400 ci
Racer
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 258
Likes: 1
From: Gippsland, VIC Australia
you're giving me a headache, where does the intake center line fall if you ignore the dots?
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,948
Likes: 72
From: Oxford MA-----You just lost the game!!!!
Scott
Race Director
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 10,674
Likes: 122
From: Millington Illinois
St. Jude Donor '08-'09
When you advance or retard a camshaft, don't you usually do it by using some sort of offset timing gear? So, you still just line up the dots, don't you? Maybe there is something pretty basic that I am missing here, and I only bring it up because the OP seems to be having trouble with it, as well. Is there a good, comprehensive article on the internet that someone can point us to?
Scott
Scott
Race Director
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 10,674
Likes: 122
From: Millington Illinois
St. Jude Donor '08-'09
http://www.compcams.com/Technical/FAQ/LSAproperties.asp
Here are a couple threads that will either clarify this or confuse you even more.
http://ls1tech.com/forums/generation...ce-ground.html
http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=271165
Here are a couple threads that will either clarify this or confuse you even more.
http://ls1tech.com/forums/generation...ce-ground.html
http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=271165
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,948
Likes: 72
From: Oxford MA-----You just lost the game!!!!
Two ways to do it. If the cam is ground with 4 degrees advance and you install it with the dots lined up it is 4 degrees advanced. If it is ground without 4 degrees advance or "straight up" and you install dot to dot your "straight up". To advance this cam 4 degrees you need the timing set that marks out 2 degrees, 4 degrees advance or retard on the gears. The cam that is ground 4 degrees advanced and the cam that is ground straight up but installed 4 degrees advanced will be the same. Don't believe desktop dyno on this. The only real way to tell is to build it and dyno it. Then change the advance at the timing set and dyno it again. The degree wheel will confirm timing events as speced on the cam card. Sometimes the grind is off a few degrees. Comp has an explanation of what the effects of advancing or retarding cam will be. I will see if I can find it.
Scott
Cruising
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
From: Harperwoods Michigan
I installed Trick Flows 23 degree 64cc chambers on my 400 by using .072" tri metal head gaskets...I haven't started it yet however I believe it will work well...quench are will be a little bigger...My combination is 400 / 30 over / 5.7rod / my compression came in a 11.5....as I remember the gaskets are Fel-Pro....there kind of expensive however the only option I found....probably done in the past by them southern boys running 400's on the short track...
Burning Brakes
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 788
Likes: 100
From: Indianapolis IN
I installed Trick Flows 23 degree 64cc chambers on my 400 by using .072" tri metal head gaskets...I haven't started it yet however I believe it will work well...quench are will be a little bigger...My combination is 400 / 30 over / 5.7rod / my compression came in a 11.5....as I remember the gaskets are Fel-Pro....there kind of expensive however the only option I found....probably done in the past by them southern boys running 400's on the short track...
The loss of .2 compression will not make much difference , but the loss of quench certainly will.
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Cruising
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
From: Harperwoods Michigan
400 ci
as I remember compressed gasket difference from .050" standard blue to a .072" tri metal was around .018" gain in quench area...My pistons are Weisco fordgings that came in around .006" under the deck , so the total quench area should be around .024" piston to head...so whats the total increase from stock .010" to .015" approx.....I'm hoping to run half 110 and half premium...and if i'm in a bind very little less than 89....I have installed FAST 2.0 E/Z so I should be able to run E85 with the program....and dial back the spark with the FAST map or manually if necessary...Comp hyd roller that's pretty high lift .485" / .490" set at 113 deg......so it should get a really good gulp and idle pretty good....we'll see how it goes....if it's a problem there's always another option...the key here is no piston to head touchie!....Rob in Detroit
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 6,284
Likes: 1,171
From: Hermosa
Burning Brakes
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 788
Likes: 100
From: Indianapolis IN
as I remember compressed gasket difference from .050" standard blue to a .072" tri metal was around .018" gain in quench area...My pistons are Weisco fordgings that came in around .006" under the deck , so the total quench area should be around .024" piston to head...so whats the total increase from stock .010" to .015" approx.....I'm hoping to run half 110 and half premium...and if i'm in a bind very little less than 89....I have installed FAST 2.0 E/Z so I should be able to run E85 with the program....and dial back the spark with the FAST map or manually if necessary...Comp hyd roller that's pretty high lift .485" / .490" set at 113 deg......so it should get a really good gulp and idle pretty good....we'll see how it goes....if it's a problem there's always another option...the key here is no piston to head touchie!....Rob in Detroit
I misunderstood you that quench would be more than stock and you're saying that quench will be down to .024" which is too little. .040 is considered the minimum for a streetbound engine, even alittle less is considered extremely tight.
Piston rock will likely leave witness marks on their tops where they kiss the heads !
Race Director
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 10,674
Likes: 122
From: Millington Illinois
St. Jude Donor '08-'09
as I remember compressed gasket difference from .050" standard blue to a .072" tri metal was around .018" gain in quench area...My pistons are Weisco fordgings that came in around .006" under the deck , so the total quench area should be around .024" piston to head...so whats the total increase from stock .010" to .015" approx.....I'm hoping to run half 110 and half premium...and if i'm in a bind very little less than 89....I have installed FAST 2.0 E/Z so I should be able to run E85 with the program....and dial back the spark with the FAST map or manually if necessary...Comp hyd roller that's pretty high lift .485" / .490" set at 113 deg......so it should get a really good gulp and idle pretty good....we'll see how it goes....if it's a problem there's always another option...the key here is no piston to head touchie!....Rob in Detroit
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 2,964
Likes: 419
From: Melbourne FL
I was faced with a similar quandary pertaining to a SBC400 and a great deal on heads, although mine was for a pair of Twisted Wedge. I had similar concerns about 64cc and too much compression, calculations came out to 10.7:1 with 0.040 gaskets. But the advice I got from those that built many 400s and similar motors was I'd be okay with 93 octane since I was running aluminum heads. And those I purchased already had the steam holes but based on my research, I would have added them anyway.
I also went hydraulic roller, XE282 and did the lifter vally mod to use OEM lifters and dogbones. That kept the cam cost down and I used my existing RPM manifold and Demon carb for more savings. I can tell you it's a beast with best estimates around 525+HP. Stock radiator, electric fan, factory A/C, stays at 180* on the hottest Florida days.
It idles at 850rpm, pulls like a mule from there to 6,000 and will smoke the tires halfway through 3rd gear. Go for it, you'll love it!
I also went hydraulic roller, XE282 and did the lifter vally mod to use OEM lifters and dogbones. That kept the cam cost down and I used my existing RPM manifold and Demon carb for more savings. I can tell you it's a beast with best estimates around 525+HP. Stock radiator, electric fan, factory A/C, stays at 180* on the hottest Florida days.
It idles at 850rpm, pulls like a mule from there to 6,000 and will smoke the tires halfway through 3rd gear. Go for it, you'll love it!
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 280
Likes: 0
From: Glendon Alberta
Project
This project isn't dead, just on hold, still a month away from my first pay since I quit my job and went self employed.
Realistically, the driving season is so short here, I don't see myself doing R&R on engine until fall at this point
The car is 35 years old, it might be 36 before the new engine is in,
Realistically, the driving season is so short here, I don't see myself doing R&R on engine until fall at this point
The car is 35 years old, it might be 36 before the new engine is in,
Safety Car
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 3,736
Likes: 56
From: anchorage ak
This project isn't dead, just on hold, still a month away from my first pay since I quit my job and went self employed.
Realistically, the driving season is so short here, I don't see myself doing R&R on engine until fall at this point
The car is 35 years old, it might be 36 before the new engine is in,
Realistically, the driving season is so short here, I don't see myself doing R&R on engine until fall at this point
The car is 35 years old, it might be 36 before the new engine is in,
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 280
Likes: 0
From: Glendon Alberta
Northern Alberta. Corvette season is late May to early October. No t top season is late June to late august
Pretty short window, hate to miss any of it.
Can't take it to work or anything like that, so again limited to fine weather, and babysitter availability to get out for a spin.... Lol
I managed to squeeze in 3000 Kms last year.
Pretty short window, hate to miss any of it.
Can't take it to work or anything like that, so again limited to fine weather, and babysitter availability to get out for a spin.... Lol
I managed to squeeze in 3000 Kms last year.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,170
Likes: 201
From: Willoughby Ohio
Life gets in the way of projects sometimes.Good luck in your new business!
I have more pictures posted on my build thread of plug to header clearance if you're interested.I'm hoping to get my 400 on the dyno soon if
my schedule and his line up somewhere.
I have more pictures posted on my build thread of plug to header clearance if you're interested.I'm hoping to get my 400 on the dyno soon if
my schedule and his line up somewhere.
Safety Car
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 3,736
Likes: 56
From: anchorage ak
Northern Alberta. Corvette season is late May to early October. No t top season is late June to late august
Pretty short window, hate to miss any of it.
Can't take it to work or anything like that, so again limited to fine weather, and babysitter availability to get out for a spin.... Lol
I managed to squeeze in 3000 Kms last year.
Pretty short window, hate to miss any of it.
Can't take it to work or anything like that, so again limited to fine weather, and babysitter availability to get out for a spin.... Lol
I managed to squeeze in 3000 Kms last year.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 280
Likes: 0
From: Glendon Alberta
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 280
Likes: 0
From: Glendon Alberta
We were still getting snow here thru the first week of May, and the snow is always back by Halloween