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Just recently picked up some new weatherstrip from Willcox for my '73. The new t-top weatherstrip worked fine and the installation went well.
However, I'm having issues with the new rear door glass pillar weatherstrip. The new weatherstrip is not as thick as the old which leaves a gap between the door glass. The old weatherstrip was very dry rotted and could be original to the car.
This photo shows the gap BEFORE I adjusted the door glass. Keep in mind that I did not have this gap with the original weatherstrip.
I was able to bring the bottom of the door glass inboard to where it barely touched the new weatherstrip but it's adjusted all the way now and there is no way to bring it in any further. The top of the glass also touches the weatherstrip but there is still a gap in the middle. I neglected to get a photo after the adjustment but I basically have a 1/8" gap most of the way along the weatherstrip.
The door glass is adjusted very well otherwise and there are no other issues.
I have the same exact problem on both sides.
I happened to have a piece of 3/8" round weatherstrip that I inserted in the cavity of the pillar weatherstrip to try and push the edge closer to the door glass. That helped close the gap but it's not enough.
Do different year models have different thicknesses of this weatherstrip? Anyone else run into this issue and have a fix?
I would definitely contact Willcox directly on this if you haven't already. I wonder if you possibly got sent the wrong pieces?
I put my $$ on Wilcox......and I hope the OP knows that there are slotted/elongated holes in the surface where the strip mounts....to allow the strip itself to move in/out a bit loosen/remove and check the canvas or whatever....
I wonder if you possibly got sent the wrong pieces?
I suppose it's possible but they were labeled correctly. That's why I'm wondering if different year models had different thicknesses of this particular weatherstrip. If the ones that were sent to me are technically correct, maybe I can source some non-correct ones that are thicker.
mrvette - the metal frame the weatherstrip attaches to is riveted in place. There may be fore and aft movement allowed but I need inboard/outboard movement. Maybe you're thinking of the A pillar?
I would bet that your door glass is the issue or its adjustment may need to be tweaked.
It looks as if the door glass needs to be brought IN...or the fact that IF the new T-top weatherstrip is now causing it to push out your door glass.
Also the front and rear window track rollers in your door can be worn also allowing your door glass to have a lot of movement in and out when the door glass is up and the door is open. IF your door glass is not rigid and holding a rigid position when it is UP...then there is no way you can expect the door glass to seal against new weatherstrips that have density to them. The felt adjusters can also be an issue..and the outer window seal. All of these parts make it so your door glass is what it is and will actually be rigid enough to seal against new weatherstrip....BUT.....that also depends on how dense your weatherstrips are.
It looks as if the door glass needs to be brought IN...or the fact that IF the new T-top weatherstrip is now causing it to push out your door glass.
Originally Posted by forman
take the t-top off then close the door and see what it looks like
Thanks for the help. The gap is still present with the t-tops off although it is very slightly improved. Window mechanisms were rebuilt by previous owner about 10 years ago and are in good shape. Windows were aligned and working well before the weatherstrip change. I've since brought the windows inboard as much as possible in the rear and as I've already said, I'm at the end of the adjustment so there is no way to bring them in further.
I could play with the window alignment again but I hate to because the window fits so well now at the A pillar and at the t-top. No gaps, air leaks, etc. The glass also touches the top and bottom of the rear pillar weatherstrip. It seems the glass may have too much curve in it.
Seems strange the old weatherstrips didn't have this gap. I wish I had taken pics and measurements before gluing the new weatherstrip into place. The total projection of old ones from the gluing surface to the edge that touches the glass is at least 1/8" more than the new ones.
it look like the back top edge of your door is sitting lower than the body edge ? . or is that just the camera angle ?
It sorta is but the camera angle makes it look worse. The curve on the top of the door lines up perfectly with the curve on the body. But the outside edge of the door sits a bit lower than the body and the inside top edge of the door sits a bit higher. The passenger side is similar but better. No way to correct without body work.
However, the rear vertical edge of both doors is outboard of the body around 1/16". If I could re-adjust the doors to bring the back edge inboard, it would help. I wonder if it's as simple as adjusting the striker?
Hate to play around with the doors too much because, like the glass, they are near perfect at the front edge. Anyone know if it's possible to adjust the rear edge of the door inboard by adjusting the striker?
"Anyone know if it's possible to adjust the rear edge of the door inboard by adjusting the striker?"
Yes it is. Just make a box around the striker with masking tape so you know the exact original position then loosen it up and move it inboard slightly.
Last edited by CanadaGrant; 05-09-2017 at 10:48 AM.
Yes it is. Just make a box around the striker with masking tape so you know the exact original position then loosen it up and move it inboard slightly.
Thanks. Got both doors adjusted where the rear edge is now flush with the body. Unfortunately, while it may have improved the situation, the window gap is still there on both sides.
In the past, I've checked the thickness of the door glass rears by CRC to a NOS one and I don't really see much of a difference. I have both here somewhere and tomorrow I'll check them again.
The two back screws on the door window run channel are what controls where the rear door glass lands... but it's also controlled by interferrence from either the pillar weatherstrip or the t-top weatherstrip.
Other factors can be stretching the weatherstrip.. If the weatherstrip is installed and pulled upward too far it will stretch the rubber and diminish the thickness substantially.
On the screws below, if you move out the glass comes inward.. just the opposite of what people would think but that's how the glass will respond.
This is a picture of my own 72 door glass rear and it's a CRC brand weatherstrip we installed a while back. There is no gap... but actually these rubbers seal up like a glove because I probably spent 8 hours adjusting over and over and over again. But the door shuts like a new car and seals perfectly.
My advice is to tweak the door glass run channel and see how you come out doing this. But you should also take a look at the other rubbers and how the glass rolls up and down... Rolling the glass up and down will show you interference points...
Water.. when adjusting is your friend too... If you put water on the rubber when you shut the door it will make a nice black mark on the door glass. Typically you want to see on the pillar about 1//8" mark and the same with the door glass rear.
The two back screws on the door window run channel are what controls where the rear door glass lands... but it's also controlled by interferrence from either the pillar weatherstrip or the t-top weatherstrip.
Other factors can be stretching the weatherstrip.. If the weatherstrip is installed and pulled upward too far it will stretch the rubber and diminish the thickness substantially.
Those two screws are the ones I've already used to adjust the window. I improved the gap over what is shown in the pic. The bottom of the glass now touches the weatherstrip as does the top of the glass. There is still a 1/8" gap in the middle where the glass curves.
Both windows seem fine in their performance otherwise. They seal well at the t-top and A pillar weatherstrip. No issues with opening or closing the windows whether the doors are open or closed.
The weatherstrip is not stretched. The hole where the rivet goes lined up perfectly. The indentation in the top of the weatherstrip lines up perfectly with the t-top weatherstrip.
Originally Posted by Willcox Corvette
My advice is to tweak the door glass run channel and see how you come out doing this. But you should also take a look at the other rubbers and how the glass rolls up and down... Rolling the glass up and down will show you interference points...
I'll try adjusting everything again even though there are no current interference points. I'm really happy with the fit of the door overall and the glass in regards to the t-top weatherstrip and the A pillar weatherstrip.
How much do changes to the A-pillar weatherstrip and to the inboard/outboard adjustment at the front of the door impact the rear edge?
To summarize the current situation: The bottom rear of the window glass touches the bottom of the rear pillar weatherstrip. The top rear of the window glass touches and seals at the intersection of the t-top weatherstrip and the rear pillar weatherstrip. The top of the door glass is in alignment with the t-top weatherstrip and is sealed well when the door is closed. The front edge of the window aligns with the groove in the A pillar weatherstrip and also seals well at this location. Glass tracks up and down smoothly and ends up in the same position whether the window is raised with the door closed or whether it is raised with the door open and then shut.
I KNOW this may seem stupid....but take out your A-pillar weatherstrip and close the door CAREFULLY and see what you have at the B pillar w/strip ..and make sure you leave the T-top off also.
I KNOW this may seem stupid....but take out your A-pillar weatherstrip and close the door CAREFULLY and see what you have at the B pillar w/strip ..and make sure you leave the T-top off also.
DUB
Not stupid at all. I had already planned to do just as you suggest along with playing with adjustments while the weatherstrip is off to see the relationship. Will report back later today.
Sorry about the length of this post but I wanted to document everything for future reference.
I took the A pillar weatherstrip off and the t-tops off. Doing that allowed the rear glass edge to barely contact the surface of the rear pillar weatherstrip.
I then replaced the A pillar weatherstrip and adjusted it as far inboard as I could. At this time the glass was still maintaining its marginal contact with the rear pillar weatherstrip. The glass/A pillar contact was good as well.
But, replacing the t-tops pushed the edge of the glass just off of the weatherstrip. Surprising to me, adjusting the t-top weatherstrip further inboard did not help the situation. At least one issue is that the portion of the t-top weatherstrip that overlaps the rear pillar weatherstrip pushes the glass out every so slightly but just enough to lift the glass off of the pillar weatherstrip.
I then pulled the door panel off and loosened all adjustment bolts for the glass except the fore/aft tilt which was perfect the way it was. I also loosened the A pillar weatherstrip and the t-top weatherstrip. Using suction cups, I placed the window glass and tightened everything up.
After all that, the gap was still there but at least had closed up somewhat.
The glass rolls up smoothly and seals well to the A pillar weatherstrip and to the t-top weatherstrip. The glass makes good contact at both the top and bottom of the rear pillar weatherstrip. But, the middle portion of the rear glass edge does not touch the weatherstrip. The glass curves but the weatherstrip is straight.
It's worth pointing out the gap on both sides are identical.
I test fit some pieces of 3/8" round weatherstrip into the cavity of the rear pillar weatherstrip. This pushed the edge of the weatherstrip into the glass enough to make a seal.
I then used some RTV black silicone to hold the round weatherstrip in place.
That's about all I can do at this point. Throwing in the towel. Hated to do the Bubba thing, but at least it works and doesn't show.
Conclusion. Either the car is out of tolerance (possible) or the new weatherstrip is just too thin. Maybe both, but I suspect the latter is the major issue because I also suspect the previous owner had this exact same problem. During his frame off rebuild, he had replaced all the weatherstrip on the car with new except the rear pillar weatherstrip which he re-used even though it was in bad shape. No reason for him to have done that given everything else he did unless he had the same issue as I'm having.
I know that CRC has a good reputation for quality weatherstrip products. I also have read that some of the other brands are known for poor fitting weatherstrip sometimes due the weatherstrip being too thick. If anyone ever has a chance to compare various brands of rear pillar weatherstrip, I'd be interested in knowing if one of the other brands is thicker than the CRC.
NOT wanting to seem like a smart @ss...I KNOW exactly what you just went through. I have encountered this numerous times and I have found is that the density of the weatherstrips DOES make a huge difference....mainly because I do not have months of waiting to get the weatherstrip to 'decide' to finally seat and work correctly without being under tension.
This is why...especially when the car is a power window car...I use the latex weatherstrips for the 'A' pillar and T-tops. I am not sure if the door main w/strips are being reproduced in latex YET...but once they are...I will use only them.
I have...either by luck or got the 'B' pillars w/strips for your era of Corvette that seemed to have the collapsible flap of the w/strip to be actually angled out a bit more...thus...when the door is shut and the window is UP...it seal in the middle.
What you did to get that 'flap' to come out and seal against the glass is NOT a 'bubba' move (in my opinion). You are doing what you have to due to sometimes the fine details in how parts are being reproduced are often times overlooked due to the person making them HAS NO CLUE on WHY they were made a specific way in the first place.
For what it is worth... I bought some of GM's weatherstrips ('B' pillars for a 1978-1982) when they were still available that came in GM boxes and when I opened them they are NOT like the origianls. NOWHERE CLOSE....they were much denser than the factory origianls...which just goes to show you that IF someone is not paying attention on who is making 'whatever'...they can make crap that is totally worthless.
I have...either by luck or got the 'B' pillars w/strips for your era of Corvette that seemed to have the collapsible flap of the w/strip to be actually angled out a bit more...thus...when the door is shut and the window is UP...it seal in the middle.
Thanks for your insight. Helps to know I'm not crazy. In addition to the old weatherstrips being a bit thicker, the flap you mention is also at a more prominent angle as compared to the flap on the new weatherstrips.
FWIW I ended up fabricating some sheet metal spacers to install behind the rear weatherstrip on my driver's door. I couldn't get it close to a new weatherstrip either. Good thread.
I have the same issue. I just put in brand new windows to go with the already replaced weatherstrips and the gap got worse.
The curve of the window vs. the flat weatherstrip makes no sense to me. I adjusted everything in the window 100 times and to get a seal at the A pillar, T-top, and to be able to roll the window up with doors closed and t-tops on - well..... it fits a lot better with the window down.
05-07-2017, 12:16 PM
New Weatherstrip Issue
