Engine turns but doesn't fire
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 174
Likes: 6
From: McDonough Georgia
Engine turns but doesn't fire
Guys,
I'm at a complete loss at this point. I pulled my engine to repaint it and now I can't seem to get it to start. I've checked just about everything and still no luck. I called the timing chain manufacturer to make sure I had the right chain set and he said I did. I pulled the Pertronix ignitor-II and installed points today suspecting it might be the problem and nothing. The dang motor turns but doesn't fire. I'd appreciate any help you guys can provide.
Thanks,
Al
I'm at a complete loss at this point. I pulled my engine to repaint it and now I can't seem to get it to start. I've checked just about everything and still no luck. I called the timing chain manufacturer to make sure I had the right chain set and he said I did. I pulled the Pertronix ignitor-II and installed points today suspecting it might be the problem and nothing. The dang motor turns but doesn't fire. I'd appreciate any help you guys can provide.
Thanks,
Al
Last edited by ONeill202; Jun 30, 2017 at 05:52 PM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,989
Likes: 198
From: Meriden CT
Guys,
I'm at a complete loss at this point. I pulled my engine to repaint it and now I can't seem to get it to start. I've checked just about everything and still no luck. I called the timing chain manufacturer to make sure I had the right chain set and he said I did. I pulled the Pertronix ignitor-II and installed points today suspect it might be my problem and nothing. The dang motor turns but doesn't fire. I'd appreciate and help you guys can provide.
Thanks,
Al
I'm at a complete loss at this point. I pulled my engine to repaint it and now I can't seem to get it to start. I've checked just about everything and still no luck. I called the timing chain manufacturer to make sure I had the right chain set and he said I did. I pulled the Pertronix ignitor-II and installed points today suspect it might be my problem and nothing. The dang motor turns but doesn't fire. I'd appreciate and help you guys can provide.
Thanks,
Al
Last edited by SH-60B; Jun 30, 2017 at 05:50 PM.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 174
Likes: 6
From: McDonough Georgia
It sounds like you did more than just pull, paint, and replant. Maybe you missed a ground? But my suspicion is the pertronix What year is your car? Electronic distributors require a full 12 volts, a pre 76 doesn't have that in the factory harness. If you replaced the chain, there is a very specific relationship between the cam and crank. Did you follow those instructions to the letter?
I suspected the Pertronix as well and today I replaced it with the original points and still no luck.
Last edited by ONeill202; Jul 6, 2017 at 08:28 AM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 7,123
Likes: 433
From: Gladstone MO
C3 of Year Finalist (appearance mods) 2019
If you set the new timing chain and gears so the cam gear was at 6:00 and the crank gear was at 12:00, it's in the firing position for #6. If you dropped the distributor back in and set it for #1, it's 180* out. Been done before.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 174
Likes: 6
From: McDonough Georgia
You make a good point and yes the cam gear is set to 6 and the crank gear is set to 12, see pic. This is what I did to set the distributor. I turned the crank until I saw the intake valve on #1 open. I then continued to turn the crank until the TDC mark was at zero. At that point I reinstalled the distributor and had it pointing to #1. Did I make a mistake?
Last edited by ONeill202; Jun 30, 2017 at 06:17 PM.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 943
Likes: 73
You make a good point and yes the cam gear is set to 6 and the crank gear is set to 12, see pic. This is what I did to set the distributor. I turned the crank until I saw the intake valve on #1 open. I then continued to turn the crank until the TDC mark was at zero. At that point I reinstalled the distributor and had it pointing to #1. Did I make a mistake?
Drifting
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,697
Likes: 139
From: Syracuse NY
Go back to basics bud.
Air.
Fuel.
Spark.
Im betting you are 180 off. Pull your #1 plug and roll until you are TDC. If your rotor is anywhere near #1 plug wire, then you need to start looking at electrical. (Connections, grounds, etc)
Keep it simple. Its always simple. We get so hung up looking for complicate answers that we miss the simple stuff.
Air.
Fuel.
Spark.
Im betting you are 180 off. Pull your #1 plug and roll until you are TDC. If your rotor is anywhere near #1 plug wire, then you need to start looking at electrical. (Connections, grounds, etc)
Keep it simple. Its always simple. We get so hung up looking for complicate answers that we miss the simple stuff.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,837
Likes: 1,028
Go back to basics bud.
Air.
Fuel.
Spark.
Im betting you are 180 off. Pull your #1 plug and roll until you are TDC. If your rotor is anywhere near #1 plug wire, then you need to start looking at electrical. (Connections, grounds, etc)
Keep it simple. Its always simple. We get so hung up looking for complicate answers that we miss the simple stuff.
Air.
Fuel.
Spark.
Im betting you are 180 off. Pull your #1 plug and roll until you are TDC. If your rotor is anywhere near #1 plug wire, then you need to start looking at electrical. (Connections, grounds, etc)
Keep it simple. Its always simple. We get so hung up looking for complicate answers that we miss the simple stuff.
It ran before. Something not plugged in, etc.
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Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,160
Likes: 24
From: Prescott AZ
Is it getting spark?
That would be the first thing to check.
If so is it getting fuel?
If so the make sure the timing is set correctly, meaning the that the distributor rotor is pointing to number 1 on top dead center of the compression stroke.
That would be the first thing to check.
If so is it getting fuel?
If so the make sure the timing is set correctly, meaning the that the distributor rotor is pointing to number 1 on top dead center of the compression stroke.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 174
Likes: 6
From: McDonough Georgia
Yes, I even bought another coil just to be 100% the spark was strong and still nothing. I'm getting 9.5 volts during cranking at the coil and 6.5 volts when not being cranked.
If so is it getting fuel?
Yes...I poured plenty down the carb.
If so the make sure the timing is set correctly, meaning the that the distributor rotor is pointing to number 1 on top dead center of the compression stroke
It's pointing to number one and it's the compression stroke. I covered the #1 spark plug hole with my finger until the pressure pulled it off. That's where I have the distributor pointing to #1.
I hate to say that I'm giving up but after a week of trying -- I'm getting pretty close.
Last edited by ONeill202; Jul 1, 2017 at 01:40 PM.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 174
Likes: 6
From: McDonough Georgia
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 7,123
Likes: 433
From: Gladstone MO
C3 of Year Finalist (appearance mods) 2019
Giving up (on anything) is not really a good option.
Timing chain looks good per your picture, so that is off the table.
It's getting gas.
That leaves the initial timing. You removed #1 plug and bumped it over until it came up on compression and popped your finger out. Now go back and double check the rotor is pointing at the #1 tower on the cap and the plug wires are in the correct order. Cap and rotor on, pull a wire at a plug and crank- make sure you have spark at the plugs. Past that. it's time to start cranking and giving the distributor a little bump to advance the timing. It should fire- either a cylinder will fire normally or it'll pop back thru the carb.
Timing chain looks good per your picture, so that is off the table.
It's getting gas.
That leaves the initial timing. You removed #1 plug and bumped it over until it came up on compression and popped your finger out. Now go back and double check the rotor is pointing at the #1 tower on the cap and the plug wires are in the correct order. Cap and rotor on, pull a wire at a plug and crank- make sure you have spark at the plugs. Past that. it's time to start cranking and giving the distributor a little bump to advance the timing. It should fire- either a cylinder will fire normally or it'll pop back thru the carb.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 174
Likes: 6
From: McDonough Georgia
Giving up (on anything) is not really a good option.
Timing chain looks good per your picture, so that is off the table.
It's getting gas.
That leaves the initial timing. You removed #1 plug and bumped it over until it came up on compression and popped your finger out. Now go back and double check the rotor is pointing at the #1 tower on the cap and the plug wires are in the correct order. Cap and rotor on, pull a wire at a plug and crank- make sure you have spark at the plugs. Past that. it's time to start cranking and giving the distributor a little bump to advance the timing. It should fire- either a cylinder will fire normally or it'll pop back thru the carb.
Timing chain looks good per your picture, so that is off the table.
It's getting gas.
That leaves the initial timing. You removed #1 plug and bumped it over until it came up on compression and popped your finger out. Now go back and double check the rotor is pointing at the #1 tower on the cap and the plug wires are in the correct order. Cap and rotor on, pull a wire at a plug and crank- make sure you have spark at the plugs. Past that. it's time to start cranking and giving the distributor a little bump to advance the timing. It should fire- either a cylinder will fire normally or it'll pop back thru the carb.
Anyway -- still no luck... And you're right I can't give up.
Last edited by ONeill202; Jul 3, 2017 at 09:02 PM.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 174
Likes: 6
From: McDonough Georgia
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 7,123
Likes: 433
From: Gladstone MO
C3 of Year Finalist (appearance mods) 2019
Have you still got the points in it or did you swap back to the Pertronix? If points, is the dwell (point gap) close to spec? Good ground to both the breaker plate in the distributor and then that to ground? New points or old? Condenser good? You can check the point gap with a feeler gauge, I'd go with about .019 for a starting point. Make sure you wipe the feeler gauge down really well- any trace of oil on the points and they're dead.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 174
Likes: 6
From: McDonough Georgia
Have you still got the points in it or did you swap back to the Pertronix? If points, is the dwell (point gap) close to spec? Good ground to both the breaker plate in the distributor and then that to ground? New points or old? Condenser good? You can check the point gap with a feeler gauge, I'd go with about .019 for a starting point. Make sure you wipe the feeler gauge down really well- any trace of oil on the points and they're dead.
I installed new points, rotor and cap, but I can't check the gap. I bought the kind that has the condenser built in.
Had I known this was going to be a problem I would have bought the kind with the detached condenser.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 7,123
Likes: 433
From: Gladstone MO
C3 of Year Finalist (appearance mods) 2019
I may catch some flak for this-- Way back when I was working as a dealer tech- we had lots of problems with the uniset points. No start, running rough, missing, a long list. To the point there were not very many of us that were using them.
Try putting your Pertronix back in- nothing to lose at this point- and it was working?
Try putting your Pertronix back in- nothing to lose at this point- and it was working?
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 174
Likes: 6
From: McDonough Georgia
I may catch some flak for this-- Way back when I was working as a dealer tech- we had lots of problems with the uniset points. No start, running rough, missing, a long list. To the point there were not very many of us that were using them.
Try putting your Pertronix back in- nothing to lose at this point- and it was working?
Try putting your Pertronix back in- nothing to lose at this point- and it was working?