

 

Sounds great. Thats the feed back that helps us all make better decisions when working on our own cars.

 

When WP brought the Torquers out, said were better than ported double hump. GM had no good unleaded heads available. Called Street Replacement.
Some comparison info.

S/R Torquers 171+ (some 180)
462 about 156
441 about 155
882 about 151
Vortec 885 about 170
LT1 372 about 170
Many consider about 170 ideal for perf. 350.

Thought you might like some extra info.

:cool:

 

Thanks for the info ganey.
Gary

 

To follow up, this morning I disassembled one of the heads. When I got them one chamber was covered with grit from grinding the valves? well I'm glad I opened them up because one chamber had a fair amount of grit inside the seat and stem area. So much for "ready to bolt on" assemblies :rolleyes:
These were supposed to have teflon seals, but they look like black rubber umbrella seals. Are there any good sites for pocket porting info/pictures? Since I have to grind the flashing off I mine as well do the porting too.
Thanks,
Gary


[Modified by gtr1999, 10:25 AM 6/29/2002]

 

Hi Tom,
I just watched a video on rebuilding SBC heads and they drllled the pushrod slots open with a 1/2 drill. Is that what you were referring to also?
Thanks,
Gary

 

Yup. That's what you need to do. I got a litte fancy doing mine. I figured that I already had them up on the mill, so I just milled it across and connected each pair together with one bigazz slot :D Or in other words, there are now 4 wide slots instead of 8 holes. If you decide do what I did, just be sure not to mill into the runners :eek: :eek: The 1/2 drill as seen in the video is good enough. No need to do what I did.

 

Thanks Tom, I'm sure I'll have a couple of questions when I get a chance to do this job.
Gary :cheers:

 

Tom
I just sent you an IM.
Thanks
Gary