its not compatible because of the end connector .I have a sensor from a 1986.i had to go a new type because I could not find the proper connector for the 82 sensor.

 

Electronic Spark Control Module , maybe ???

 

ESC is on the list to test. I started it up today, just to watch what was happening under the hood. Timing is being pulled, and the injectors are spraying a lot of gas. Way too much. I think I may have a few issues. Bad sensors, bad ECM, or bad ESC. Perhaps a combination of the three, or two of the three. The excess fueling leads me to think the O2 is bad, the timing being pulled makes me want to look at the ESC and knock sensor, the fact that both are out of whack makes me suspect the ECM. The filter on the tach was definitely bad, I bypassed it today and the tach smoothed out completely. Neither sensor is more than three years old, but the ECM and ESC are 33 years old so something could be bad there. Testing is in order. I do know timing is pulled with or without the knock sensor connected, so that leads me toward the ESC and ECM.

 

extra fuel I would look at the coolant sensor in the front of the motor .if its a bad signal to the ecm the ecm trys to adj.

 

WinALDL showed temp from the sensor at 185*, I have an 180* thermostat installed since the rebuild and I had a spare coolant temp sensor that I put in a couple of weeks ago to eliminate that possibility. The only sensors I haven't replaced are the O2 and the Knock sensor.

 

then the ecm is suspect

 

Indeed.

 

A skretched out timing chain will cause timing to jump around at idle. If it jumped a tooth on the cam gear the motor will never run correctly. I would start with the basics. Physically verify TDC and your timing marks. You can also pop the cap and turn the motor back and forth while watching the rotor. If you can get the crank to turn 10 degrees or more without the rotor moving. That would be your first problem.

 

Indeed it will. I've checked all this, even though the timing chain and gears are new at the rebuild. At TDC everything lines up as it should. The distributor is a brand new DUI unit and now that I have balanced the tbs and bypassed the tach filter all my misfires are gone. Since I'm having multiple issues all at once it's been challenging to figure it all out. RIght now the issues are I'm running rich and the computer is pulling timing. You can hear the idle change with the timing fluctuations and when you increase the throttle the timing will advance momentarily then retard to about 12* and hold steady there. Sometimes it throws code 43, sometimes it doesn't, but the timing issue is there regardless of codes or even the knock sensor being connected. I think the sensor is good, I think the ESC or the ECM or both are bad, but physically they look good, no dirt or burn marks on the boards or card connectors, no obvious issues on the chips or parts on the boards, and all the solder points on the boards look good. I don't know how to test the board components themselves, however.

I'm still leaning toward the ECM being at the root of the issue. I haven't heard back from the member that offered his spare ECM for me to test out the bad ECM theory, but I think I'm going to end up going with the EBL system anyway because I want to be able to tune this motor to get the most out of it and the EBL system gives more feedback than I can get with WinALDL.

 

Today I ordered a tunable/programmable ECM to replace my current ECM along with a newer model ESC and pigtail. The new system will be here in a few days. It allows for more detailed datalogging and total tuneablity of spark and fuel. It even has a learning feature of sorts, although it is more designed to help the user fine tune rather than tune itself. I'm unsure if I can mention the name of the system since they are not forum venders. I decided to go this direction for the tuning capabilities of the system and with this system I won't have to replace the intake/injection system. I'm hoping the newer ESC (that matches the later model knock sensor I have) will solve the false knock issues. If not I can tune them out with the ECM. This will also allow me to upgrade the cam in the future when I'm ready. I'll keep up this thread (or start a new one) to follow along on the install and tuning if it's okay with the mods and doesn't upset any vendors. Otherwise I'll answer all questions thru PM if there are any.

 

I asked you on another forum about tying into the ESC output line to try to monitor/stabilize the ESC retard request line. I'm assuming you haven't had the opportunity to do that yet. Regardless, got a couple questions on this new setup. Is the new ECM compatible with TBI injectors (ramp and hold drivers)? And, which calibration (there's tons of different filter configurations) ESC module are you planning to use?

 

I haven't had the chance to test the ESC as you suggested on the other forum. I assume (which is dangerous I know) that since the car is exhibiting the same characteristics regardless of knock sensor status that one or both of the components has gone bad. As I stated in the previous post, I wanted to go with the programmable/tuneable ECM in any event, so testing at this point seems to be unnecessary. I have an 84 Corvette ESC on order, which was also used on CFI motors with the knock sensor I have installed, so on the surface it seems to be a good fit. As for the ECM in question, I'm going with the EBL Locker system, which is a TBI ECM originally. Quite a few Renegade users have gone with the EBL system.

 

I have a 82 Collector Edition BG certified with 8,000 orig miles. Ecm has developed a short and drains the battery down within 12 hours. Does any one have a ecm rebuilder? I would really like to have this exact unit rebuild vs swapping for a new one.

Suggestions?

 

Is the short inside the ECM or in the wiring? Look in the battery box, there is a power lug to the right of the battery looking from the driver's seat. Make sure nothing is shorting out on that. Have you tested to be sure the drain is coming from the ECM? A lot of the time the dome light timer malfunctions and drains the battery, test by using a multimeter to see which circuit is pulling power with the key off.

 

Yes all test complete. If you pull the fuse in the battery box the drain stops. All circuits where tested with a multi meter. It is definitely the ECM. It looks like Mid America can send out for rebuild. Was just checking to see if anyone else new of a company rebuilding.

 

http://www.siaelec.com/odbiireprogramming.aspx they rebuild and return

 

Thank you

 

Just to update this thread:

EBL in and installed. New ESC module as well. CEL is gone, no more code 43, so either the computer or ESC was bad. Tuning the EBL now, got a lot done this weekend on it. After a datalog found I had injectors running at 100% duty cycle, not a good thing. I swapped out the 6 month old injectors in the car for one of the two spare sets of GM injectors I had on the shelf. All driveability went away and she's running like she used to before all this started. Ran a few more tuning runs (EBL does learns, but its not automatic, you have to run the learn, then re flash the prom) and the duty cycles on the injectors are back under 85% duty cycle. More tuning to come, but I'm off to a great start.

 

job well done

 

Good job! I've heard big block chevy truck injectors from the late 80s work in our TBI . That might get you down to 80% duty cycle but 85 should be fine.